Hi everbody!--New member/two questions

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fixrspazz

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Dec 15, 2011
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I found this site while Googling for info on sighting in my Saiga 7.62x39. This is the first small arms site I've come across that is not chock full of inconsiderate flaming d-bags who don't know what they're talking about. After reading the sighting-in info, I read about the 922r conversion and watched the video. I believe I could handle doing that! Can't wait to order the parts!

Now, two unrelated questions:

1) Is there a stripper clip guide for the Saiga 7.62 factory mags? Been on several parts sites and can't find one.

2) I know this is gonna open a big can of beans, but here goes: Regarding the AR-15 variants, which companies, in your opinion, are the WORST in terms of fit, finish and function? From whom shall I run screaming? If I build one from parts myself, who makes a good upper and lower?

Thanks!
 
Welcome to the day care center! Any number can play! :D

The deal here is that folks who do insults and flaming don't last long. Our rules are quite clear on that.

Q #1, I don't know. Q #2, you're gonna get a bunch of answers, and many of them will be in disagreement with others. Good luck. :)
 
Thanks, Art! Yeah, I know it's going to get messy, but I'm hoping some consensus will emerge about the "worst of the worst"!
 
First, Welcome to THR. I can't help on your first question because I'm not an AK variant expert.

As for your second question, Hesse/Blackthorn/Vulcan and Century are the only AR-15 variants I'd run screaming from.

DPMS can be hit or miss, particularly on barrels & assembled bolt carrier groups, but even they turn out some good parts. I've also seen my fair share of Bushmasters with undersized chambers, and poorly staked carrier keys. Rock River, shockingly enough, also cuts many corners on assembly, but their parts are still usually pretty good.

BCM, Colt, Daniel Defense, LMT, and Noveske are all top shelf. S&W makes great rifles from low price budget models on up, but they don't sell many parts.

The bigger questions are: First, how hard are you going to run the rifle; and, Second, what is your intended use / application for it?
 
Thanks, ugaarguy! Intended "run" is about 200-300 rounds/month at outdoor range for skill sharpening. Intended use is RKBA/SHTF rifle in a platform I'm familiar with (courtesy of my kindly Uncle Sam). Don't need a match grade tack driver, regular MILSPEC style and performance at urban combat ranges, should the need arise. Wish list items would be the fixed stock/carry handle/triangular handguard configuration of my youth, but I understand that these things are harder to come by now.
 
Go to this site: http://m4carbine.net/

Read and search the threads until your cross-eyed, then read some more. Go through all the stickies and wear out the search button. It's an acquired taste but there is no better repository of knowledge about ARs that work for a living. Don't go there thinking you'll convince anyone that a Olyriver Delmaster is GTG or that a Colt, Daniel Defense or BCM is over priced, it'll go hard on ya. Go to learn and it's a great resource
 
As for your second question, Hesse/Blackthorn/Vulcan and Century are the only AR-15 variants I'd run screaming from.
Click to expand...
+1 on this.

Don't know about any Saga...But I've built two RRA lower's for my match uppers. Last standard RRA lower was only about $60.00. You might find your A1 butt stock at surplus parts stores. The A2 butt stock is a little longer and may fit better. The A1 hand guards might be also found in the surplus stores, on line of course.

About the cheapest worthwhile lower parts kit I've found is at White Oak Arms. These boys have a lower kit (about $40.00) and don't sell junk so you know you are getting good quality parts. The kit contains all the small parts ( i can't remember if it had the push pins.) to put a lower together except the rear stock, recoil spring and buffer/buffer tube. Be aware there is a difference between a A1 and A2 stock, recoil spring and buffer tube, There might be cheaper parts but I will pay a few extra dollars for what I know are good parts. I put a 1911 together using the very cheapest parts I could find and I won't waste my time and $ doing that again. Brownells is a good source of parts and tools. A lower only takes about 30 minutes to build after doing the first one. If you go to the White Oak site you will understand why they use good parts. White Oak is almost tippy toe top shelf for match service rifles. I have two WOP match uppers and am very happy with them. Besides, the gal on the phone sounds nice.

I do know the A1 shot pretty good over all and really did group well. I also know using the happy switch ran though some ammo fairly quickly. I would lean towards a little better barrel just to keep what you remember correct. Finding Black Hills blue box 223 will also help no matter what bullet weight. This is factory reloaded ammo which has proven to shoot pretty dang good in about any AR you can use it in. (except maybe the Hesse/Blackthorn/Vulcan and Century)

I see no reason why you could not build a repo A1 right down to the flash hider if you live in a free state, except maybe the happy stwich withstanding.
 
Having researched and built an AR, I found more realistic information at arfcom. Their Build It Yourself forum has stickies on assembly and plenty of photos to show what makers put out.

There's no cost savings to building an AR, simply because the factories buy 1,000's of parts and get the serious discounts - but you buy parts one at a time or in small kits, pay retail, and shipping, too. That alone can add $75 - $125 to the total cost, and recommendations to purchase expensive tools for a one time build will add that again. It pays to research and discover what you really need.

The biggest mistake AR fan make is choosing the most macho looking version to copy, then discovering all the expense to make it look cool doesn't necessarily make it work well for them. Since one shot out of the barrel makes all the parts used, after swapping things around, they finally come up with a relativley finalized version that cost nearly double.

Entirely why the exact purpose of the gun needs to be nailed down. What targets, at what distances will it be shot at? Once determined, then pick the optimum cartridge, and barrel length. All to many jump on a caliber wagon without understanding whether it really fits what they need, like the beginner three gun competitor who chooses an alternate cartridge instead of the more common and much cheaper military round. Even if the maker promises $9.00 a box ammo, signed in their blood, it's still twice as high as imported running at $4.50. Nobody blows money away for no gain very long.

Another aspect is accuracy, as if a gun that isn't extremely precise is worthless. The military standard is 2MOA, which is good enough to put rounds into a ten inch circle 500m downrange. The effective strike zone on a 150 pound live target is still 18-24", plenty good enough. But, somehow, the locker room talk creeps in, and if you and your gun can't do twice as good, then somehow a physical and character inference is made. Apparently it's very important to some to do that, especially anonymously. Chest thumping and measuring have nothing to do with performance. The best shooter in the world can get by pretty well with a cheap gun, the raw newb can't do very well with even a $2,500 tricked out race gun. Buying expensive, special parts doesn't make the shooter - the shooter makes the parts.

Avoid those two mistakes, and the genius of the AR can work for you. Indulge in fantasy calculations, and not only will your cash flow suffer, but the gun may not serve nearly up to expectation.
 
You might also consider PSA. I just bought one of their lowers on sale for $49.95 ($56.95 w/shipping), and I must say it looks pretty good. Combine that with their complete rifle kit (minus lower) for $514.99 delivered and you have a pretty good rifle for under $575.
 
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