Gun group sues over school zone restriction
- Thread starter bartsitarski
- Start date
- Status
I was just about to post about this absolute nonsense. While I strongly believe that guns shouldn't be on school property, this is taking it waaaaay too far.
Gun group sues over school zone restriction
By Bruce Vielmetti of the Journal Sentinel
Posted: Jan. 8, 2010 4:24 p.m.
A gun rights group has sued the state and two cities over enforcement of Wisconsin's law against carrying firearms within 1,000 feet of a school.
The lawsuit, filed in federal court in Milwaukee Friday, claims that "Wisconsin's Gun Free School Zone Act covers such a broad area that it practically forecloses a meaningful right to keep and bear arms in large parts of the state." It calls the law "an onerous restriction that has the potential to ensnare thousands of law-abiding citizens exercising their constitutionally guaranteed rights and expose them to felony charges"
The lawsuit was filed by Wisconsin Carry, Inc., David Bernson of Milwaukee and Frank Hannan Rock of Racine. It names as defendants Gov. Jim Doyle, the city of Milwaukee and one of its police officers, and the city of Racine and two Racine officers. It seeks to have the law declared unconstitutional and damages for the two men over their arrests and confiscation of guns.
According to the suit:
Bernson was arrested near his home in May 2008, and though he was subsequently released without charge, the city has refused to return a gun that was seized from Bernson's home. Bernson's request for the gun was denied in part because he had allegedly possessed it at a gas station within 1,000 feet of a school.
In September, Rock was arrested on his front porch in Racine, and had his gun confiscated, when he refused to identify himself to officers. Ultimately, he was not prosecuted for obstruction but was told that because he lives within 1,000 feet of a school, officers would have probable cause in the future to arrest him if he has a gun and refuses to identify himself.
Milwaukee city attorney's office officials said they had not seen the lawsuit Friday. Officials with the governor's office and city of Racine could not immediately be reached for comment.
Gun group sues over school zone restriction
By Bruce Vielmetti of the Journal Sentinel
Posted: Jan. 8, 2010 4:24 p.m.
A gun rights group has sued the state and two cities over enforcement of Wisconsin's law against carrying firearms within 1,000 feet of a school.
The lawsuit, filed in federal court in Milwaukee Friday, claims that "Wisconsin's Gun Free School Zone Act covers such a broad area that it practically forecloses a meaningful right to keep and bear arms in large parts of the state." It calls the law "an onerous restriction that has the potential to ensnare thousands of law-abiding citizens exercising their constitutionally guaranteed rights and expose them to felony charges"
The lawsuit was filed by Wisconsin Carry, Inc., David Bernson of Milwaukee and Frank Hannan Rock of Racine. It names as defendants Gov. Jim Doyle, the city of Milwaukee and one of its police officers, and the city of Racine and two Racine officers. It seeks to have the law declared unconstitutional and damages for the two men over their arrests and confiscation of guns.
According to the suit:
Bernson was arrested near his home in May 2008, and though he was subsequently released without charge, the city has refused to return a gun that was seized from Bernson's home. Bernson's request for the gun was denied in part because he had allegedly possessed it at a gas station within 1,000 feet of a school.
In September, Rock was arrested on his front porch in Racine, and had his gun confiscated, when he refused to identify himself to officers. Ultimately, he was not prosecuted for obstruction but was told that because he lives within 1,000 feet of a school, officers would have probable cause in the future to arrest him if he has a gun and refuses to identify himself.
Milwaukee city attorney's office officials said they had not seen the lawsuit Friday. Officials with the governor's office and city of Racine could not immediately be reached for comment.
I'd like to see them win the suit, because our law in Georgia is very similar. But, so's the law accross the country. I'm not too optimistic though. The hell of it is you can scream amd holler until the cows come home and they continue to hold your gun.
I complained to the mayor's office when the police kept putting me off after my stolen gun was recovered. They used the excuse that it was needed for evidence. The crime, someone was shooting it in the air on New Years Eve! It worked to my surprise..............
I complained to the mayor's office when the police kept putting me off after my stolen gun was recovered. They used the excuse that it was needed for evidence. The crime, someone was shooting it in the air on New Years Eve! It worked to my surprise..............
TCB in TN
Member
Sounds like they have a pretty solid case here!
Flyboy
Member
The federal law was held unconstitutional, though on grounds that wouldn't apply to a state (and subsequently re-passed with a very minor change that might make it pass muster, given how goofy the Court has been on that topic).
Failing to identify oneself may actually be a crime; it depends upon the jurisdiction. The Court held in Hiibel that statutes requiring a person to identify himself were constitutional. If Wisconsin has such a statute, the arrest may be valid, along with any search incident to the arrest.
Failing to identify oneself may actually be a crime; it depends upon the jurisdiction. The Court held in Hiibel that statutes requiring a person to identify himself were constitutional. If Wisconsin has such a statute, the arrest may be valid, along with any search incident to the arrest.
jonsidneyb
Member
- Joined
- Mar 1, 2006
- Messages
- 343
Oh my.
So if you are in your car and drive by a school you have violated the law?
Ouch.
So if you are in your car and drive by a school you have violated the law?
Ouch.
ccsniper
member
What if you live within 1000 feet of the school? Could you even own a firearm within the limit? hmmm....
scoutsabout
Member
"I was just about to post about this absolute nonsense. While I strongly believe that guns shouldn't be on school property, this is taking it waaaaay too far."
I believe shooting should be an option for a Phys. Ed class. We had guns on campus for DECADES and no problems. Every argument you have for no guns on campus is being used against you off campus. Does crossing an imaginary line make you loose all self control and start shooting people? Why would it work in reverse? Another classic example of "Zero Tolerance." I hope the plaintiffs kick some ass on this idiotic law.
Happy New Year!
Lanyard
I believe shooting should be an option for a Phys. Ed class. We had guns on campus for DECADES and no problems. Every argument you have for no guns on campus is being used against you off campus. Does crossing an imaginary line make you loose all self control and start shooting people? Why would it work in reverse? Another classic example of "Zero Tolerance." I hope the plaintiffs kick some ass on this idiotic law.
Happy New Year!
Lanyard
bartsitarski
Member
According to this law, you could not own a gun. That is what this law suit is about.
mljdeckard
Member
Yesterday I went to Weber State University to pick up my wife from one of her classes, and then my kids' elementary school, thanked the principal for straightening out my login to the online grade system, pulled my youngest off the bus for special needs students, and waited for the others to get out of class, all while carrying.
I've said it before and I'll say it again. I love Utah.
I've said it before and I'll say it again. I love Utah.
KBintheSLC
Member
Whats wrong with law abiding citizens carrying at schools? How is that any different than carrying at the park, the zoo, the local community rec center, etc? Its bad enough that your kid has to go to school defenseless, now you want to strip the teachers, staff and parents of their ability to stop a crime? No wonder schools are such a perfect target for nut sacks.
mljdeckard
Member
KB, you are the nut. You know perfectly well that a bad guy will walk to the perimeter of that school, see that 'no guns' sign, and stop dead like a lab with a shock collar. He wouldn't have the temerity to walk right past it and destroy the sanctity of an establishment of learning where parents leave their kids in the capable hands of vigilant teachers who are paid well enough that they will joyfully jump in front of a bullet to save their kids.
NMGonzo
Member
I learned to shoot in Elementary School.
You had to be 10 years old at least, parents had to sign.
You had to be 10 years old at least, parents had to sign.
bnhcomputing
Member
- Joined
- Feb 9, 2007
- Messages
- 36
For immediate release:
On January 8th 2010 Wisconsin Carry, Inc. filed a lawsuit in Federal Court to challenge the constitutionality of Wisconsin's onerous Gun Free School Zone Act.
Wisconsin's Gun Free School Zone Act (GFSZA), which was modeled on the federal Gun-Free School Zone Act of 1990, prohibits the possession or shooting of a firearm within a school zone. It defines a school zone as in the school building, the school grounds, and the area within 1000 feet of the school grounds. The Federal GFSZA was struck down as unconstitutional in 1995. Wisconsin's GFSZA remains.
In 1998 79% of the voters in the great state of Wisconsin voted Article 1 Section 25 into our state constitution. "The people have the right to keep and bear arms for security, defense, hunting, recreation or any other lawful purpose". The Constitutions of the United States and Wisconsin guarantee the right of individuals to keep and bear arms; and as the United States Supreme Court held in the DC gun ban case, DC v. Heller, "bear" means "carry." Wisconsin’s Gun Free School Zone Act covers such a broad area that it practically forecloses a meaningful right to keep and bear arms in large parts of the state. It is an onerous restriction that has the potential to ensnare thousands of law-abiding citizens exercising their constitutionally guaranteed rights and expose them to felony charges. Wisconsin's GFSZ Act places someone who was innocently walking their dog around their subdivision at night while armed in danger of felony charges if they should happen to cross these invisible school zones which extend nearly a quarter mile out from the edge of school property and many properties that are not identified as schools!
More than 2000 people have signed our online petition calling on the Governor and Legislature to repeal this law. http://www.petitiononline.com/wi1848oc/petition.html
Wisconsin Carry is a non-profit corporation dedicated to the preservation and reclamation of the basic rights critical to a free society. Our membership believes in the founding principles of our country and our constitution: That all are created equal, that governments exist to protect the rights of individuals, and that governments derive their power from the consent of the governed. Our mission is to preserve, advance and expand these basic rights which law-abiding citizens are entitled to have a practical ability to exercise.
A copy of the Federal Lawsuit can be viewed at:
http://www.wisconsincarry.org/pdf/GFSZ_Complaint.pdf
Wisconsin Carry, Inc.'s Website is http://www.wisconsincarry.org
Should you wish to help with the cause, membership forms are available here: http://www.wisconsincarry.org/pdf/MembershipApplication.pdf
On January 8th 2010 Wisconsin Carry, Inc. filed a lawsuit in Federal Court to challenge the constitutionality of Wisconsin's onerous Gun Free School Zone Act.
Wisconsin's Gun Free School Zone Act (GFSZA), which was modeled on the federal Gun-Free School Zone Act of 1990, prohibits the possession or shooting of a firearm within a school zone. It defines a school zone as in the school building, the school grounds, and the area within 1000 feet of the school grounds. The Federal GFSZA was struck down as unconstitutional in 1995. Wisconsin's GFSZA remains.
In 1998 79% of the voters in the great state of Wisconsin voted Article 1 Section 25 into our state constitution. "The people have the right to keep and bear arms for security, defense, hunting, recreation or any other lawful purpose". The Constitutions of the United States and Wisconsin guarantee the right of individuals to keep and bear arms; and as the United States Supreme Court held in the DC gun ban case, DC v. Heller, "bear" means "carry." Wisconsin’s Gun Free School Zone Act covers such a broad area that it practically forecloses a meaningful right to keep and bear arms in large parts of the state. It is an onerous restriction that has the potential to ensnare thousands of law-abiding citizens exercising their constitutionally guaranteed rights and expose them to felony charges. Wisconsin's GFSZ Act places someone who was innocently walking their dog around their subdivision at night while armed in danger of felony charges if they should happen to cross these invisible school zones which extend nearly a quarter mile out from the edge of school property and many properties that are not identified as schools!
More than 2000 people have signed our online petition calling on the Governor and Legislature to repeal this law. http://www.petitiononline.com/wi1848oc/petition.html
Wisconsin Carry is a non-profit corporation dedicated to the preservation and reclamation of the basic rights critical to a free society. Our membership believes in the founding principles of our country and our constitution: That all are created equal, that governments exist to protect the rights of individuals, and that governments derive their power from the consent of the governed. Our mission is to preserve, advance and expand these basic rights which law-abiding citizens are entitled to have a practical ability to exercise.
A copy of the Federal Lawsuit can be viewed at:
http://www.wisconsincarry.org/pdf/GFSZ_Complaint.pdf
Wisconsin Carry, Inc.'s Website is http://www.wisconsincarry.org
Should you wish to help with the cause, membership forms are available here: http://www.wisconsincarry.org/pdf/MembershipApplication.pdf
bnhcomputing
Member
- Joined
- Feb 9, 2007
- Messages
- 36
In Wisconsin it is illegal to possess a firearm within 1000ft of school property UNLESS: The firearm is unloaded and in a case OR you are on private property.
So unloaded and encased, you can walk it down the street to your car. In you own yard or home, no problem. The problem comes in when it is not in a case and on public property (sidewalk/street).
All of our veterans (those who carry in the parades) are subject to felony charges if the parade comes within 1000ft of a school. The bicycle rider, who was being severely beaten in Racine and defended himself by displaying a firearm, is subject to a greater penalty than those who were beating him up.
That is why this law has to go
So unloaded and encased, you can walk it down the street to your car. In you own yard or home, no problem. The problem comes in when it is not in a case and on public property (sidewalk/street).
All of our veterans (those who carry in the parades) are subject to felony charges if the parade comes within 1000ft of a school. The bicycle rider, who was being severely beaten in Racine and defended himself by displaying a firearm, is subject to a greater penalty than those who were beating him up.
That is why this law has to go
NMGonzo
Member
As a bicyclist; I am happy to be in NM.
In every state it is illegal to carry a firearm within 1000 feet of a school unless you are on private property, or licensed to do so. Federal law. Different states, however, have differing laws, most of which are much narrower and less restrictive. here's a really good summary of GFZs from the GOA:
http://gunowners.org/fs9611.htm
http://gunowners.org/fs9611.htm
KBintheSLC
Member
You got me there. I have heard that some of the "no guns" signs are so well designed that they cause instant bowel evacuation upon viewing... and are effective on even the most hardened criminals. As for teacher pay... "sigh"...
In most states, unless you have a CCW, driving by a school with a gun in the car that you can have control of is illegal.
71Commander
Member
You sure you're on the right forum?
bnhcomputing
Member
- Joined
- Feb 9, 2007
- Messages
- 36
I disagree. In most states you can drive by a school, with a firearm in you vehicle, as long as the firearm is unloaded and encased.
The issue here is possession of a loaded firearm with the 1,000ft zone. In that case, mboylan is correct, in the 48 states with carry permitting systems, only those with carry permits are able to possess a loaded firearm within the GFSZ. In Wisconsin however, there is no permitting system of any kind that would allow for carry within the school zone.
In addition, we aren't talking about ON school grounds here, we are talking about the guy who lives down the street and cannot step out of his yard without risk of a felony arrest.
This is interesting. i live on the same block that an elementary school is next to. now, granted i am across the block or neighborhood (whatever you want to call it) I need to check google earth to see if i live within 1000 of the school. now, living in ID, and being outside city limits and having very very few cops patrolling the area might help me out, but it's still scary. the gun free school zones is a joke. while I am strongly opposed to letting some of the idiot teenagers at the nearest high school even think about looking at a gun let alone handling one on campus (and for some of them, anywhere else) I am not opposed to a CCP holder carry on campus. "oh watch out, I just crossed a school boundary while CCing, a switch might trigger in my brain making me go crazy killing students." dumb law.
- Status
