Hey KIDS! Lissen up!

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Had to put in my .02. Dont agree with all what Brad says but Topguns post does have a kind of 'so there' feel to it. Agree with others that there is probably more to the story. -byth
 
It works both ways too, I'm about half done cleaning up my late grandfather's Arisaka type 99 with an intact chrysanthemum. The rifle is'nt even near ready to fire, or probably will ever be. its in TERRIBLE condition. I mostly wanted it for a wall-hanger to memorialize my grandfather. So i spent my free time maticulously cleaning every little bit of rust out of every nook and cranny of that rifle, and now my grandmother (who said i could have the contents of the gun cabinet, and HATES GUNS) has decided she wants to bring them all with her when she moves to Texas this winter! :cuss: :banghead: :cuss:

... oh well, i'll probably just get them willed back to me in a couple of years. :evil:
 
... late grandfather's Arisaka type 99 with an intact chrysanthemum...my grandmother...HATES GUNS...has decided she wants to bring them all with her when she moves to Texas this winter!
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And her phone number when she gets here will be..? I can help her out by taking that "awful gun" off her hands. :D

Brad
 
Heck, i'd *prefer* they go to someone who actually cares about 'em. Better that then let them sit in a basement getting rusty and nasty again for only god knows how long.

(Brad: donno her #, not leaving for another couple of months. Just claim your my uncle, she'll hand 'em right over. We'll plot later. :D )
 
Well I agree with Topgun.
He loves his children and he loves his guns, but he didn't know that his children didn't love his/their guns untill it was too late.

In my situation, I have neither wife nor children and I'm the youngest and expect to die last, so I will have to cultivate a friendship with an aquaintance so that I can give my guns and stuff to him and his family.

Just my $0.02 worth.
 
Fella's;

I've made a list of the guns, what they are worth in X year's dollars, & who gets what. Some will not be used for the foreseeable future, as they are LHB's, but I've directed the kids to hold on to them & pass them down to the next lefty in the direct family.

No real way to enforce my wishes that I know of, but the kids were raised to respect & appreciate firearms. If I did my job, they should do theirs.

900F
 
I even bought them both gun safes when they had kids and got married. I didn't want my grandkids playing with guns with working parents.
My daughter even remarked several times how she would always remember the day that I took ..both.. of my 20 ga. 870's apart and switched the wood and metal and made one PERFECT 870 to give her when she left home.

BUT..... I recently found that she had let her hubby use that 870 and he had put it away with BLOOD all over it and now it is a pitted rustbucket.

Well, I had GIVEN the guns to the kids without "strings" attached (as all gifts should be) but that little 870 shock made me decide to also ask my SON about the Colt I had given him long ago that both my dad and I used to win trophies with. He didn't know where it was.

"Isn't it in the safe?" I dumbly asked.

"The safe's full." was the reply.

Now, what the safe is full OF is none of my business. But as of last week, I completed the sale of every last one of my "collector" guns. (I cheated and kept one "Black Widow" Luger)

The guns are gone now. Harsh? Maybe, but I have always sort of considered that I was just the "caretaker" of the guns and unrealistically expected that that attitude would carry forward and maybe someday, someone would get some nice guns that had passed through MANY generations.

Folly.

It's a "mixed bag." I sort of miss the guns. But I also feel better knowing that (due to the price) they now WILL be "cared for." Maybe the buyer will also find himself in the same situation someday. I hope not, but there's really no way to know.
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It isn't about the guns here, it is about a dashed hope of continuing a tradition.

Topgun was attempting to pass on his guns as heirlooms to eventually bridge to generations that he'd never live to see. The harsh reality of that being negated through callous disregard and negligence bothered him enough to at least give someone a chance to possibly pass them on to future generations, even if it sadly isn't Topgun's descendants.

By treating his gifts the way they do, his family are basically saying that they aren't worth giving to their children- or even them. While they were free to do what they wished with the guns (even letting them turn to junk and not even caring where they were), they could have at least had the decency to wait till Topgun was in the grave.

Some of us here do get it, Topgun.

.
 
My maternal grandfather had a few guns and died before I was born. I'm (sadly because it doesn't allow me to shoot with them) the only one in the family who likes them. When my parents split up in the early 90's, I inherited a Springfield Trapdoor, a Mossberg 46a(m) and a Winchester 97. Nothing much. My brother got a Mannlicher-Berthier 1892/27.

Like an idiot I shot some .45-70 reloads from the Trapdoor during high school in the early 80's before I knew much of anything. Put a hairline crack in the stock coming back from the breech hinge. That crack has haunted me for 215 years. I found the rifle my brother had...he had been keeping it in his damp garage for years. It was a dirty rusty mess. For penance on the Trapdoor I carefully restored that little carbine. All the rest are lovingly cared for.
 
I've always made a point of returning things in better condition than I got them.

My father-in-law let me borrow his Ithaca Model 37 to take my wife goose hunting several years ago. The gun was somewhat abused when I got it- some rust, the barrel was pretty badly leaded from years of shooting slugs, the stock had many spots where the finish was worn down to bare wood. Before I returned it to him, I had removed the rust with fine steel wool/wd-40, rubbed several coats of BLO into the stock to protect it, deleaded the barrel, and detail stripped/cleaned and oiled the entire gun- something that no doubt has never been done with it. Needless to say, he was pretty happy with it when it was returned.
:cool:

Did the same thing with firearms my dad has lent me over the years- now if I ask him to lend me something, he adds others and says "here, shoot these too:D " Of course, he's given me a few nice pieces to keep for good also.

My mother is on the other end of things. My grandfather had promised her his model 12 winchester, but he died before he gave it to her. One of my Mom's no-good brothers ended up borrowing it from my grandmother and ended up pawning it:cuss: My grandmother also has my grandfather's Service Revolver from when he was in the Army Air Corps along with a couple of nice colts. None of her kids are into shooting much, other than my mother and the one deadbeat brother that pawned the shotgun, but I hope my grandfather's revolvers go to a good home when all is said and done. To me these would be true teasures, though its not my business to even ask about them.
 
Torpid, I feel for you. And I think you did the right thing.

Those of us who collect things often think, as you do, that we are merely caretakers for these pieces of history. I know with some old guns I own (even those that were not gifts) I respect the fact that they represent a time/place/event that was significant. An example is an M-1 carbine my dad gave me-I appreciate it as a gift, but also realize that it almost certainly was carried in the defense of our nation. Not mine to butcher or tinker with.

I'm glad to relate that our family has fared somewhat better with our 'hereditary' arms. In fact, my youngest is currently in possession of an old .22 single shot that belonged to his great-grandfather. He taught my dad to shoot with it, and my dad taught my brother and I to shoot with it. It was, at various times, 'owned' by every male in the family. My son also understands that it is expected that this rifle passes to his young cousin when the time is right, and eventually it will pass among each of their children.

This rifle has literally taught every member of my family to shoot. We have, each of us, had the thrill of having it taken out of the safe and given to us 'for our very own.' And the fathers among us have had the thrill of passing it to our next generation; arguably a greater thrill than receiving it was.

Families are made of bonds like this-commonalitites that tie us together. I would urge you to look past your (understandable) upset at your children's actions and try to encourage your grandchildren to understand what a passed-on firearm can mean.

Larry
 
Topgun said:
I've just completed a very difficult decision. I love my kids and I love my guns. My kids are in their early 40's. Along the way, I have given guns to them. Nice guns.
I even bought them both gun safes when they had kids and got married. I didn't want my grandkids playing with guns with working parents.
My daughter even remarked several times how she would always remember the day that I took ..both.. of my 20 ga. 870's apart and switched the wood and metal and made one PERFECT 870 to give her when she left home.

BUT..... I recently found that she had let her hubby use that 870 and he had put it away with BLOOD all over it and now it is a pitted rustbucket.

Well, I had GIVEN the guns to the kids without "strings" attached (as all gifts should be) but that little 870 shock made me decide to also ask my SON about the Colt I had given him long ago that both my dad and I used to win trophies with. He didn't know where it was.

"Isn't it in the safe?" I dumbly asked.

"The safe's full." was the reply.

Now, what the safe is full OF is none of my business. But as of last week, I completed the sale of every last one of my "collector" guns. (I cheated and kept one "Black Widow" Luger)

The guns are gone now. Harsh? Maybe, but I have always sort of considered that I was just the "caretaker" of the guns and unrealistically expected that that attitude would carry forward and maybe someday, someone would get some nice guns that had passed through MANY generations.

Folly.

It's a "mixed bag." I sort of miss the guns. But I also feel better knowing that (due to the price) they now WILL be "cared for." Maybe the buyer will also find himself in the same situation someday. I hope not, but there's really no way to know.

So, kids, if you really WANT to get the old man's guns, please be aware that TAKING CARE OF WHAT YOU GET may have a real payoff for you.

:(
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I won't go into a lot of detail, but I'm not kidding, I feel your pain. Recently found out, of the 11 firearms I bought my grand daughter, 5 are left. 4 of those are, and always have been in my safe. Seems they disappear when others have them.. She is 11, and I always wanted to buy her a gun, for every year of her life. I can't prove anything about what happened, but both of us KNOW! She loves her guns, and it sucks, what is happening. I will controll future purchases for her. LIVE AND LEARN!
 
Topgun, I feel ya man. You did the right thing. Since you stated that the buyer(s) paid good money for your guns, I doubt they were purchased for resale or proft. More likely, another gun lover like most of us, who will take good care of them. Only one person here doesn't get it, so I would'nt let his arrogant derogatory remarks bother you as much as they bother me. Sounds like HE wants you to handle YOUR guns the way HE thinks they should be handled. :cool:
 
Brad, I understand your position and did consider it. I'm a retired pawnbroker and KNOW what heirs can do with inherited stuff.

I don't agree with your view, but you're welcome to it. It's part of the new abandoning of responsibilities trend and is one reason that families in America are having a hard time progressing financially.

I still have 15 "shooters" that they are welcome to. My estate will be divided but one kid will only get an INCOME trust. No way I will drop a bundle on that kid.

These guns were NOT "shooters." Sure, they'd shoot and shoot fine, but they were COLLECTOR guns and what I did will benefit more shooters and collectors down the line.

The guy who bought em is younger than I and has a substantial gun collection. He has kids too. Maybe his kids will also ruin them, but I put the money into another of my passions, gold.

If I happen not to SPEND my gold in my dotage, I doubt anyone will treat it so cavalierly or let it get all crapped up.

In your definition, I am sure you would say I am "controlling" as that seems to be the current cocktail party banter nowadays. I just don't see the benefit in KNOWINGLY continuing to give anything to unappreciative recipients. If you do, fine.
 
Who

raised the kids? uh huh.

and taught em what?

yep. and how much of it stuck?

hmm. so you are complaining about What exactly? parenting skills?

reap what you sow? is that the phrase?

if a student doesn't learn, the teacher didn't teach.

where did i go wrong?
oh, wait, that's the phrase i Didn't See.
 
It's part of the new abandoning of responsibilities trend
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Well, I had GIVEN the guns to the kids without "strings" attached
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Unless you were playing another angle, I don't see how you can reconcile these two views. If the guns were given without strings, what responsibilities were there? Unless you made conditions, you can't be miffed about what someone does with a gift.

On the flip side, your collection was yours to do with as you would. I can't blame you for refusing to put items dear to your heart in the hands of those who wouldn't care for them.
 
so you are complaining about What exactly? parenting skills?

reap what you sow? is that the phrase?

if a student doesn't learn, the teacher didn't teach.
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Now those statements are crap.

Sometimes there are kids that go their own way despite coming from good families and being taught proper values.

Yeah some folks raise rotten kids with no respect and it is their fault but normally parents only have so much control over how their kids turn out.


As a parent of three kids I'm working my ass off trying to make them into good citizens. If I fail (knocks on wood and crosses fingers) I can still feel confident that I did my best.

I'm not saying topguns kids are rotten they just might not fully appreciate and share a certain number of his values.
 
The term white elephant comes to mind. I don't recall if the term originated in India or elsewhere, but a white elephant was revered and could not be worked. It still ate prodigiously, but could not give any return on the investment. It worked a hardship on the beneficiary, rather than a benefit.

Many of us have cherished and lovingly restored firearms because they are a source of joy to us, but they just don't have that same significance to our heirs. I have Dad's old pheasant gun and I take it out and shoot (or at least try to shoot) ringnecks with it every year, because it brings me a little closer to him and the many other, mostly intangible legacies he left me. I also have an old Colt 1861 navy he left me as the eldest son, but he never fired it and it caused a bit of animosity in the family. That is a source of hurt that I will sell because Dad never used it, just received it from an uncle. The proceeds will go to all siblings in equal shares. It's a thing, and things are bought, sold and destroyed every day.

It's not about monetary value. Sentimental value can be conveyed in one or two firearms, but no one will ever know or appreciate our personal relationship with each of our guns, Better to bestow one or two of our users on offspring, for whatever it means to them, and see that our other guns end up with those who can and will appreciate them, if not for their association with us, for their historical and other value.
 
raised the kids? uh huh.

and taught em what?

yep. and how much of it stuck?

hmm. so you are complaining about What exactly? parenting skills?

reap what you sow? is that the phrase?

if a student doesn't learn, the teacher didn't teach.

where did i go wrong?
oh, wait, that's the phrase i Didn't See.
Click to expand...
Oh horse hockey there are countless factors that go into how a kid will end up other then just the parenting. Part of my extended family has two kids, one son and one daughter. Their daughter became succesful in the computer industry and brings in a little over a million a year. Their son? He is lucky to bring in 30 and has strugged with drug and alcohol abuse his entire life. Just blaming how someone turns out on their parents isn't always near true. You can have the best parents in the world have a kid that turns out to be a scumbag. And scumbags can produce doctors, lawyers, scientists, etc.

Did he give it to them expecting the gifts to not be mistreated and allowed to become garbage. Certianly not something he put together with his own two hands be put away with blood on it and left to rot. Or a prized possesion given with pride to be lost god knows where in god knows what condition while who knows what takes its place in the safe.

No string attached does not mean he has to go and let them destroy more prized possesions and family heirlooms. Just because they destroyed no strings attached gifts he should just give them more to destroy? No sorry Im glad you arn't my kid with an outlook like that.
 
My Kids Aren't .......rotten......

They did rotten things with valuable guns I gave them.

I consider it STUPID to continue giving valuable things to people....ANY PEOPLE...who won't value and preserve them.

Got it?

They would have CHERISHED an electronic gizmo but I don't have any of those.

Don't hate the kids. Hate what they did to the guns.

So....they ain't gettin no more guns.


Seems sensible to me.
 
As to the "point" of the post, it is simply posted on a GUN forum to tell anyone who really WANTS a gun collection to either demonstrate some interest in it or take care of any PREVIOUS gifts.

:)
 
Top-
If I offended you my appologies it wasn't my intent to imply your kids were rotten, it was ment to demonstrait to the comments I quoted.

That said I agree completly with those two posts
 
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