Glock 17 Question: Dirty gun problem?

[Jenrick]

In my quest to find the weapon I'll be carrying during the academy and beyond I've been trying alot of differnt pistols. One of them was a G17, that was fantastically dirty. Now I know that Glocks are supposed to be able to work just fine uncleaned for thousands of rounds with out any problems. My personal G22 has never had any problems, and I don't clean it more often then every hundred or two rounds.

The G17 I rented would do the following (in no particular order):
Fail to lock the slide back at the end of the mag
Fail to chamber a round after firing, the round would eject and the slide would appear to fully cycle, but round in the mag would nose dive into the feed ramp.
Failure to extract
Double feed
Stovepipe

Got a malf/failure on pretty much every round after the first 10.

My question is: Does the lighter recoil of the 9mm cartridge mean that the weapon must be kept cleaner then a Glock chamber in larger caliber? Or did I just managed to find a bad pistol to rent? Is the amount of accumulated gunk in the weapon keeping it from working properly due to the smaller cartridge, or would I have found the same thing in a similarly dirty G21/22?

Thanks for your time,
-Jenrick

 

[Rob1035]

I think you found the one bad Glock 17 in existence

From everything I have seen and read, the 9mm glocks are the most reliable. Since glocks on the whole are pretty reliable, that is saying a lot. Safe bet is the rental gun has some sort of defect or damage.

What kind of mags?

 

[raghorn]

I've never had a single malfunction with my G17 after 200+ rounds. It's not my primary piece, but it's always been rock-steady reliable. I think you found a lemon.

 

[Boss Spearman]

The belief that a Glock will function for that many rounds without being cleaned is a myth. I have gotten them at rentals where they were filfthy and they would not function correctly. Cleaning them solved all issues.

 

[HSMITH]

Sounds like weak mag springs and a filthy gun stacking up to become terribly unreliable.

You would see the same thing on pretty much every model of Glock.

 

[Jenrick]

10 rounders. Okay spring in it.

Favorite part of the day was when I handed it back to the rental guy and told him all the problems I was having. He reaches down under the counter, and pulls out a 17 rd'er with a +2 base loaded up with gold dots and says he'll check it out. Of course it runs through the whole mag fine. Oh well not gun, not my problem.

I was mainly just curious if the weaker recoil impulse meant the action would be more sensetive to dirt.

-Jenrick

 

[Moonclip]

What kind of ammo were you firing? I bet it was some sort of sub par weak range reloads that did not help in the reliability department.

 

[Darth Ruger]

Favorite part of the day was when I handed it back to the rental guy and told him all the problems I was having. He reaches down under the counter, and pulls out a 17 rd'er with a +2 base loaded up with gold dots and says he'll check it out. Of course it runs through the whole mag fine.

There ya go. A new mag solved the problem.

You said you used 10-rounders in a G17, but the range guy tested it with a full-capacity G17 magazine. I've heard those reduced capacity "Clinton-mags" (the kind you rented) can cause problems in Glocks designed for higher capacity.

Also, keep in mind that the rental mags are worn extensively. Thousands of rounds per month. On a busy Saturday, for example, if the gun/mag is rented out five times during the course of the day, and each person/group that rents it shoots 200 rounds with it, that's 1,000 rounds right there. Many 9mm Glocks are rented out more than five times a day on busy weekends, and there's no telling how many rounds each person/group puts through it. The magazines probably aren't disassembled and cleaned much, if at all. That much use means they will get dirty inside pretty quickly, and a well-aimed rock is more reliable than a dirty mag. I'm sure the range guys keep a newer magazine or two for testing guns when customers complain about functioning problems, but they won't give you the good magazine when you rent the gun. You get the old, dirty mag.

Junk range-reloads, on the other hand, may cause problems. That's why I don't waste my money on it. I prefer factory FMJ loads. Costs a little more, but my G26 has no reliability problems when being fed a variety of different brands (I sometimes use range ammo in revolvers, but not semi-autos). The fact that it's a 9mm has nothing to do with it. A gun of any caliber will jam if it's dirty enough. Use decent quality ammo in a clean gun and a clean full-capacity magazine, and you shouldn't have any problems.

I know because I looked it up on Google.

 

[Onmilo]

Glock 10 shot "Klinton' magazines are well known to cause problems.
This isn't an issue with the model 26/27 mini guns, just the bigger pistols.
Use standard capacity magazines and treasure them for what they are, the original design of a genius.

 

[Jenrick]

Good point about the under powered range ammo. I've honestly wondered if sometimes it's not just a primer and a buller with no powder in the there.

-Jenrick

 

[Island Beretta]

Its a Glock, there couldnt anything wrong with it!! Check your grip, wrist lock, how you stand, the clothes you are wearing, the shoes you have on, anything but the gun

 

[dasmi]

The G17 I rented

That's your problem right there. It's a neglected, abused rental gun.

 

[Fido]

Its a myth that Glocks or any firearms for that matter will continue to run without basic maintainance. Glocks are better than most in this regard but still require cleaning and lubrication.
When you take a poorly maintained firearm and add in other factors, ie non factory magazines the results will be predictable. The gun wont run. Glocks should be cleaned and lubricated after every use (as should all firearms).

 

[fastbolt]

HSMITH posted ... Sounds like weak mag springs and a filthy gun stacking up to become terribly unreliable.

You would see the same thing on pretty much every model of Glock.

I agree, with the additional thoughts that it may have also been related to some small degree by any potential shooter-induced issue (grip technique with the lesser recoiling 9mm cartridge, siunce you're accustomed to the harder recoiling .40 S&W, according to your post), as well as any potential ammunition-related issues (some lower powered 9mm ammunition can exacerbate the potential problems created by other issues).

The only G17 I ever "rented" (in the late 80's, when Glocks were still new)exhibited some problems similar to what you described. It was admittedly a well-used range pistol at that public range ... the fellow claimed the pistol had already been fired more than 135K rounds by the time I rented it, and only a trigger spring had been broken and replaced ... which would account for the well-aged recoil & 'then normal' (high) magazine springs being potentially involved in the problems I experienced. The ammunition was new W-W 115gr STHP's I had purchased at that range, too.

A well maintained pistol (clean & properly lubricated), loaded with quality new factory ammunition, helps ensure optimal, reliable functioning ...

I think the .40 S&W Glocks offer enough increased slide velocity to help provide for reliable functioning in some user's/shooter's hands, compared to the lesser recoiling 9mm & .45 ACP caliber Glocks. A balance of slide mass/velocity and grip frame stability related to grip technique, if you will.

For example, I once watched a female shooter consistently experience 'limp-wrist' feeding malfunctions when shooting a G21 with 230gr ammunition, 1-handed ... but a G22 loaded with 180gr ammunition functioned just fine for her under the same conditions (same range session). The G21 functioned just fine for everyone else, myself included, using the same ammunition.

Did you ask the fellow if he could clean & lubricate the G17, and lend you another magazine? Your experience might've been different under other circumstances ...

Personally, I always lean toward clean & properly lubricated pistols, as well as periodic replacement of magazine & recoil springs (which varies according to the design/size of platform/caliber), in any pistols I use for defensive purposes ...

 

[Darth Ruger]

Its a Glock, there couldnt anything wrong with it!! Check your grip, wrist lock, how you stand, the clothes you are wearing, the shoes you have on, anything but the gun

I don't think any of the pro-Glock people here are claiming Glocks never need cleaning or maintenance.

But the right shoes can make all the difference.

 

[Jenrick]

Well I admit I was wearing new boots, rather then my normal shooting shoes...

-Jenrick

 

[Geno]

Absolutely No!

In my abuse test, I went 2,000 rounds with my G17, and did not clean once! I experienced zero failures or ANY form.

The gun you rented has a MAJOR defect or is broken.

Doc2005

 

[Ky Larry]

The pistol was a range beater. It has had untold rounds put thru it of unknown quality, been neglected, and left uncleaned. It may have worn or damaged parts. Theres no telling what kind of abuse it has suffered. Any gun that is treated this was is subject to failure,even injury to the shooter. I think I would avoid that ranges rental weapons. I don't like shooting Glocks, but they are very reliable. If they work for you, then get one.

 

[Beethoven]

Sounds like ALL the springs need to be replaced, including mag springs & followers, and especially the springs inside the slide (FP spring, extractor spring & FP safety plunger spring) as well as detail stripping the slide.

My G30 was not reliable until I detail stripped the slide & replaced all the springs. (I bought it used though....)

 

[hotpig]

I have a second generation G17 that I have never cleaned. I could not even guess how many thousands of rounds have been fired. I have added a little oil to the slide every now and again. I also wipe the outside down so that I do not get my uniform dirty if there happens to be a little unburned powder at the end of the barrel.

 

[Beethoven]

I have a second generation G17 that I have never cleaned. I could not even guess how many thousands of rounds have been fired. I have added a little oil to the slide every now and again. I also wipe the outside down so that I do not get my uniform dirty if there happens to be a little unburned powder at the end of the barrel.

Do what you want, but that is the worst idea I've ever heard of, particularly for a duty gun (I presume, since you said "uniform").

No gun ever malfunctioned from being too clean.

 

[hotpig]

I was thinking about cleaning it this winter. I was out at the farm shooting today and looked it over pretty good. It does not look very dirty so I may put it off for a while.

I shoot mostly Ranger ammo and very few other brands. If I started shooting my reloads, factory target ammo, or some junk ammo I would have to clean it more often.

I choose the Glock because it would function after abuse and does not rust like my other work guns did in the past. It took me several years to get the Fire Chief to allow Glocks. I did not push for them because they were pretty or had a good trigger. In fact they are butt ugly, and very bulky. The only thing uglier than a Glock would be a Hi Point.

 

[WillBrayJr]

Glocks aren't ugly, just plain looking. All german and most american handgun are ugly like the Hi-Points. That being said I have shot just about every Glock out there and only had problems with the 9mms

 

[kahr404life]

Sounds like a bad magazine. It can cause all of the mentioned problems. My Glock 17 rocks and rolls .