FNH FiveseveN range report

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boofus

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I finally got some ammo for this puppy and got to take it out to the range.

The stuff I got was FN headstamped SS192 duty/training JHP ammo. The bullet is softpoint with hollow tip and supposedly won't penetrate kevlar vests making it legal for civilians to own. I managed to find a place that had some of this ammo for $17 for a box of 50. So it's roughly $0.35 a round, not cheap but not as bad as I thought it would be. Most places are charging $24/box so maybe I just lucked out and found a great deal. The muzzle velocity with this ammo is supposed to be 2100 fps, but pressure is still low to keep recoil at a minimum.

When fired the gun belches a huge ball of fire and is fairly loud to people off to the sides. The shell casings are ejected slightly forward, but with enough force to mangle the rims if they hit anything. I fired 90 rounds today and didn't collect a single one that wasn't mangled. So reloading this uncommon ammo might be a problem. The trigger is single action and fairly light, maybe 5 or 6 lbs. It isn't as good as the trigger on my P7 or Mark 23, or some of the better 1911s, but it isn't as terrible as those on Glocks. :neener:

At about 15 yards with no rest the gun is fairly accurate. When I was aiming I'd say the 5 shot groupings were about 2-2.5 inches wide. Followup shots were quick. Recoil was somewhere between a .22LR and 9mm, but still enough for you to miss the target if you just blaze away as fast as you can pull the trigger.

I had no failures to feed or eject, but on a few occasions the magazine failed to lock the slide back after it was empty. One time the magazine got jammed into the grip too. I think the slide catch didn't engage on the mag and instead wedged between the side of the magwell and the magazine itself. I had to bang on it pretty hard to make the mag come out. Hopefully these are just 'break-in' problems and will go away after a few rounds.

If the AWB goes away this might just be my carry weapon.

Pros:
20 round mags
Loaded weight of just over 1.5lbs
Almost completely polymer exterior will resist rusting from sweat
Oooh, aaaah, *** gun is that factor

Cons:
Expensive gun at $800+ a piece
Expensive ammo, lowest price I could find was $0.35 a round
Maybe my magazines are defective or the slide catch is out of spec. :cuss:
 
Well it never failed to go bang. If the mag issues are just teething problems it won't be an issue. If the problems keep up though I'm gonna give FN a call and bitch em out and try to get new mags. :scrutiny:
 
boofus-

I got one more 'con' for you:

What's the terminal performance of the SS192 round?

I agree it's got 'gee whiz!' written all over it, but I'd like to see some testing done on that round before I bet my life on it. Hopefully it will have better terminal ballistics than the original SS190.
 
I wouldn't mind being able to carry a 5-7... if I were also able to carry the original ammunition and fullsize mags for it legally.
 
if I were also able to carry the original ammunition
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But that's the problem. The original SS190 round was designed to defeat all soft body armor and even the new CRISAT Ti armor. Which is does nicely, with little recoil and a nice flat trajectory. But in tissue it's way too overpenetrative and creates almost no permanent wound cavity.

I gotta give FN some credit; they really tried to make a round that would pierce armor and have good terminal effects in tissue. Too bad they only got it half right. The P90 is a sweet platform and it deserves a better performing round.
 
The bullet is softpoint with hollow tip and supposedly won't penetrate kevlar vests making it legal for civilians to own.
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It's not legal because it doesn't penetrate kevlar, it's legal because it's not:

A projectile or projectile core which may be used in a handgun and which is constructed entirely (excluding the presence of traces of other substances) from one or a combination of tungsten alloys, steel, iron, brass, bronze, beryllium copper, or depleted uranium.
Click to expand...

-z
 
Terminal Ballistics?

Greetings,
I chronographed both the black tip LEO and the "civilian" ammo from the FiveseveN. 1975fps to 1990fps, both bullets are in the 33gn range.
Accuracy was on par with a Ruger 678 (outstanding!)
 
smithanswesson- accuracy and velocity are indeed excellent with the SS190; but the terminal performance of the round is lacking. Which is really unfortunate; when I was in the business we were the only West Coast LE distributor of FN product and had early dealer samples of the P90 and 5.7x28mm ammo. We had high hopes for the weapon system as an alternative to H&Ks dominance in the CQB field. Strangely enough we were also the local H&K LE dealer, so we had all our bases covered.

FN gave us all sorts of dealer promotional material re: the SS190 performance in tissue was outstanding, but in the end it really wasn't so.

The guys over at the Tactical Forums did extensive testing of the round is gelatin and the conclusion was what we were afraid of; great round for defeating armor. Sucky perfomance in simulated tissue.

I'll say it again; I *really* hope that they can develop a suitable round for the P90 because it's a sweet platform and shouldn't be kicked to the curb.
 
FN's story on the bullet is that they designed it with the CG well aft, so it would tumble in tissue -
which come to think of it reminds me of the early stories when the .223 came out -
I gather this plan didn't work out?

Perhaps tumbling would only happen if the twist was low enough that the bullet was understabilized, or marginally stable??

And I'm curious to see what loadings appear for this - do any commercial houses sell bullets yet, or do any standard bullets have the right diameter?

And will there ever be a semi-auto P90??

Thanks,
 
I certainly would never carry such a specialized weapon for SD. It was designed to defeat body armor and neutered of that capability it ain't much to crow about ballistically. You might as well be carrying an oversized and hot .25ACP.:scrutiny:
 
I am kind of at a loss to understand what this cartridge is all about.
If it's sole purpose is to poke ice pick like holes in body armor, it appearently does that, although it doesn't sound like it will do a whole lot to the guy wearing the body armor as far as quickly taking him out of the fight. I wonder how much gas a 33 grain bullet has after penetrating body armor ?
And the super high velocity is always touted. A velocity that can be easily obtained in a .357 revolver using a bullet over three times as heavy.
 
velocity that can be easily obtained in a .357 revolver
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Really? You can easily load up a 100 grain .357 round to over 1990 fps, from a handgun?

Someone needs to tell the ammo makers...:what:

Corbon, for instance, advertises:

357MAG 110gr JHP 1500fps/555ftlbs

and

Pow'Rball 357 Magnum 100gr Pow'Rball 1600fps/568ftlbs

Now, perhaps you meant to say something along the lines of, "One could load a .357 from a Ruger Redhawk or Blackhawk to at least 1990 fps per second." ?

How much do these platforms weigh? How much does the pistol in question weigh? How many rounds do these Rugers carry?

I have no doubt that a good .357 round will be more effective on most targets than the little FN pill from a handgun, but let's at least make reasonable assertions, here.

John
 
John:
Here is a link to the Alliant Powder website that provides loading data for their powders. The particular page I linked to is the .357 Magnum cartridge using a 110 grain JHP. Note the bottom load using Blue Dot powder. They list a muzzle velocity of 2040 fps. I have personally loaded many of these and have chronoed them out of a 6 1/2 inch Blackhawk. The velocities I got were very close to what is advertised although it was slightly lower; right around 2000 fps. Note also that the pressue listed for this load is within the industry standard for the cartridge and in fact is not even the highest pressue load listed.

Keep in mind that I am not trying to compare these two cartridges directly. I am only pointing out that velocities in this range are not all that impressive; especially when you consider that the bullet only weighs 33 grains.
 
Thanks- you forgot the link, though!

Note also that the pressue listed for this load is within the industry standard
Click to expand...

Is any maker loading up to these specs? I'm going to start loading eventually, but I wouldn't mind getting some light/ super fast loads in the meantime.
 
:banghead:

http://recipes.alliantpowder.com/rg...=.357&cartridgedescr=Mag.&bulletdescr=110 JHP

I don't know if any factory load runs this fast or not. I noticed this one day when I was trying to find a load for coyote calling. The .357 110 grain bullet seemed like a good choice. It turned out to be very effective for that purpose. I never really experimented with any of this stuff. I used that load, with a Remington bulk bullet from Midway. I bought 1000 of them. I have shot this load out of a number of .357 guns including some 2" versions but I never chronoed them from anything other than the Blackhawk. This load would be perfectly safe to fire out of any modern .357 revolver although I am sure it would accelerate wear. I have read that there are problems with flame cutting when using light/hot loads in the .357. I never shot enough of them to worry about it.
 
While the round is no .223 or even 10mm JHP, it is respectable enough in it's own right. Hardly ".25ACP" as one of you claimed.

The SS190 has over 340lb/ft of muzzle energy. This is square into 9mm Para energy levels.

Here is a gelatin test of the AP round (sadly, no measurment tape, but assume the low side of 11" of penetration.) Though the bullet remained intact, it did yaw in media 180* like all rifle-type rounds will.

spring2003experienceswiththefnp90.jpg



I don't know about you, but that appearing in me would give me a majorly bad day.

Especially with a 20 round magazine, I would carry this gun withought hesitation.


Oh, also, don't make the misconception that the Copper/aluminum 'practice' rounds will not penetrate soft body armor. Supposedly they will perforate IIa and some III vests. They are just not 'designed to'.
 
I'm thinking iwannacoolgun written all over this. I'd trust my life to 17 rds of 127 gr Ranger STX out of a Glock 17 or 7 rds of 230 gr. federal hydra-shock out of a 1911 any day before trusting 100 rds of 33 gr. loaded at anything less than 3000 fps.

atek3
 
artherd you have a larger possibly high-res copy of that pic somewhere? or a link to where you got it?

b/c to My eyes it sure looks like, there IS a measuring tape (or stick) in front of that gelatin block (I Think the unfired round in the pic is sitting ON the yardstick...)
 
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