Found some more 'vintage' reloading stuff... need info

[1KPerDay]

I first posted about my inherited stuff here http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=468038

Thought some of you graybeards might like to see this stuff.

I found another box with some interesting stuff in it, particularly since I'm finally gearing up to reload now.

An old Redding powder measure, looks unused/new. I'm happy about this in particular.



A redding scale, looks unused but the v notches have rusted. You think I could brush them off with some steel wool or a brass brush and it would be fine, or is this buggered beyond usefulness?



Some old RCBS dies for .45 ACP. from what I can tell, there are 2 sizing dies... one feels like aluminum and has a larger ID.





I assume that was a decapping/interior sizing die and the other sized the OD? Does that make any sense? I can't believe they made them from aluminum but that's what it feels like. The screw/pin is steel, but the outer die is aluminum I think. Weird.

Also some Lyman .38/.357 dies (which I need) and some .30-06 dies (which I may need; I have the lee deluxe dies in that caliber already.






I realize I'll have to lube my pistol brass if I use these (I was kinda planning to anyway, at least to start out), but otherwise, any reason I shouldn't use them? They haven't changed something drastic since the mid/late 60s in die design or function have they?


Some more lyman molds and handles, some lubrisizer dies .452, 457, .357, ... some gas checks and lube for the lubrisizer. think the lube will still be good?




Also this primitive set to remove military primer crimps. This should come in handy. If it works well. Anyone heard of this before?

 

[Walkalong]

An old Redding powder measure, looks unused/new. I'm happy about this in particular.

I would be as well.

Too bad the scale is rusted where it is. You can always clean it up carefully and try it out using some check weights to verify things. Good luck with it.

Are the Lyman .38 dies steel? You could always buy a cheap Lee carbide sizer to go with them.

 

[rfwobbly]

Wow did you ever hit the Jack Pot !!

Redding is still in business today and you can look up the current price of their powder measure on the web. I assure you, that is a top-of-the-line measure which you will never outgrow.

The Redding scale is the same thing. Body by Redding, balance beam by Ohaus. The V-grooves will need to be cleaned and polished, but that's an excellent scale. You can't buy a better scale.

Use the dies. Those are name brand dies which you can use or swap for the calibers you need. Spray a little oil on them and they're as good as new. The third RCBS die might be a taper crimp die. Nothing wrong with those dies.

 

[donny640]

I also inherited the same powder measure and scale from my father inlaw. They both work great.

 

[noylj]

Back before progressive presses, an RCBS 3-die set consisted of a steel sizing die, an expander/decapper die, and a seater/crimp die.

 

[ranger335v]

I'm not familar with that specific scale but I wonder the vee blocks are actually rusty steel. Most of those old scales had bearing blocks cut from stone, agate was common in that era; see if you can''t clean them out with alcohol and a pointed tooth pick. Even if it works okay, what is going to agrivate you most about it is that it has no dampening so it will swing a lot before settling down. Newer scales have magnetic dampening that usually stops the beam in 2-3 swings.

That measure is as good as they come, mine was bought in '65 and has had more than a few pounds of powder through it and it's still as good as ever. Well, the once clear hopper tube is discolored because I left powder in it overnight a few times; don't do that!

Your dies are fine, if anything has changed since that period it's been the wrong way. Unless you load large volumes of loading for handguns a carbide sizer wouldn't do you a lot of good and the older steel sizers actually helped cases last a bit longer.

The cast bullet lube will be okay too; it's mostly a wax, graphite and a bit of grease to soften it but most of us got away from that formula when the NRA "discovered" the 50:50 mix of beeswax and Alox in the mid-60s.

Next thing you need get is a loading manual with good beginner instructions, that will help you identify your dies quite well. Suggest a Lyman, Lee or Hornady for really good illustrations and well written instructions.

 

[1KPerDay]

I have a couple of manuals and the ABCs of reloading. I'll get more manuals also. Thanks for the info and advice. :Cool:

 

[cfullgraf]

I first posted about my inherited stuff here http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=468038


Some old RCBS dies for .45 ACP. from what I can tell, there are 2 sizing dies... one feels like aluminum and has a larger ID.

Cool stuff.

Somewhere around the late seventies, RCBS began transitioning to having the decapper in the sizing die. I have a 45 Colt set dated '78 with the decapper in the expander die. I have a 45 ACP set that predates the Colt dies and a 38 Special set that post dates the Colt dies that have the decapper in the resize die.

This all predates the current crop of progressives but not the Star, C-H or the RCBS Green Machine. The Green Machine was not like any progressive on the market today.

Your sizer die should have the year of manufacture stamped in the die with the other markings.

 

[35 Whelen]

Good, quality stuff!! The only problem I see might be with the scales. I've no doubt the rust can be brushed off, but it appears to be an undampered type scale. They work fine, but they're a little aggravating as they take longer to center. In other words they when you weigh a powder charge, the beam tends to teeter up and down for a longer period of time as oppossed to a magnetically dampered scale. That being said, Redding has always made super high quality equipment.
The dies all look good. I wouldn't worry about using the old cast bullet lube as bullet lube is really cheap, or for that matter EASY to make at home.
Can't see all the boxes of the moulds, but the one I can see (457191) is a mould designed for .45 caliber rifles. That mould will cast a bullet in the .459" range and with wheelweights will weigh around 300 grs.

35W

 

[1KPerDay]

Thanks. The molds are marked with the type/diameter on the bottom. I have emailed Redding just out of curiosity whether they have any recommendations on how to properly clean that area of the scale or if they think it is beyond repair.

Somewhere around the late seventies, RCBS began transitioning to having the decapper in the sizing die. I have a 45 Colt set dated '78 with the decapper in the expander die. I have a 45 ACP set that predates the Colt dies and a 38 Special set that post dates the Colt dies that have the decapper in the resize die.

Yeah, these are marked 68. The sizer die is hollow but the top is threaded. I was trying to figure out if could remove the decapper/expander ball from the aluminum die (which isn't marked with any marks at all (other than the top of the screw/pin assembly) and install it in the sizer die, but logically that doesn't make sense, does it?

I can't size at the same time I'm expanding. And in this case it appears that the depriming pin has a large bulb above it and from reading the very confusing directions included, it seems that was intended to bell the case mouth slightly when at full stroke for depriming.

So from what I can determine, this particular setup intended for the user to first:
1. size
2. deprime and bell case mouth
3. seat and maybe crimp depending on the adjustment.

1 and 2 are reversed from current setups, but I suppose it would work just as well, right?
This is more of a curiosity as I have a 4-die Lee set for .45 ACP that I'm sure will work well. But it is fascinating to see how different people solved problems in different ways over the years.

 

[Lost Sheep]

Ditto what ranger335v said on the scale

I'm not familar with that specific scale but I wonder the vee blocks are actually rusty steel. Most of those old scales had bearing blocks cut from stone, agate was common in that era; see if you can''t clean them out with alcohol and a pointed tooth pick. Even if it works okay, what is going to agrivate you most about it is that it has no dampening so it will swing a lot before settling down. Newer scales have magnetic dampening that usually stops the beam in 2-3 swings.

DO NOT try to clean the v-notches with abrasives. The bottoms of the notches should be sharp (as should the blades that fit in them, also).

If you feel you must use a wire brush to remove stubborn rust (if the v-notches are made of tool steel), pull out a single strand and use that. From a brass brush, preferably. But try a wooden or plastic pointed-tip toothpick first.

If the notches are steel, you may feel the urge to protect them with a little oil. If you do, be aware that the oil may interfere with the reliability of the scale's return to zero. If you must, use the thinnest oil you can and clean it out with a Q-tip and solvent regularly so you don't build up the gum of dried-up oil.

Redding would probably be able to identify the material and provide replacements if appropriate, so I totally agree with your assessment in your third post.

I note that the scale is not all that old, as the instruction sheet clears refers to magnetic dampening. I have a set of Lyman 38/357 dies exactly like yours that would still be in use except that I have switched to the Lee dies (the powder-through die is just too convenient to pass up).

Congratulations and good luck.

Lost Sheep

 

[ranger335v]

Lost: "I note that the scale is not all that old, as the instruction sheet clears refers to magnetic dampening."

Good eye. I just looked at the casting's left end, saw no slot for the copper vane and concluded it isn't damped. But, not only does the instruction sheel say it is mag damped we can see the back side of the copper vane on the beam; that is ONLY useful for mag dampening. Now, if you can get the Vee bearings cleaned or replaced you are in great shape for a scale!

 

[bloominonion]

I have that exact scale and powder measure, just not green. It is fantastic.

I also found out that scale can be oil damped. There may be a paddle sticking off the beam at the v-notch. If so, it is oil damped, and you can fill that reservoir with oil.

 

[1KPerDay]

Heard back from Redding...

My email to redding:

Hi,
I found some reloading equipment my dad left me, including a Redding #3 powder measure and a #1 scale. The powder measure looks perfect but the V-notches on the scale have rusted despite its never being used from what I can see. Do you have any advice on the proper cleaning of this area or is the scale unusable now?

For photos, see here:

http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=578970&p=7144672#post7144672

Thanks for any information you can provide. And congrats on being in business so long. You have an absolutely stellar reputation in the reloading community as you are certainly aware.

Best regards,

Redding's response FYI

On the last page of our catalog we offer a clean and re-calibration for your scale the cost s $16.20 plus 6.00 shipping. This will assure that the scale is in as new condition as you use it.f you were weigihing anything but powder a self clean might be OK but this is that extra margin of safety

Robin XXXX

Executive Vice President

 

[Walkalong]

Sounds like the way to go.

 

[1KPerDay]

Turns out you were correct, bloomin'; it's oil damped. The instructions say 30W but that seems a bit heavy to me... I've read elsewhere about people using mineral oil. Anyone here have an oil-damped scale and can tell me what you use?

I carefully cleaned out the v-blocks with an old brass shotgun bore brush, and there's no pitting that I can see. It cleaned up nicely. The v-notches are simply raw steel. I think it's in good useable condition as it's measuring within a tenth of a grain of my sort of beat-up 5-10 and my cheapo electronic. But I definitely need to get some oil in the reservoir.

The measuring system isn't as convenient as the 5-10 with the rotary dial thing for the tenths, and I want to triple check I'm reading it correctly... this says 46.8 grains, right?

 

[kingmt]

"this says 46.8 grains, right?"

That would be my best guess.

 

[Walkalong]

Yep, 46.8 Grs. I would not worry too much about what oil I used. It will settle down sooner or later even without oil. If it is too slow to settle down, try a heavier weight oil. I would think too light would be better than too heavy.

 

[1KPerDay]

Thanks. I've been using it without oil for the past 50 rounds and I have to hold my breath.

It seems very accurate.

 

[Jim Watson]

The powder measure is fine for rifle loads. I never got mine to deliver pistol charges satisfactorily, even with the "pistol chamber."

The dies are good for expanding/flaring and seating. You will soon get tired of lubing and degreasing pistol brass for resizing and be in the market for carbide sizers. Lee is ok and costs less; no reason not to mix and match die brands.

I would not trust a balance beam scale that had that much rust on the bearings even if well cleaned.

I would not fool with oil damping on a balance. For rough weighing like gunpowder, just note that the pointer swings equally above and below the zero mark when the weight is correct. You could learn how much the center of swing is off per tenth of a grain for stuff like measure adjustment. There used to be a whole technique of "counting swings" on undamped laboratory balances working to the fraction of a milligram but that should not be necessary for handloading.

 

[johnclark]

Sweet hookup. Looks like quality gear! =)

 

[1KPerDay]

I would not trust a balance beam scale that had that much rust on the bearings even if well cleaned.

I understand your concern. However the rust is gone, the surfaces are clean, and I've double-checking every charge I weigh on another scale to be safe. It's always exactly the same or maybe a tenth off max, over all the weight ranges I've tried so far. If anything it's more consistent than my 5-10. If I had to choose one to keep today I'd pick the Redding.

The powder measure is throwing pretty consistent charges of H4895... I'd estimate about a third of a grain variation max (I'm trickling up to the exact weight on these). I can feel it cutting the powder sometimes though, but I guess that's to be expected.

 

[lightman]

I started off with a oil dampened Herters scale that looks like yours,and probably made by Redding.I found the oil to be a pain,and discovered that it worked fine without it.Thin oil,like machine oil,did seem to work best.As another poster said,you can learn to read it on the swing,it does not have to stop every time.If anything you did to your scale while cleaning caused it to be off,it still should be consistant.By the way,nice find. Lightman