Guns "lost" during a flight, what's the limit of my liability?

[bamawrx]

I flew into san antonio with a loaded pelican case a few years ago. They treated by case with the greatest of care. If fact, I was informed that my case would not be in the public baggage claim area, and I was directed to some office somewhere. Long story short, my case was waiting for me, and they required ID to pick it up. A hassle yes, but well worth it. I appreciated the care they took to prevent my case ending up in the wrong hands. Two AR-15's and two 1911's made the trip as a result.

That was my last flight, and I hope it will stay my last. At the end of the day, I could have made the drive in the same time with all the hassles and avoided all the post 911 crap.

 

[grimjaw]

The numbers are in, and the verdict . . .

. . . crap.

This is a fairly rugged case, and I'm trying to decide how most of the soft luggage survived with nary a scratch, but this thing looks like someone tried to break it apart. "Whoops! Looks like it broke, off camera and out of earshot, have to pick up these guns and put them back inside, la la la."

No guns were damaged so far as I can see, although I'm sure moisture got inside the case. The case is a wreck, and won't close without being bent into shape and forced. I unlocked and opened one latch only to have it come to pieces.

This will be the last time I fly without insurance on items like this outside of my control.

jm

 

[Dallas239]

Very gald to hear the guns were returned to you undamaged. Did the airline offer to pay for the damage to the case? That does not sound like "normal wear and tear" from handling. While it is certainly possible that your luggage was targeted, it is also possible that it fell off of a baggage cart and got run over by a truck. Remember Hanlon's razor: "Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity."

 

[billwiese]

Glad you got your guns back.

If at all possible I think you shoulda told them to hold your gun case and/or any other affected luggage at the airline's luggage office for you to claim with ID. One less step to screw up (luggage courier service)

I frequently fly with gun(s) on Alaska/Horizon (and once or twice with Southwest). This includes flying into/out of California with multiple reg'd assault weapons & hicap mags.


Several comments about flying with guns...

1) If you're taking a multileg flight with tight plane-change connections, see if you can - upon deplaning in preparation for next leg - talk to a gate agent to ensure your guns get on the next flight. The blonde girls are unlikely to say anything other than, "I'm sure your luggage will be on your next flight", but if you tell them you're travelling with declared, legal firearms and you wanna ensure they're not cirling the carousel in the wrong airport, subject to Colombian luggage theives, they start listening and becoming helpful.

When I had a tight connection thru Portland OR the girl first blew me off til I told 'em about the guns - then they radioed to luggage ramp and got back an exact description of my luggage. It turned out it wasn't gonna go on this plane and was gonna be on a subsequent flight an hour later if I hadn't intervened. Ended up bumped up to first class to boot.

2) Ask that your declared rifle case (or luggage suite) be held at destination airport for ID-required pickup, instead of circling the carousel.

3) #2 above not always honored and your gun case could still well be on the carousel. So when you get off the flight to pick up your luggage, don't stop for coffee, pee, socialize, etc. Sometimes the luggage can get deplaned before you can. You wanna be at the carousel before it starts dumping your flight's luggage.

4) You can get "insurance" but it's not true 'insurance'. It's called "excess valuation" coverage and runs ~$10/$1K per trip (or side of flight, not sure) - last time I remember. This covers for loverall loss, but won't cover for anything but the worst damage (i.e., gun still works but stock/finish and optics damaged may not get you much payout). So pack well in spite of coverage.


5) Include multiple copies of name/address/phone# info for your home address as well as contact #s & info for your destination *inside* the gun case. Label your case well.



Bill Wiese
San Jose CA

 

[Bubbles]

The case is a wreck, and won't close without being bent into shape and forced. I unlocked and opened one latch only to have it come to pieces.

United Airlines mangled one of my Pelican rifle cases a few years ago. I contacted Pelican, and after I sent them the mangled case they sent me a new one. Pelican wants the mangled cases back so they can see how they failed. Fortunately the rifle in the case was undamaged.

 

[cyclist]

I kind of suspected a missed connection for the luggage.

 

[0007]

Only time I've ever traveled with firearms was BTSA. Even back then I knew enough to insure the case for $2K. When I arrived in Cali, I watched as a special container was brought to the baggage area and everything carefully unpacked and set off to one side where those of us waiting had to show the baggage check AND a picture ID to claim our "stuff".

Glad to hear you got your stuff. Tell the airline that they owe you for the case/repair

 

[billwiese]

Tell the airline that they owe you for the case/repair

Won't happen. Luggage damage ain't covered or at best you get a token amount, not the $150ish a Pelican costs.


Bill Wiese
San Jose CA

 

[Autolycus]

I can only imagine the hell you wnet through.

 

[saddenedcitizen]

Glad to hear you got your guns back.
As for the case, contact the airline. You never know and if you get nothing
you're no worse off.
As a side note -
'Especially now that they make you leave your suitcase unlocked when you check it in.'
Not quite.
Look into TSA locks. Combination lock that can also be opened with a key TSA has ( an probably a lot of other people as well by now but what can you do !!??)
This eliminates them have to literally break your luggage locks - mine go double locked ( Pelican with firearm(s) inside and locked with a TSA lock and then the Pelican inside another piece of luggage also locked with TSA locks.) Not perfect but ............
I also accompany my luggage to the TSA 'area' and am there when they go through it. Doesn't accomplish much but makes me fell better.
Only once has the luggage been opened/'inspected' again in transit and there was a card inside saying so.
Guess I've been VERY lucky so far.
Anyway, again, glad you got your guns back.

 

[mgregg85]

I would be very careful in flying with a firearm(in baggage of course). Remember that you are supposed to lock the case(doesn't have to be a TSA lock, probably shouldn't be one) and you do not have to label it as a gun no matter what the airline may say.

 

[saddenedcitizen]

Sounds like you haven't flown in a while

You delclare the firearm at check-in.
Then you are directed to the TSA area where the firearm is 'inspected' and
in my case, we always go through the process together.
A card with name and address is placed INSIDE the inner case. There is
no longer ANY indication on the outside of a firearm within ( unlike years
ago when a LARGE RED 'tape' printed with FIREARM was placed on the outside of the bag - might as well been printed with 'STEAL ME' on the bag !!)
At the end of the inspedtion, cases are locked by me and go on their way.
At no time until after the inspection are the cases out of my possesion or control.
Now, if they are inspected again, yes, it happens, TSA locks shouldn't be broken ( and haven't so far - thankfully ) but if you check a bag WITHOUT declaring the firearm or someone somewhere ( connection whatever ) scans the bag again and sees
something suspicious they WILL break the lock(s) to get inside the bag
unless they can open them 'normally' ( TSA locks they can open and in my case have done so once - left a preprinted note INSIDE the inner case saying the bag had been 'inspected' again !!! ). If they break the locks, you now have an UNLOCKED piece of baggage that ANYONE can open ANYWHERE for the remainder of the trip !! Sad but true.
If it's a firearm that you didn't declare - you are in deep yogurt and they WILL find you ( there if FAR more on those adhesive baggage tags they use than your flight number and destination !! )
As someone said earlier, get to the luggage claim area as fast as you can. You want to be there when your bag comes 'down the chute' ! Discreetly as you can, check the bag right then and there, If all is well go on your merry way and if not notify the baggage attendant IMMEDIATELY.
Unfortunately, it's their ball, bat, bases and field and if you must play, you'd better abide by their rules.

 

[FLA2760]

Where does one get this extra insurance on their guns when they fly?

 

[Bartholomew Roberts]

Where does one get this extra insurance on their guns when they fly?

Ask the airline about it.

 

[FLA2760]

Thank you.

 

[zoom6zoom]

mine go double locked ( Pelican with firearm(s) inside and locked with a TSA lock and then the Pelican inside another piece of luggage also locked with TSA locks.)

NO! DO NOT use TSA locks on your gun case - this will be a violation - only you are supposed to hold the key or combination to your gun case. If you use a TSA lock, there's no telling who could open your case. You can put them on the external case, but do not use them on the gun case.

 

[SR_]

Did you file a claim with the airline for the damaged gun case? Sounds like it is beyond normal wear and tear - if you push, they will fix or replace. You may have to prove the replacement cost.

I had a nice bag destroyed and the airline's replacement service sent me an EL Cheapo replacement. I refused it. Took about 4 calls - sent an internet print off of the actual replacement and they sent me a check.