H.R. 822 Carry Reciprocity Bill

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The fed, as you detail above, also currently has jurisdiction to dictate to the states what goes on a drivers license. Ever hear of the Real ID act?
Yes, I have. And they don't have any jurisdiction to determine what's on a driver's license. They have only the power to define the standards for federal recognition of state-issued driver's licenses. So if you want to use your Vermont driver's license to identify yourself at a TSA checkpoint, it needs to comply with the federal standards.

The fed's power to regulate the form and criteria for drivers licenses stems directly from the legislation mandating reciprocity of drivers licenses.
Doubly wrong. There is no federal law mandating reciprocity of driver's licenses. Driver's license reciprocity exists because the states have agreed among themselves to recognize the licenses issued by other states.
 
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The fed, as you detail above, also currently has jurisdiction to dictate to the states what goes on a drivers license.

If you want the feds to accept it as an ID.

It has nothing to do with driving, just as an ID.
 
I'm not going to read the whole thread. But here is where my gut is.

We have worked hard for the last 25 years to establish that bearing arms is a right, and to force state governments, one at a time, to ease or eliminate restrictions on it. We have hammered through court decisions to get a definitive answer that bearing arms is a right, and that local fiefdoms can't declare otherwise. We have forced the anti-gun argument to subtext and silence for fear of retribution to those who support it. We have used the 'creeping incrementalism' of our opponents to achieve a position where we have the momentum and initiative in this argument. They are defending themselves against US, not the other way around.

SO, when we have a national-level decision to be made on this issue, after all these dominoes have fallen, we have to choose. Is this the next inevitable step towards allowing free men to keep and bear arms? Or is it some kind of elaborate trap designed to sucker us into allowing the .gov to restrict our rights?

If we had stood firm on the "carry permits are allowing the government to restrict our rights" platform, and insisted that all states just drop their laws against carrying concealed, we would have nothing today. The problem with insisting on 'all or nothing' from the government, is that they are all too willing to give you nothing. We have come this far. To now get leery because of a potential future fight over semantics, is to admit that we really don't have the stones to continue forward. I say we go forward and address conflicts as they arise. This seems to be working well so far. Pass it, and if someone in the future tries to twist the law to make it do something it wasn't intended to do, they will have exposed themselves and we can address them directly.

If not this fight, which one? If not now, when?
 
I haven't read about this bill as much as I should. I have a question:

Is the supposed constitutional authority for this bill the full faith and credit clause? Commerce clause? What is Congress pointing to for their authority?
 
No, not just the commerce clause; it explicitly claims authority under the 2nd and 14th amendments as well as the right to interstate travel.
 
No, not just the commerce clause; it explicitly claims authority under the 2nd and 14th amendments as well as the right to interstate travel.

Earlier versions of HR 822 referred to the 2nd and 14th Amendments, but it looks to me like what passed the House makes no such justification, it only says that the law applies to guns that have "been shipped or transported in interstate or foreign commerce".
 
Yes, you're right, the findings section was stripped. That's a shame; there was a lot of good statement of intent in there, as well as the explicit and much-more-legitimate claims of constitutional authority. We're left with the tried-and-true but objectionable commerce clause language instead.
 
The commerce clause fig leaf rises again.

Licenses are not court actions that full faith and credit must be accorded.

Your driver's license is not recognized under full faith and credit.

It is recognized by compacts (agreements) among the states.

No federal involvement at all.

Just because a stats chooses to have judges and the courts process concealed weapon permits/licenses does NOT make them judicial acts.
 
Am I for or aginst???
All I have do is ask if Obama is for it .........if so I am aginst
If Obama is aginst it ...........I'm ALL FOR IT
 
Am I for or aginst???
All I have do is ask if Obama is for it .........if so I am aginst
If Obama is aginst it ...........I'm ALL FOR IT

Quite a methodology.
 
The commerce clause fig leaf rises again.

Licenses are not court actions that full faith and credit must be accorded.

Your driver's license is not recognized under full faith and credit.

It is recognized by compacts (agreements) among the states.

No federal involvement at all.

Just because a stats chooses to have judges and the courts process concealed weapon permits/licenses does NOT make them judicial acts.
brickeyee is offline Report Post
Read the bill. It gives its justification.
The 2A is all the justification needed. The Feds dictate how states must conduct their elections. This isn't much different.
 
Given that your entire view of this subject is inconsistent, you're not adding much here.
 
Changes in H.R. 822

Posts on another board note that there were some potentially critical changes between the bill as introduced and the bill as passed and referred to the Senate.

Changes included:
  • The elimination of Sec. 926D(c) - carry equivalent to a state's unrestricted license.
  • The elimination of Sec. 926D(c) - no preemption of state law.
  • The elimination of old Sec. 2 - Findings
  • The elimination of old Sec. 3(c) - severability
  • The addition of new Sec. 3 - GAO audit of state concealed carry licensing and "the effectiveness of such State laws and regulations in protecting the public safety."
 
I heard on the Howie Carr radio show today, an interview with Mitt Romney. He was asked about this bill and indicated that if he were elected and it (this bill) came across his desk, he would sign it. As all good politicians do, he left himself with a way out of it if needed. He used the words, "as I understand it" when referring to the context of the bill.
 
I'll tell you how to find out about this bill: I'll write to my dear Senator Durbin and if he's opposed, it's good legislation.
 
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