Help me sort the myth from the fact

[Neener79]

To make a long story short, I was at the range today with my PSL. I guess 7.62x54r surplus ammunition often has a mild steel core. I was shooting with a buddy, and we got talking about the ammo. He shoots a Garand in .30-06 and wants some armor piercing ammo for it. He was telling me about how much steel it could go through, and that my PSL would do the same. He was also going on about these "Barnes Banded Solid" bullets and how great they were against metal.

Does this steel core ammo penetrate that much more than say a regular factory fmj hunting bullet? What's the structural difference between a regular FMJ, a bullet with a core, and a "banded solid" ? How do these differences change penetration characteristics in dirt, wood, metal, etc? Do I need to be concerned about this for casual range shooting?

 

[Jeff F]

Does this steel core ammo penetrate that much more than say a regular factory fmj hunting bullet?

If your talking about AP ammo like the 30-06 black tip or .303 British black tip then yes it penetrates steel way better then standard FMJ ball ammo.

If your talking about steel jacketed bullets like in most Russian steel cased ammo then no, it will perform just like normal ball.

Can't help with the banded solids, I have no experience with them.

 

[Deus Machina]

Does this steel core ammo penetrate that much more than say a regular factory fmj hunting bullet?

You shouldn't use FMJ to hunt with. That aside, steel-jacketed rounds will probably go a little further through steel than copper-jacketed. You'll never notice the difference.

I've never noticed steel cored rounds to have any advantage unless they're specifically intended as a penetrater.

What's the structural difference between a regular FMJ, a bullet with a core, and a "banded solid" ?

A regular FMJ is, essentially, a copper jacket poured full of lead, or with the lead stamped in to fill it. A bullet with a core is the same, except the core is sealed in. No difference functionally, unless it's up to or protruding from the tip, as a piercing point.

A banded solid is just that. It's one solid piece of some copper alloy, with grooves cut into the bearing surface to create the bands. This only lowers the surface area and material that must be swaged down to contact the rifling. It's pretty hard to squeeze down a solid piece, so the bands make that easier to cut down on wear and pressure.

How do these differences change penetration characteristics in dirt, wood, metal, etc? Do I need to be concerned about this for casual range shooting?

If you buy armor-piercing rounds (I believe 7.62x54r silvertip counts), you might not want to shoot it indoors. It can bang up a concrete backstop and, while it shouldn't affect you, the range owners might not like it.

An AP round will go more easily through wood. Obviously, you shouldn't use metal targets with it.

For dirt, the only difference will be the differing weight. Steel-core ammo is often slightly lighter than that with solid lead cores. Solids, lighter still. As a casual shooter, you won't notice at all.

 

[crazyjennyblack]

Well, I'm gonna turn this question on its head, and hopefully not get too far off topic. In a .30-06, if you were going to shoot an animal that's hard to stop (like a big bear or a cape buffalo or something) which is what those barnes solid bullets are supposed to be used for, which would be better - an armor piercing round, or one of those solid bullets, and why?

 

[KansasPaul]

To stop animals you want a bullet to penetrate and expand. Expansion creates a wound channel thus leading to bleeding and it can contribute to hydraulic shock. Full jacketed bullets would tend to go right through a thin skinned animal such as a deer because of penetration and lack of expansion. A bullet designed for expansion, such as one good for deer, would likely expand too soon on a thick skinned animal, such as a cape buffalo, and would likely make it very angry with said shooter. So, the Barnes bullets you describe are designed to penetrate a thick skinned, large animal before expanding. An armor piercing bullet would likely have too much penetration on said thick skinned animal and would likely not expand sufficiently. AP rounds were designed to go through metal before killing a bad guy (thin skinned animal). Barnes bullets are not meant to shoot through metal. So, if the intended target is a thick steel plate followed by ballistic gel the I would guess the winner to be the AP round. If the intended target is a nasty Kodiac Bear, then my guess is the Barnes bullet would be the winner.

Blessings

Paul

 

[OldMac]

Thats a good summary Kansas Paul. However, if the Kodiac Bear is raiding the garbage inside a steel dumpster, then I would use the AP first.

Most of the steel core 7.62x54r is mild steel and may not offer much AP benefits. It will punch through a car door(s) sheet metal like butter.

 

[ball3006]

Check your hunting regulations. Alot of states will not allow fmj ammo for hunting.....a bear is too thin skinned for solid bullets. You want one to expand transfering the shock to the animal.....chris3

 

[HorseSoldier]

Most of the steel core 7.62x54r is mild steel and may not offer much AP benefits. It will punch through a car door(s) sheet metal like butter.

Every round I've ever put into or seen put into a car door will, pistol calibers and up. That's why cars are generally considered concealment rather than cover.