Felons And Black Powder
- Thread starter SteveBP
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lemaymiami
Member
Steve --- you'd be smart to find out what state law says about that...
The two legal sources (state, federal) aren't exactly complementary when it comes to firearms. Here in Florida I once lost a case involving a short barreled shotgun (some really, really nasty guy took a stolen L. C. Smith double and cut it down to 12"...). He got off since the gun was ruled an antique and not covered under Florida law. In my opinion the real crime was what was done to that fine shotgun...
The two legal sources (state, federal) aren't exactly complementary when it comes to firearms. Here in Florida I once lost a case involving a short barreled shotgun (some really, really nasty guy took a stolen L. C. Smith double and cut it down to 12"...). He got off since the gun was ruled an antique and not covered under Florida law. In my opinion the real crime was what was done to that fine shotgun...
230RN
2A was "political" when it was first adopted.
Owner at the BP store around here (see REFs) said a lot of ineligible people go into black powder and black powder hunting.
As I recall, there were some Federales noises a couple of years ago about serializing the conversion- to- fixed- ammunition revolver cylinders for various BP replicas and requiring 4473s for them. Don't know the upshot of that, but as far as I can tell, using (and maybe even possessing) conversion cylinders, serialized or not, makes the gun a "firearm" in the Federal legal sense. (See REFs.)
As mentioned, see local laws as well.
I was thinking of getting a stainless BP revolver as a hedge against the day when the Colorado Führerein at the State capitol declare more fun stuff illegal and pull a Pelosi on us. ("Mr. and Mrs. America, turn in your guns.")
But the recent elections here gave me hope that it won't happen for a while longer than I thought.
Updates on my recollections above are welcome.
ETA I was informed by Librarian that it was actually Dianne Feinstein who said that:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1_LaBJvI0BI&feature=player_detailpage
Thanks for the correction !
Terry, 230RN
REFs:
http://www.theblunderbuss.com/
http://www.buffaloarms.com/r_and_d_conversion_cylinders_pr-3787.aspx
As I recall, there were some Federales noises a couple of years ago about serializing the conversion- to- fixed- ammunition revolver cylinders for various BP replicas and requiring 4473s for them. Don't know the upshot of that, but as far as I can tell, using (and maybe even possessing) conversion cylinders, serialized or not, makes the gun a "firearm" in the Federal legal sense. (See REFs.)
As mentioned, see local laws as well.
I was thinking of getting a stainless BP revolver as a hedge against the day when the Colorado Führerein at the State capitol declare more fun stuff illegal and pull a Pelosi on us. ("Mr. and Mrs. America, turn in your guns.")
But the recent elections here gave me hope that it won't happen for a while longer than I thought.
Updates on my recollections above are welcome.
ETA I was informed by Librarian that it was actually Dianne Feinstein who said that:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1_LaBJvI0BI&feature=player_detailpage
Thanks for the correction !
Terry, 230RN
REFs:
http://www.theblunderbuss.com/
http://www.buffaloarms.com/r_and_d_conversion_cylinders_pr-3787.aspx
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denton
Member
Of course, there is no such thing as muzzle loader ammunition. Still, there was a case on the East Coast not too long ago where a felon was convicted of possessing ammunition because he had a ML and shooting supplies.
GarySTL
Member
I've heard that under some state's laws Felons can hunt with muzzle loaders, but not if they use shotgun primers for ignition as those are considered ammunition.
Jim Watson
Member
He could buy one, since there is no background check on muzzleloaders.
But if he carries it "for the purpose of going armed" it won't matter how it is loaded, he will be in hot water if apprehended.
But if he carries it "for the purpose of going armed" it won't matter how it is loaded, he will be in hot water if apprehended.
Arkansas Paul
Member
Here is a link to the ATF website with FAQs.
This topic is the first one.
http://www.atf.gov/files/firearms/industry/0501-firearms-top-10-qas.pdf
This topic is the first one.
http://www.atf.gov/files/firearms/industry/0501-firearms-top-10-qas.pdf
Very Carefully Check Your State Laws As Well As How They Deal With This.
The laws regarding this vary as well as the way they are interpreted from state to state.
For example in NY State due to a recent clarification in the law a felon cannot own any muzzleloaders. They actually added wording to the law specifically to address this which in my opinion is the right way since in order for laws to be obeyed they should be as clearly interpreted as possible.
In the state of Connecticut (state vs Zapadka) the judge actually made up his own law as he went along (Connecticut classifies muzzleloaders as non firearms.) and stuck Zapadka with a convicted felon possesion charge on the basis that he should have known a muzzleloader is considered a firearm when possesed by a convicted felon.
There is no such thing written anywhere in connecticut law but it was upheld on appeal. The judges did point out they disagreed with the federal interpretation of that law in regards to convicted felons.
This is sheer nonsense and I don't see any leechy lawers doing anything to upset their wealthy gravy train to correct this joke.
I have read that some states don't mind at all if felons possess muzzleloaders and as far as the federal government is concerned it is a non issue which also means they probably won't run a background check but you can still get in trouble if your State doesn't allow it.
Again thoroughly check how your State stands on this.
The laws regarding this vary as well as the way they are interpreted from state to state.
For example in NY State due to a recent clarification in the law a felon cannot own any muzzleloaders. They actually added wording to the law specifically to address this which in my opinion is the right way since in order for laws to be obeyed they should be as clearly interpreted as possible.
In the state of Connecticut (state vs Zapadka) the judge actually made up his own law as he went along (Connecticut classifies muzzleloaders as non firearms.) and stuck Zapadka with a convicted felon possesion charge on the basis that he should have known a muzzleloader is considered a firearm when possesed by a convicted felon.
There is no such thing written anywhere in connecticut law but it was upheld on appeal. The judges did point out they disagreed with the federal interpretation of that law in regards to convicted felons.
This is sheer nonsense and I don't see any leechy lawers doing anything to upset their wealthy gravy train to correct this joke.
I have read that some states don't mind at all if felons possess muzzleloaders and as far as the federal government is concerned it is a non issue which also means they probably won't run a background check but you can still get in trouble if your State doesn't allow it.
Again thoroughly check how your State stands on this.
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dprice3844444
member
each state is different,some allow possession of black powder weapons,some don't.also note,be careful of the classification of the type of black powder weapon you choose.it might be classified as a firearm.
I Ginseng Hunt and a lot of camping. I just want it with me for prptection from Bears and wild hogs.not to hunt just for protection.Thank you all for your advice and time.Where can i find a link for the state laws in TN on the matter.
dprice3844444
member
gamestalker
member
It also depends on any special restrictions the court may have placed on an individual.
I know of one particular individual, a neighbor I had at one time, who was restricted from possessing any weapons, black powder, archery, knives or other wise. He had been convicted of a federal crime. It involved violent circumstances, so the court issued an order of no weapons of any type to be in his possession.
And also, if a person is convicted and on probation or parole, their supervising officer can issue a no weapons of any type order, to include knives, black powder, or archery.
As for purchasing, anyone can walk into a sporting good store and purchase black powder weapons. Whether it complies with a court ordered restriction or not is another issue. But there isn't any current system, background check or other, that would prevent such a purchase from taking place.
GS
I know of one particular individual, a neighbor I had at one time, who was restricted from possessing any weapons, black powder, archery, knives or other wise. He had been convicted of a federal crime. It involved violent circumstances, so the court issued an order of no weapons of any type to be in his possession.
And also, if a person is convicted and on probation or parole, their supervising officer can issue a no weapons of any type order, to include knives, black powder, or archery.
As for purchasing, anyone can walk into a sporting good store and purchase black powder weapons. Whether it complies with a court ordered restriction or not is another issue. But there isn't any current system, background check or other, that would prevent such a purchase from taking place.
GS
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