Grudges....

Status
Not open for further replies.

SSN Vet

Member
Joined
Jan 3, 2006
Messages
6,507
Location
The Dark Side of the Moon
I try my level best to give others the benefit of the doubt and to foster a forgiving spirit....so I don't form grudges easilly.....however....once formed, they don't shake easilly.

these are companies I will never ever let get a penny of my hard earned dollars.

1. Toshiba
2. Kongsburg
3. Ruger

Recently at work, our company owners put it in my hands to make the final recommendation for a CNC X-Y sample cutter.

I was more than pleased to steer us towards a machine by Data-technologies and leave Kongsburg to miss out on a $120,000 sale. The decision was made easy, as the Data Tech. unit was a much better value for us.

Does anybody out there remember the Toshiba / Kongsburg sell out in the '80s?

I became informed about the AWB players this year and added Ruger to the list.

Who's on your list?
 
Ruger is involved with the new AWB this year? First I ever heard of it!
 
Ruger is involved with the new AWB this year? First I ever heard of it!

never said that.....he did enough damage the first time around for my likings.....I've just been out of the loop for most of my adult life.

Kongsberg and Toshiba violated the technology export laws and sold the USSR giant sized, extremely accurate, 5-axis milling machines used to make submarine porpelors. For a few bucks under the table, they gave the communist a 20 year jump in quiet running submarine technology.

If I recall correctly, several congressmen beat up a Toshiba t.v. with hammers on the steps of the Capital. Then the t.v. cameras were turned off (along with the opportunity to benefit politically from the "outrage") and they promptly forgot.
 
There are too many companies doing stuff now that deserve grudging.

- Intel is building a 12" wafer fab in China (computer chip factory). This is about 500 high paying skilled labor jobs and countless vendor and support jobs leaving the USA.

- GM closed plants in Texas and opens an engine plant at the same time in China to make motors for the Equinox SUVs. The vehicles are then assembled in Canada.

- Motorola has been a leader in shipping jobs overseas since the mid 1990's.

- Justin Boots (and most other shoe companies) manufactures most of their footwear in China. Chinese cowboy boots for the lose.

Go to Lowes or Home Depot and look around. The majority of folks working there are 30-50 years old. This type of work was considered entry level 20 years ago.

There is an economic war against the middle class in the US and the middle class doesn't even know it. People are duped into thinking they have a better quality of life because of the plastic crap they can afford..
 
Well to keep it on topic for THR...

BB&T Banks
Wachovia Banks
Outback Steakhouse
and more movie theaters than I can remember at this point :banghead:
 
Well, Halliburton is moving is main HQ to Dubai, supposedly to avoid US taxes. I find this to be complete bull****, considering how much money we as taxpayers are pumping into their corporation.
 
Well, Halliburton is moving is main HQ to Dubai, supposedly to avoid US taxes. I find this to be complete bull****, considering how much money we as taxpayers are pumping into their corporation.

Most of their work and contracts are in that region and moving their HQ there allows them to operate on local time. They've also been working pretty hard at spinning off KBR, their subsidiary that handles the contracting for the US armed forces, and won't be in that business in the near future.

Really, of the many companies that have gone off-shore, Halliburton is one of the few that have a strong case for moving that doesn't include tax breaks.
 
War on the Middle Class

While I understand the case of the GRRR's about jobs and companies screwing the U.S. a lot of people don't understand that it's our own government that creates the situation.

Why else would companies leave the U.S? It's not ALL about cheap labor. If our own government didn't make a "fair playing field" against American Business/Farmers/industry, the majority would still be here.

Now to the firearms aspect, I wonder the benefits companies like Sig, HK, Glock etc. from Europe that built factories or at the very least assembly plants (Glock) here in the U.S. for the Market to avoid import tariffs, export etc. I wonder, now the the Euro is a greater value than the Dollar, will these companies in greater capacity start exporting back to their countries of origin?

Plus I want Glock to have a factory here in the U.S. as I want a Glock .380 and under current import laws.... Great now I've got a case of the GGGRRRRRRSSSS!!!!
 
The list is long. I generally try not to give business to the Anti-Gun Companies. Some of them are hard to aviod if you are in a smaller town (which I am no longer, but spent a couple years in one).

Although, I find it interesting that there are a lot of Newspapers that are Anti-Gun (to the point of providing funds to support). Also, you would think that the ACLU would not pick a side, since they are now treading on OUR civil liberties.
 
Well citi bank & Bank of america have customer service outsoursed to India and Phillipines, most software companies including Microsoft do the sam e thing. AT&T which includes cingular wireless also outsources customer service to India, Phillipines & mexico.

The US is 10%+ owned by foreigners and if mostpoliticians had there way would sell us all out for money. It's a shame that commercialism/Capitalism has sold out.

The fact is You/We/ME have no chioce. Even teh gas we put into our cars goes out of the country. WE have gone from a Strong economy and a strong dollar to a Service wastefull economy that produces very little other than entertainment & luxuty and watched our dollar decrease in value to every major currency in the world.

One US Dollar is = to:
$.84 - Euro Dollar
$.53 - Britiis Dollar

You would have to have had a 100% raise just to keep up to others. The reason for our Dollars decline can be seen in direct corelation with our DEBT. DEBT gained by a war that is doing nothing for our economy, unless you're an investor incompanies such as (OSK) OshKosh Truck, (PCP) Precision Castparts, (HAL) Haliburton and others involved in the "military industrial complex", 50 years ago we were warned by President Dwight D. Eisenhower our last great military leader.

http://www.sonyclassics.com/whywefight/main.html

Please listen to his words. He would be pro 2A today.

Dwight D. Eisenhower: Farewell Address
delivered 17 January 1961
AUTHENTICITY CERTIFIED: Text version below transcribed directly from audio
Good evening, my fellow Americans. First, I should like to express my gratitude to the radio and television networks for the opportunities they have given me over the years to bring reports and messages to our nation.
My special thanks go to them for the opportunity of addressing you this evening. Three days from now, after half century in the service of our country, I shall lay down the responsibilities of office as, in traditional and solemn ceremony, the authority of the Presidency is vested in my successor. This evening, I come to you with a message of leavetaking and farewell, and to share a few final thoughts with you, my countrymen. Like every other Like
every other citizen, I wish the new President, and all who will labor with him, Godspeed. I pray that the coming years will be blessed with peace and prosperity for all.
Our people expect their President and the Congress to find essential agreement on issues of great moment, the wise resolution of which will better shape the future of the nation. My own relations with the Congress, which began on a remote and tenuous basis when, long ago, a member of the Senate appointed me to West Point, have since ranged to the intimate during
the war and immediate postwar period, and finally to the mutually interdependent during these past eight years. In this final relationship, the Congress and the Administration have, on most vital issues, cooperated well, to serve the nation good, rather than mere partisanship, and so have assured that the business of the nation should go forward. So, my official relationship with the Congress ends in a feeling on my part of gratitude that we have
been able to do so much together.
We now stand ten years past the midpoint of a century that has witnessed four major wars among great nations. Three of these involved our own country. Despite these holocausts, America is today the strongest, the most influential, and most productive nation in the world. Understandably proud of this preeminence, we yet realize that America's leadership and prestige depend, not merely upon our unmatched material progress, riches, and military
strength, but on how we use our power in the interests of world peace and human betterment.
Throughout America's adventure in free government, our basic purposes have been to keep the peace, to foster progress in human achievement, and to enhance liberty, dignity, and integrity among peoples and among nations. To strive for less would be unworthy of a free and religious people. Any failure traceable to arrogance, or our lack of comprehension, or readiness to sacrifice would inflict upon us grievous hurt, both at home and abroad.
Progress toward these noble goals is persistently threatened by the conflict now engulfing the world. It commands our whole attention, absorbs our very beings. We face a hostile ideology global in scope, atheistic in character, ruthless in purpose, and insiduous [insidious] in method. Unhappily, the danger it poses promises to be of indefinite duration. To meet it successfully, there is called for, not so much the emotional and transitory sacrifices of crisis, but rather those which enable us to carry forward steadily, surely, and without complaint the burdens of a prolonged and complex struggle with liberty the stake. Only thus shall we remain, despite every provocation, on our charted course toward permanent peace and human betterment.
Crises there will continue to be. In meeting them, whether foreign or domestic, great or small, there is a recurring temptation to feel that some spectacular and costly action could become the miraculous solution to all current difficulties. A huge increase in newer elements of our defenses; development of unrealistic programs to cure every ill in agriculture; a dramatic
expansion in basic and applied research these and many other possibilities, each possibly promising in itself, may be suggested as the only way to the road we wish to travel. But each proposal must be weighed in the light of a broader consideration: the need to maintain balance in and among national programs, balance between the private and the public economy, balance between the cost and hoped for advantages, balance between the clearly
necessary and the comfortably desirable, balance between our essential requirements as a nation and the duties imposed by the nation upon the individual, balance between actions of the moment and the national welfare of the future. Good judgment seeks balance and progress. Lack of it eventually finds imbalance and frustration. The record of many decades
stands as proof that our people and their Government have, in the main, understood these truths and have responded to them well, in the face of threat and stress. But threats, new in kind or degree, constantly arise. Of these, I mention two only.
A vital element in keeping the peace is our military establishment. Our arms must be mighty, ready for instant action, so that no potential aggressor may be tempted to risk his own destruction. Our military organization today bears little relation to that known of any of my predecessors in peacetime, or, indeed, by the fighting men of World War II or Korea. Until the latest of our world conflicts, the United States had no armaments industry. American
makers of plowshares could, with time and as required, make swords as well. But we can no longer risk emergency improvisation of national defense. We have been compelled to create a permanent armaments industry of vast proportions. Added to this, three and a half million men and women are directly engaged in the defense establishment. We annually spend on
military security alone more than the net income of all United States cooperations corporations.
Now this conjunction of an immense military establishment and a large arms industry is new in the American experience. The total influence economic,
political, even spiritual is felt in every city, every Statehouse, every office of the Federal government. We recognize the imperative need for this development. Yet, we must not fail to comprehend its grave implications. Our toil, resources, and livelihood are all involved. So is the very structure of our
society.
In the councils of government, we must guard against the acquisition of unwarranted influence, whether sought or unsought, by the militaryindustrial
complex. The potential for the disastrous rise of misplaced power exists and will persist. We must never let the weight of this combination endanger our liberties or democratic processes. We should take nothing for granted. Only an alert and knowledgeable citizenry can compel the proper meshing of the
huge industrial and military machinery of defense with our peaceful methods and goals, so that security and liberty may prosper together. Akin to, and largely responsible for the sweeping changes in our industrialmilitary posture,
has been the technological revolution during recent decades. In this revolution, research hasbecome central; it also becomes more formalized, complex, and costly. A steadily increasingshare is conducted for, by, or at the direction of, the Federal government.
Today, the solitary inventor, tinkering in his shop, has been overshadowed by task forces of scientists in laboratories and testing fields. In the same fashion, the free university, historically the fountainhead of free ideas and scientific discovery, has experienced a revolution in the conduct of research. Partly because of the huge costs involved, a government contract becomes virtually a substitute for intellectual curiosity. For every old blackboard there are now hundreds of new electronic computers. The prospect of domination
of the nation's scholars by Federal employment, project allocations, and the power of money is ever present and is gravely to be regarded.
Yet, in holding scientific research and discovery in respect, as we should, we must also be alert to the equal and opposite danger that public policy could itself become the captive of a scientifictechnological elite.
It is the task of statesmanship to mold, to balance, and to integrate these and other forces, new and old, within the principles of our democratic system ever aiming toward the supreme goals of our free society.
Another factor in maintaining balance involves the element of time. As we peer into society's future, we you and I, and our government must
avoid the impulse to live only for today, plundering for our own ease and convenience the precious resources of tomorrow. We cannot mortgage the material assets of our grandchildren without risking the loss also of their
political and spiritual heritage. We want democracy to survive for all generations to come, not to become the insolvent phantom of tomorrow.
During the long lane of the history yet to be written, America knows that this world of ours, ever growing smaller, must avoid becoming a community of dreadful fear and hate, and be, instead, a proud confederation of mutual trust and respect. Such a confederation must be one of equals. The weakest must come to the conference table with the same confidence as do
we, protected as we are by our moral, economic, and military strength. That table, though scarred by many fast frustrations past frustrations, cannot be abandoned for the certainty agony of disarmament of the battlefield.
Disarmament, with mutual honor and confidence, is a continuing imperative. Together we must learn how to compose differences, not with arms, but with intellect and decent purpose.
Because this need is so sharp and apparent, I confess that I lay down my official responsibilities in this field with a definite sense of disappointment. As one who has witnessed the horror and the lingering sadness of war, as one who knows that another war could utterly destroy this civilization which has been so slowly and painfully built over thousands of years, I wish I could say tonight that a lasting peace is in sight.
Happily, I can say that war has been avoided. Steady progress toward our ultimate goal has been made. But so much remains to be done. As a private citizen, I shall never cease to do what little I can to help the world advance along that road.
So, in this, my last good night to you as your President, I thank you for the many opportunities you have given me for public service in war and in peace. I trust in that in that in that service you find some things worthy. As for the rest of it, I know you will find ways to improve performance in the future.
You and I, my fellow citizens, need to be strong in our faith that all nations, under God, will reach the goal of peace with justice. May we be ever unswerving in devotion to principle, confident but humble with power, diligent in pursuit of the Nations' great goals.
To all the peoples of the world, I once more give expression to America's prayerful and continuing aspiration: We pray that peoples of all faiths, all races, all nations, may have their great human needs satisfied; that those now denied opportunity shall come to enjoy it to the full; that all who yearn for freedom may experience its few spiritual blessings.
Those who have freedom will understand, also, its heavy responsibility; that all who are insensitive to the needs of others will learn charity; and that the sources scourges of poverty, disease, and ignorance will be made [to] disappear from the earth; and that in the goodness of time, all peoples will come to live together in a peace guaranteed by the binding force of mutual respect and love.
Now, on Friday noon, I am to become a private citizen. I am proud to do so. I look forward to it.
Thank you, and good night.
 
People are duped into thinking they have a better quality of life because of the plastic crap they can afford..

Amen to that!!

add electronic gadgets to the list of affordable entertainment non-essentials.

now the list of things the middle class can no-longer afford...

a stay at home mom
a house (unless you get creative w/ mortgage terms)
health insurance
rainy day savings
retirement

sounds like a pretty poor trade to me.

And the middle class has voted with their wallet.....beating a trail to Walmart.
 
Are Toshiba and Kongsberg American companies that are subject to American export law?

Defense allies....heavilly dependant on U.S. for treaty defense and for military technology and hardware.

and in the case of Kongsberg....NATO non-proliferation agreements.

Remember....were talking about circa 1980 and the height of the Cold War....and my 25 year old grudge being vindicated.
 
Re. Halliburton .... IMO all the hype about this company has been Busch hater BS.

Check their public records (public corporation)....despite all the "favors" Dick Cheney is supposedly doing for them, they're losing money hand over fist in Iraq.
 
Jimmypop97:
According to the Houston Chronicle, Halliburton is moving their executive hdqs. to Dubai. They will continue to be incorporated in the U.S and won't save anything on taxes
 
Progressive Insurance. The CEO or president (I forget which) donates generously to anti-gun organizations.

Starbucks Coffee: Yep, they too commit the grave sin of contributing to anti-gun organizations.

This makes me wonder: Is there some way to obtain a comprehensive list of companies who directly contribute or are heavily owned by anti-gun people so we can boycott them?
 
propellers

What good did it do to sell USSR the 5 axis milling machines for super quite propellors. They already had proven technology in their caterpiller drive. Much quieter!!!:neener:
 
Timberland shoe/boots = Watched as they closed the factory here in maine ( half my family worked there) in order to move to mexico . My dad was the peoples rep for the union and was told flat out that bringing in the union only sped up their date to move to mexico .

L.L Bean = At one time you could pick up practically anything to find it was made here in the US . Now you are lucky to find ANYTHING they sell to be made here .

Wal Mart = Cheap , low quality , non US made items . They are also eliminating so much of their gun counters .

I also avoid Lowes and home depot . Profits leave the state rather than being spent in the community (same with wally world ).

I buy from local shops . They tend to spend their profits here in the community and , with very few exceptions , are not anti-gun and don't have "no gun " zones .I try to buy guns that are US made such as kel tec but yes , i have bought stuff made out of the US (XD,Taurus) .

My s**t list of companies I refuse to spend money at is fairly long and I let them know WHY i refuse to buy their products , especially the ones that are anti-gun or have no gun policies .
 
I don't by any Toshiba products. But that is because of their business practices.

-Pat
 
any body

that believes dick cheney did the average WORKERS at haliburton or their subsidiarys and favors now or when he was ceo has not read the entire story! :barf:

been there done that.;)
 
Throughout history, the greatest threat to a tyrranical, totalitarian government has been a well-educated, profitable middle class. Look at the Renaissance, the Protestant Reformation, and the American Revolution.

That's why the middle class is always the first target of any regieme looking to take over. See Vietnam, Bolshevek Revolution, and Mao's China.

And now it's the United State's turn..... :uhoh:

Invest in your future wisely...
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top