Hand Guns as Hedge against Inflation?

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Cylcops, that was a great investment and really drool-worthy. But that's NOT a long-action!

But that still is at minimum a $600 gun in even today's depressed gun market. And it will be worth more very soon. That's really nice and I'd be proud to own it, don't get me wrong.
 
Just a second post because, darn, that's nice. Next time I drive out there I am definitely bringing a few guns and hoping we can compare and swap stories!
 
I bought my Tec-9 in 1981 (first year of production) for $170 because I foresaw the assault weapon ban which passed in 1984 (also bought a real nice accessory kit for $90). The price didn't go up much during the ban. But I bought it to keep because I knew they would quit manufacturing them at some point -

On this site
http://www.gunsamerica.com/93321446...ns/Pistols/Intratec-Pistols/Tec_9_Pre_Ban.htm

There is one selling for $500 right now.

Mine is still not for sale, it works great and is a fun little toy. As for tools I have better options. And money doesn't mean much to me. I may barter it at "the end of western civilization as we know it" though I don't know what I might trade it for? I'd be set for food... Perhaps a gardener in a short dress? :D

I have mainly only guns which I can use for a variety of applicable taskes (small game, large game, self-defense, etc). But if I were to buy for a monetary investment I'd buy things which I foresee being attacked by the politicians. Currently that is the FN57 for example. It's quite obvious that another assault weapons ban is coming also. There is plenty of back door duplicity going on in Washington to deprice us of our rights. This is from 2 days ago http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/03/17/gun-advocates-ready-battle-federal-assault-weapons-ban/.

Seen the price of machine guns lately? Compared to what they cost back when I bought my Tec-9 there has been about a 1000% increase in their value due to legislation.

Oh, BTW, here is my little friend :D
tec9.jpg
 
I sent you a private em with lots of chatter. Here's a pic of a "long action." There are internal differences, but look at the hammer, that is the "cheat."

IMGP2665.jpg

I have shot at your range, actually, It was just nine months or so ago before I knew you. Once I am "over the hump" again, I will let you know and bring a few bags of guns so we can compare and have fun. Or if you come this way, let me know.
 
Ryder said:
Seen the price of machine guns lately? Compared to what they cost back when I bought my Tec-9 there has been about a 1000% increase in their value due to legislation.

Your Tec-9 is full auto? And are you experienced at pricing "poltical risk"? Do you think they will go up another 1000% as restrictive gun laws, which drove up their price, are reversed? Does that sound at all logical to you?
 
Oro - Like most people who don't have $20k just laying around, I do not own a pre-86 machine gun and therefore can't really speak to the legal malarkey surrounding transferring one. But even with Heller, it seems like you're living in a very different America - Heller was one step forward in gun rights compared to about a million steps backward that have been taken since '86, and with Holder and Obama, we are heading down a road to even more restrictions.

Pre-86 machine guns are one of a *very* small number of things that have reliably increased in value such huge amounts relative to inflation every year since 1986. Once restrictive gun laws are passed, they are very rarely reversed, so I would stand by my advice that pre-86 transferable machine guns are a good investment.

Yes, there is an element of risk involved in any investment, but I'd rate my chances of winning the lottery and not needing to worry about saving as hugely greater than either the 1934 or the 1986 acts being repealed at any point in the near future. I'd think that any change in political climate big enough for that to occur would be so obvious and build over so much time that you'd be able to see it coming from miles away and sell any items destined to lose their value at that point.

For all of our sakes, I hope that your optimism is correct, but all my knowledge and experience tells me that it is not, and we are going to see more restrictions rather than less, and even though I'm formally trained as a biologist rather than an economist, I can see the value in owning something with a very limited and decreasing supply and nearly limitless demand. It seems like, if you had the money, going through the steps to set up a trust (which seems to allow you to avoid most of the trouble I'm guessing you're referring to), get a tax stamp, and buy a pre-86 machine gun would be worth the time and trouble because you would end up with something very unique for a private citizen in this country, a fun toy, and an item for which there is high demand and almost certainly increasing value when you decide to sell.
 
The answer is yes, of course, any durable physical commodity is a pretty good hedge against inflation, and a very very very good hedge against rampant inflation, which SOME think is coming. Like buying precious metal boullion, you DO have the problem of storage, insurance, & security, which you wouldn't have with a paper-based investment in a commodity, such as gold or silver ETFs. Generally, quality handguns and EBRs only go UP in value, as do milsurp rifles - all significantly beyond the T-bill rate. There are some exceptions (such as the 08-09 Obama bubble), but that's the general trend. Other longguns generally also go up in value as well, but whether they beat the inflationary rate is iffy; depends on other factors.

Right now interest rates are so ridiculously low that guns are a better investment in the SHORT & MEDIUM run right now than ever before, when you compare the value increase versus a T-bill, CD, or similar. Not a GREAT investment, but better than other non-risky alternatives.

A $1,000 MSAR STG-556 I'm guessing will be worth over $2,000 in value then next time a homeland defense rifle ban is proposed, which could be in 4 years, or 10 years, or 15 years, but that's a 100% return. If an HDR ban and/or standard capacity mag ban is PASSED, well they may be worth $3,500 or more. Of course if there's NO grandfather clause in said passed legislation, then it will be worth $0.00 on the legal market, and yet at the same time, worth $5,000 or more on the illegal market, if you're willing to "become" a criminal.

Anyone who bought a registered machine gun prior to 1986 made the best investment in history, short of Goldman Sachs / Hillary Clinton insider trade deal.

By the way, some think gold will continue to go up well over $1,500 / oz. before it comes back down in a year or two, due to the Fed's apparent stubbon stance of refusing to reverse its current ultra-liberal monetary policy, no matter what, until the economy fully recovers.
 
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Collector Value is mute during a time when SHTF, Everything will only go for its true worth. Just like Gold and Silver! No one in there right mind will give up goods worth $1500 for a 1oz gold coin made in 1880 worth "Spot" ($1175) + collector value of $325. Thats why you buy Gold and Silver Rounds, instead of Collector Coins. I will say that the same goes for a Colt SAA 1st gen, Or a Full auto machine gun.
 
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Your Tec-9 is full auto? And are you experienced at pricing "poltical risk"? Do you think they will go up another 1000% as restrictive gun laws, which drove up their price, are reversed? Does that sound at all logical to you?

Nope, there is nothing about your post that sounds logical to me. The purpose of paragraphs is to seperate distinct ideas. Try re-reading what I wrote with that in mind :) Those were examples used to illustrate how someone could invest in guns in order to answer the OP's question. I have no idea where you aquired your implications.

To restate my post. The trick is to determine what will become a limited production item (for whatever reason). Over time the item can only become more rare (due to a variety of factors). Since supply and demand is what sets price you'd be in good shape as an investor because demand (population) is expanding while supply is shrinking.

This is also considered a pistol in my state -
KrissV1.jpg

Do you think politicians will not ban that ^ under the next national assault weapon bill? Do you think the price won't double over night after that happens? Do you want to buy a bridge? :D
 
If things get so bad that you're relying on your guns to get you through it, you'd best be thinking black market. They'll be illegal to own before that happens.
 
I used to read this a lot in the old gun mags.

I have been buying and selling guns - mostly handguns- since the 1970's, and never found it true. I feel I am lucky to break even. I never was a collecter, I just liked to shoot and tinker with guns, and I probably lost enough money to pay for my house doing it, but I did have a good time. I am retired now, and not doing what I thought I'd be doing-not shooting or hunting hardly at all-and have sold a lot of my guns to finance other interests. I really have 2 things to tell you:
First, investment grade guns are very risky to buy. Collecters KNOW what they have, usually sell the chaff and keep the wheat, and there are a TON of fakes of different degrees of almost any collectable gun there is. If you find a bargain, either be ABSOLUTELY SURE what you are buying or get ready to run.

Second: Collectors/dealers KNOW what they are buying. If you go to sell to a dealer, you are fortunate to get half of what he can sell it for, and believe me he already has a price and probably a buyer in mind when he buys. You could be stuck with a very expensive gun you can't readily sell, which is money you can't use. Also, you will hear how great a gun is when you are buying, and what a POS it is when you try to sell. ( I used to sell to a dealer who complained I was "unloading all my junk" on him. I bought most of it from him to begin with.)

If you get into guns for investment, study extensively, collect what you are interested in and only buy when you are absolutely certain of what you are buying and that you will be able to sell. Remember too, buying when prices are high is not the way to do it.

Good luck.

mark
 
I cynically thought to myself during the last presidential election that I should take every dollar I have and buy one shipping container worth of handgun ammo with a variety of common rounds.

I would be rich today.

Had I really thought it out I would have bought a truckload of 380 ammo and got really rich.

Years ago I thought to myself that I should buy a Colt Anaconda as an investment back when they were being made. The dang thing had too big of grip so I did not want it.

When I was in highschool M1 Carbines were cheap and no one wanted them, that would have made some money.
 
Unless you're buying extremely valuable and hard-to-find collectible firearms, guns do not tend to hold their value.

At best, they will generally keep track with the price of inflation.

I have to agree with this statement. Just because gun and ammo prices shot up rapidly last year does not make them any different than any other durable consumer asset. Actually, durable goods like guns tend to be harder to sell during a deep recession even though their market value may be artificially inflated.

Our local classifieds are full of used guns for decent prices right now, and hardly any of them are actually selling. Honestly, if you want to make a solid profit on guns, you sort of missed the boat by about a year now. Next time, buy lots of guns and ammo when there is a pro-gun political landscape, and sell them all when the anti's take over again.
 
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