Friend who doesn't "need" a gun

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Hello everyone

I have a bit of a problem. Recently I hung out with an old freind from highschool, I graduated in 99 so it wasn't that long ago. But its clear than living in a liberal bastion(Portland Maine) for a few years has affected him.
My freind never owned a firearm, hunted, or was a competitive shooter so he wasn't a major firearms advocate like myself. However he knew I had several firearms and that I had just graduated from gunsmithing school. Anway we where talking and the topic of firearms arose as it always does when i'm in the company of my freinds. So I asked him do you own a firearm and he says "no, why would I? why would I need a gun." I did something I shouldn't have, I over reacted and I got kind of upset. I calmed down and I explained to him that because he lives in a city (the biggest in the state) that he likely "needs" one more than me, but that percieved need is not even the point. The fact that its your right to bear arms and right to self defense is perhaps the oldest law known to man. I also pointed out that firearms aren't just for defense against criminals but from government tyranny. He didn't think we the people could ever compete with the government, but if things got really bad, he would steal a gun if he had too! He is also a self styled writer and wants to be on the new york best sellers list. My question is , is he to far gone to save? I always thought he was an intellagent man and I respected him but now not so much. Also he informed me that he wants to move to boston to futher his writing career. Possibly the worst place in the east that he could move if he cares about his rights.

He did at least say he would go shooting with me, but that he would still probably not own a firearm, because he lives in a college dorm and that they aren't allow there. That and he still doesn't think he needs one.

So as you can imagine, this sadens me to some degree but Id like to try to turn him around. On a positive not my other freind who never had any firearms is totally into the idea of shooting and owning arms. I am thinking about sending a copy of the 2nd ammendment primer to my writer freind because he thinks he is very much an intellectual and acts as if he is a literary scholar. I thought this book might help even though it is a primer it is not at all simplified for the average reader.

Sorry to write so much on one post but im kinda uncertain as what to do.
I wish now also that I hadn't over reacted.

Brother in Arms
 
Your friend has yet to experience a situ where he or someone close to him wished they had a gun for protection. He may go the rest of his life this way. My dad, who's been around firearms his entire life went and got a ccw permit after a very bad experience. He swore he'd never get caught in that situation unarmed again...... and he hasn't.
 
Two more good books to read are:
Nation of Cowards by Jeff Snyder
Dial 911 and Die by Richard W. Stevens
 
re:

Kaylee said:
Take him shooting, make it fun, answer questions, don't preach.

Nothing will turn a person off like being preached at.

Ditto. I've converted more fence-sitters and "I don;t need a gun" types by just takin'em to the range. Almost without exception, the comment is:
"Wow! That was fun!" A few bummed repeat trips and ammo, but several went for it and are now avid shooters.
 
Kaylee said:
Take him shooting, make it fun, answer questions, don't preach.

Nothing will turn a person off like being preached at.

Tritto?
I'm working on my "Anti" little sister with this method as we speak. I'm taking her shooting when she visits in a few months. :D
 
thanks everyone
at least he said he would go shooting and he doens't think its bad for me or anyone else to own firearms. I regret that I over reacted when he and I talked about it in the first place. Guess he and I will have to break out some 7.62x39mm.

Brother in Arms
 
Get your friend on the range. Use a gun that's easy to shoot and aim and doesn't have a lot of recoil. Shoot at close range, 12' or so to start. Once he gets a good whiff of cordite, hears the delightful sounds and finds himself making holes in a target where he wants them to be, he is likely be in a mood to reexamine his opinions about guns without having to be prodded.

Remember, you can't win them all over. But fun usually wins more converts than fear!

--Herself
 
A gun is sort of like a fire extinguisher. You may never need one, but chances are that if you do, you’ll need it bad… :scrutiny:
 
A few years ago, my younger sister was adamantly against gun ownership. I tried to discuss my interest in having firearms for sport and protection, as un-emotionally as possible, but to no avail. Then, on one particular evening, her doorbell rang (she was divorced and living alone at the time). A gentleman was outside her door and requested entry to check her "Comcast connection". She was immediately suspicious...she tried to close the door...but he placed his foot onto the threshold...so she slammed her foot onto his and was able to close/lock the door completely...then she callled 911. Later that evening, she called me. She was crying and scared. I came over to calm her. Within a week, she and I were at a local range where she had the opportunity to try several of my handguns. She enjoyed one .357 magnum in particular. I told her to get an FOID, as required the state we lived in. She did. Once obtained, I gave her the .357.

She has it to this day. Now re-married, her new husband (a wonderful guy) is interested in learning to shoot handguns. He has hunted with long arms, but has never had much interest in hand guns. I'm looking forward to future range visits with them both.

I guess it comes down to this...if you believe that your life, or the lives of those you love, will NEVER be threatened, then please...go about your lives and God bless......

But if you happen to pick up the occassional newspaper, or watch the occasional 6:00 news, then I would respectfully suggest that you consider the possibility of being victimized, and make a choice as to whether you'll go quietly into that good night, or not.
 
Brother in Arms said:
I did something I shouldn't have, I over reacted and I got kind of upset.

Then you did a second thing wrong, you tried to continue and make your argument. When you loose your cool you've lost that chance to present your position and have it be accepted. You'd have to have the debate/theatrical skill of a master to recover from that type of start so it's best not to try.

Leave your buddy alone. Read the "how do I argue with an anti/mom/gf" threads here and prepare your argument for next time (like when you take him shooting) when you won't turn him off. That's your opportunity, but don't blow it by pushing your agenda. Teach him the safety rules, let him see that guns don't jump up and shoot people on their own, let him have fun. He's still not likely to be swayed, but if you then provide him a good body of lit and fact to approach as a writer you may be able to tie his interests in with ours.
 
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I hear you, my little bro is going to college in Pittsburg and had been mugged a couple of times, losing only a couple of bucks each time, him being poor and all, he enjoys shooting my guns when hes home, but i don't think he is interested in owning any. growing up he didn't want anything to do with my guns, but once I picked up my carbine he showed interest, I think because of the lack of recoil, unlike my 12 gauges. hes since shot my savage .308 and my 1911, he didn't care for the savage, but he loves the 1911, can't blame him there:D take your friend to the range with something fun to shoot, he'll change his mind.
 
First off, not everyone can be or needs to be "converted". Enough of that going around lately and there comes a time you just have to let people be. You'll never convince him of anything without understanding his point of view, and it is obvious that you do not. The good lord didn't make everyone a gun person just like he didn't make them all one size, shape and color. Permit your friend to be himself before anything else. You're both young and will see things differently as time goes by. I am painfully aware of a young person's need to be right all the time and have everyone in agreement with everything he or she says. And if you look around the net you'll find plenty of folks who've never grow out of thinking they're 100% correct 100% of the time. Life isn't like that. We learn more by disagreeing than agreeing as long as we truly listen and cut back on the speechifying done "for their own good".

I've personally known plenty of folks who've come around to the gunners lifestyle later in life. So don't give up all hope. With anyone. But the worst thing you can do is press an issue. Took me longer than you've been alive to get an old and dear friend to go shooting. And it was worth the wait.

But I don't care WHAT he says because I'm simply not going to pack up the family to go see Brokeback Mountain with him. Cowboys or no cowboys.

all the best

Bob
 
Old Fuff said:
A gun is sort of like a fire extinguisher. You may never need one, but chances are that if you do, you’ll need it bad… :scrutiny:
[blush]:eek: I used that line for about six months before I realized that I didn't have a fire extinguisher!
It did spur to get one. Duh!

--Herself
 
The fact that its your right to bear arms
It is also your right to choose not to exercise this right.
You are no more right to try to convert him to your way of thinking than he is to convert you to his.

Take him shooting if he wants to. He'll either like it or not, he'll take it from there
 
Seriously, there are few people who actually "need" a gun, myself included. I want one (heck, I want lots of them) but I don't really need one. I'm 52 years old and have never been attacked, robbed or been the victim of any type of crime except for a couple of car burglaries. (I spent nearly 15 years cleaning up the aftermath of crime, so I'm under no delusions that we all live in a warm and fuzzy world.) Fortunately, in this country, if I want a gun "just in case," I can have one.

Your friend is probably telling the truth when he says he doesn't need a gun, so I wouldn't try to change his mind. Better to take him shooting, expose him to the fun side of gun ownership and hope he reaches the point of wanting to own a gun.
 
Kaylee said:
Take him shooting, make it fun, answer questions, don't preach.

Nothing will turn a person off like being preached at.

that is good advice , I would go with that
 
Kaylee said:
Take him shooting, make it fun, answer questions, don't preach.

Nothing will turn a person off like being preached at.

Great advice that applies to many situations especially that last part.
 
Leave him alone. If he wants to go shooting bring him. If he decides he doesn't need a gun, then he doesn't.

Look at it from the gun control perspective.

The anti-gunners think they know more than we do, and therefore should be able to dictate how we live, and what we can own. Who the hell are they to tell us how to live?

Who the hell are you to tell your friend how to live?
 
Brother in Arms said:
My question is , is he to far gone to save? I always thought he was an intellagent man and I respected him but now not so much. Also he informed me that he wants to move to boston to futher his writing career. Possibly the worst place in the east that he could move if he cares about his rights.

I'm a gun hobbyist and have many friends who are not into guns, some anti-gun folks, too, who might surprise you as being otherwise intelligent and well-educated. My sister is like that, and I acknowledge it's frustrating, but I still manage to keep a civil front, and she has other positive aspects about her. I find I'm able to respect such people (not all of them) despite their obvious inadequacies and some do have other redeeming qualities. It's really quite possible IMHO.

I think it's possible to make friends with people who don't necessarily share your basic principles. I know that might be difficult to interact with people of different views and principles as your own, but on the other hand, society is full of a variety of people of disparate views and it might be beneficial to see how they and others of similar ilk think.

Brother in Arms said:
So as you can imagine, this sadens me to some degree but Id like to try to turn him around.
Brother in Arms

I understand your thinking. You can educate someone, but only if they want. If you're not successful, you can leave them as friends if you can't stand their ignorance. There are many people you can find who believe as you do and behaves the same way, although I understand your consternation from the personal history you have with someone.
 
very interesting advice everyone.... Exstremely humbling.


I was thinking about your responses HSO's in particular,
Oddly enough, after I lost my cool with him is when he said he would go shooting with me. So I have to give him credit for that, many people would just have washed there hands of the situation. We continued to discuss it at some length after I got upset. I think the biggest problem was me, I wasn't expecting his response. It was not like most I have seen. He was not anti. He said "I don't need a gun" not that I didn't or shouldn't have one or anyone else for that matter. I think I over reacted because I thought he was going to say no one should have guns. So I got confrontational before I understood his position. I think the other problem I had was fear . Fear that a person I had been good freinds with and spent time with could not be my good freind anymore. I know this may seem like a Niav'e way of thinking but I can only say the people I know who are anti-gun, even those I have known all my life I have a hard time remaining freinds with or being the same kind of freinds I was with them before I knew how they felt. They end up becoming aqauintances more than anything else. I think that is what I was afraid of happening with this fellow. Feeling like I might not want to know him anymore. Also the fact and he has become rather pretencious and cityafied also bothered me. I guess all people change. The other thing that hurt was that he wanted to move away from the state to massachusetts and that upset me also as I greatly dislike it there and see it more or less as an enemy of my state.

perhaps I can make things better,by taking him shooting and talking to him more about the situation. Have fun like we used to in highschool, and see what things are all about with him these days.

thanks for the advice everyone,I usually handle myself better than that.

Brother in Arms
 
First, We The People ARE the government. The fact that we forget that so often nowdays is part of the problem with that.
 
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