High capacity magazine legality question.

[Quickbeam]

My question is about a statute of limitations to the California high-capacity magazine ban. I know that it is illegal to assemble or import one of these magazines in California. Now, keep in mind that I do not plan on doing this, but if someone did happen to bring a post-ban high capacity magazine into the state and he/she was ignorant of the ban. How many years would have to pass before the offense would no longer be actionable (the right word?) by the courts?

I appreciate all of your input.

 

[wlemay]

I am not sure about the specifics of the law, however I one time I purchased a 30 round promag brand magazine and it broke so I was told to send it to the company for repairs... the company address I was directed to ship it to was in california.

I think there are certain circumstances that may allow you to posses hi caps ie( there were in the state before the law was passed) however I see no way to enforce that law because almost no mags have serial numbers or dates to prove that they are pre-ban.

As far as i know there is no amount of time that has to pass to make a crime "not actionable" I mean a crime is a crime and I would say that if you got caught you would be screwed. Like I said before there is no way to prove how long you have had the mag for.

 

[cbrgator]

As far as i know there is no amount of time that has to pass to make a crime "not actionable" I mean a crime is a crime and I would say that if you got caught you would be screwed.

That is completely inaccurate. I mean no disrespect, but I urge you not to offer advice about subjects in which you lack knowledge, especially in reference to criminal law. That can cause people harm.

To the OP, there is definitely a statute of limitations on such a crime. Based on the CA Penal Code, it looks like the statute of limitations is 3 years, though I highly encourage you speak with a CA attorney. If you haven't broken the law, and I know you said you don't intend to, I must still encourage you not to. Even if it's a stupid law, do not disobey it.

 

[W.E.G.]

Ignorance of the law is not a defense.

Possession of contraband is a continuing offense.

 

[Ramone]

W.E.G. is correct- the law prohibits possession of standard capacity magazines, so statue of limitations would only cover a hypothetical accidental import then destruction or disposal of such an item.

 

[Ryanxia]

Ramone said it but W.E.G. is right, this would be a situation where you are in possession of something so I don't believe there would be any statute of limitations. <edite>

 

[9mmepiphany]

There is a lot of bad information in this thread. The law is complicated, but very specific. Allow me to try to clarify some of it

I am not sure about the specifics of the law...

...however I see no way to enforce that law because almost no mags have serial numbers or dates to prove that they are pre-ban.

This isn't completely true...if you look on the baseplates of some factory Sig magazines (I haven't looked at others) you'll see that there is a date of manufacture molded into them. However the reality is that if these post-ban magazines have been permanently converted to 10 round capacity, they are then legal to own

Possession of contraband is a continuing offense.

W.E.G. is correct- the law prohibits possession of standard capacity magazines, so statue of limitations would only cover a hypothetical accidental import then destruction or disposal of such an item.

The law does not prohibit possession of magazines with a larger capacity than 10 rounds.

It is a felony to Import, Manufacture, Sell, Loan or Transfer a magazine with a capacity greater than 10 rounds, it doesn't say anything about it being illegal to own them. It may sound odd, but is extremely logical if you think about it...the law wasn't passed to take away the legally acquired property of residents

How many years would have to pass before the offense would no longer be actionable (the right word?) by the courts?

Like I said before there is no way to prove how long you have had the mag for.

This would be the interesting point, how do you prove when you committed the felony, that they should not prosecute you for....remember that this is an affirmative defense, you have to first admit that you committed the act

The Statute of Limitations is three (3) years

I'd highly recommend you become a member of CalGuns.net for answers to you CA specific magazine questions

 

[Tomcat47]

The best line of defense would be relocation out of california!

No all jokes aside that is a tough one on a legal stand point, if you or someone you know has this issue a consult with an actual lawyer would be the best route to take.

And consults are usually free or cheap! Which is a fine price for correct advice!

MO......

 

[Prince Yamato]

It's also NOT a crime to obtain a magazine by merely "finding" one.

 

[Quickbeam]

I suppose I would have to talk to a lawyer to be sure. Thanks for everyone's input. I would be curious to talk to someone who has actually been prosecuted for importing a hi-cap magazine sometime after the actual act of moving the contra-band.

I would imagine that this is the kind of law that would get dumb criminals in even more trouble after they have already been arrested.

 

[9mmepiphany]

I don't think it was too long ago when the CA DOJ made about 6 arrest for this...it was in the newspapers

Folks were going to the Reno gun show and returning with illegal large capacity magazines...they stopped them just this side of the stateline...might be a bit hard to talk to them, I believe they are still in custody

 

[Quickbeam]

Those people were stopped as they were breaking the law. I only wonder about those who ignorantly broke the law and got away with it and only later were prosecuted. How long later? I dunno, a week or ten years.

 

[Harley Quinn]

Here is a thought...

If you own a M 17 Glock (had high cap mags back in 80's and still own it) one of your high cap mags starting to malfunction...Can you replace it with a high cap, or do you go to a 10, as law mentions now

 

[9mmepiphany]

You can rebuild it with parts to maintain the original capacity

 

[Harley Quinn]

Thanks 9mmepiphany

 

[wlemay]

That is completely inaccurate. I mean no disrespect, but I urge you not to offer advice about subjects in which you lack knowledge, especially in reference to criminal law. That can cause people harm.

I think it would be silly for anyone to take any legal advice from people on the internet, especially anonymous forums such as this one. He clearly stated he had no intention of breaking the law; he was merely asking a hypothetical question.

My reply did not in any way encourage him to break the law, I meant it to be a post to persuade him not to. The quote you reference from me makes my position clear that with most magazines there is no way to prove whether they are new or old; pre-ban or post ban or otherwise owned for such a time to make it a "non actionable" crime. You could very well own a pre-ban magazine or have illegally bought one say 3 years ago and "not be guilty of committing a crime," or "not be actionable in court", however if you were caught; how would you prove your innocence?

I see no harm in my comments, and I do take take your comments as border line disrespectful to me. Especially since you turned around telling this person:

Based on the CA Penal Code, it looks like the statute of limitations is 3 years

To me that claim carries some weight and could cause this person harm from taking your word, for it ( I am not calling you a liar, I believe you know the law). All I was doing was playing it safe telling this person that as far as I know there is no period of time to make a crime in actionable (for something like this there might as well not be) since as I stated with a matter such as this, there is no way to prove your innocence; some mags have serial numbers and dates, but the vast majority do not and I would think even fewer people keep records of transactions or any real paper work that proves they did not commit a crime (or that they committed a crime years ago).

I say when dealing with something that could get you in that much trouble, it's not worth playing around in the legal gray areas, even if you think you know the law, the authorities might see things differently. Especially since there would be almost no evidence to prove your innocence, but there would a high cap mag to prove your guilt.

Thats my take on it (not that I agree with the law, but it aint worth risking it!), say what you want; but I am just playing it safe here. Don't encourage this guy to do something he might regret.

 

[TheRespectableGentleman]

Does a drum barrel count as an extended magazine?

 

[9mmepiphany]

Does a drum barrel count as an extended magazine?

You may have to be more specific, are you referring to one of these?

 

[Ramone]

The law does not prohibit possession of magazines with a larger capacity than 10 rounds.

It is a felony to Import, Manufacture, Sell, Loan or Transfer a magazine with a capacity greater than 10 rounds, it doesn't say anything about it being illegal to own them. It may sound odd, but is extremely logical if you think about it...the law wasn't passed to take away the legally acquired property of residents

I stand corrected- the NYS law is about possession, and I assumed CA was the same.

 

[Quickbeam]

Yes, in CA, possession and use are legal. Which is why I wonder how long the crime of importing them would last. I guess it would be either 3 years or indefinitely, but still the burden of proof lies on the prosecution.

 

[9mmepiphany]

but still the burden of proof lies on the prosecution.

I would highly recommend you check with a lawyer before taking that stance...I can see a problem depending on the make/model of the gun and the magazine