Had a question about unloading on safe

[Jimbo1]

I have been looking around at different weapons, and still haven't decided what I want (or what wife will let me get). Sold a ruger MKII long ago, soon after my daughter was born.

But anyway I came across this site about this teenager who sued and won a judgment for 51 mil. against Jennings Bryco because the weapon he was shot with allowed it to be unloaded without safe being on. I don't have anything to compare to, but I don't ever remeber checking if it was on safe. I would remove mag, then check chamber and magwell for any ammo. Do autoloaders have to be on safe to pull the slide back? Just seems to me the person that pointed a weapon at a kid's face, then pulled the trigger should be liable, not a weapons manufacturer.

 

[GigaBuist]

I think that you're thinking of a "magazine disconnect safety" which means the gun shouldn't fire if there isn't a magazine in the gun but there is still a round in the chamber.

My Walther P22 has such a "feature" which I find rather annoying when I'm stripping the weapon and cycle the action to verify that everything's sliding nicely. I have to insert an empty mag to lower the hammer back down which seems incredibly counter-productive to any safety measures. Insert mag into gun during cleaning/inspection process? No thanks.

Oddly enough, with this particular firearm, I can get it to drop the hammer without the mag if I hold it sideways or upside down. So, if I was playing gangsta with my "unloaded" gun it'd still fire.

Not being able to cycle the slide to extract a round from the chamber without the safety being on would be an impossible scenario for a semi-auto pistol, I believe. That is, unless somebody managed to figure out a way to only allow the slide to travel backwards while either the safety was on OR the trigger was fully depressed, but the later would probably cause malfunctions for a number of shooters. It certainly would have for me as a beginner.

 

[Hkmp5sd]

Agree with GigaBuist...probably the magazine disconnect.

I'm not aware of any semi-automatic handgun that requires the safety to be engaged in order to rack the slide. As far as I am concerned, the magazine disconnect is just a gimmick. I want my guns to shoot when I pull the trigger. If my magazine self-destructs, at least I can feed the cartridges one at a time and still have an effective weapon.

 

[Kruzr]

In the Bryco case, the lawyer for the teenager who was shot by his babysitter, convinced the jury that the design was unsafe because the safety, when engaged, also kept the slide from being racked back (sound familiar?). He just didn't dwell on the fact that the babysitter had his finger on the trigger. The loaded gun was found under the couch. The fault was spread between the babysitter, the parents, and the maker. Guess who had the deepest pockets.

 

[Plinkerton]

I know it's not a real gun, not in my opinion anyway, but my constantly broken Phoenix Arms HP22, which resides in a card board box, because it's not even worth paying shipping to have it repaired, does not allow you to rack the slide, without a mag in the gun. If the slide is locked, you can not unlock it, without a mag in the gun. To eject the mag, the safety has to be on, etc. etc. It was the most frustrating gun ever.

Till I ripped it open, and took out all the little extra bits of metal that caused it to function like a retarded gun. Then, I shot it, and the hammer broke in half, AGAIN.

 

[Henry Bowman]

One of the functions of the thumb safety (e.g., 1911 and Beretta designs) is to lock the slide in battery. That is, it prevents the slide from being moved slightly out of battery as the gun is holstered. If the trigger is pulled when slightly out of battery, it may fire and could result in a KABOOM. (Search "Glock" and "KB" for examples.) As a result, the thumb safety must be disengaged in order to rack the slide and clear the chamber. This is a common design and the pros and been determined to outweigh the cons.

If you want to be sure that the gun does not fire while unloading it, do not pull the trigger.