Hornady 165 gr SST in .308 Win

[Ej3]

I have been following the .308 hunting load work up thread and found some great information. I decided to create a new thread to ask my question in order to not get off topic.

Yesterday I went hunting for the first time and was lucky enough to kill a deer first time out. I used one of my hand loads. I had settled on using the Hornady 165 SST using IMR 4064. My rifle is a T/C Compass with 22” 1/12 twist barrel and hosting a AAC Cyclone suppressor.

My question is, should I be concerned that the bullet did not exit? I have a friend with many years of experience that insisted there should have been an exit wound. I was in a stand about 15 ft above the ground and I would say the deer was about 75 yards away. Despite shooting a hypersonic round, using the suppressor I heard a distinctive thud upon impact. The deer ran about 50 yds before dying. You can see the entry wound but no exit that we could find.

The round that killed this deer was as follows:
Caliber - .308 Win
Bullet – 165 gr SST (P/N 30452)
Powder – 42.3 gr IMR 4064
Case – Starline (new) 2.205”
Primer - WLR
COL – 2.75"
Crimp – light FCD
Avg FPS - 2635 at 63*F

The temperature yesterday evening was about 58*F. Is it unusual to have no exit wound? Obviously my hand load was effective, but again it was only about 75 yards. Should I be concerned? Maybe I should consider a 150 gr bullet with a higher velocity. Any feedback is appreciated.

 

[stringnut]

First congrats on your first deer. Without skinning it is hard to tell what went on for sure. Can't tell what ,or if, heavy bone was hit. Exits generally are large, but, not always. The SST is not a hard bullet and expansion was probably pretty extreme. Wouldn't be surprised if the bullet is under the hide on the off side. Used a lot of interlocks in the past and if a lot of bone was hit they didn't exit sometimes. This is not the end of the world. As long as it does the job you are good to go. Deer are not that tough to put down. Have recovered many bullets over the years. Lots of people have said that since the bullet didn't exit it failed. Since i was skinning the animal I say it was a success!

Pushing a lighter bullet faster won't increase penetration. The faster a bullet is going the more violently it expands. Thus penetration may be reduced. Of course this all depends on a lot of factors such as speed, what is hit, etc. If you want more penetration you need a bullet that is designed for that purpose.

 

[<*(((><]

Nice work!

Pushing a bullet faster causes more expansion. If you desire an exit wound (more reliably) then you should switch to a Interbond, partition or bonded type bullet.

The SST’s are not that tough of a bullet as was said above, likely you had significant expansion and shedding of the jacket with the velocity and distance to target. The SST bullet is designed for maximizing expansion which comes at a cost of penetration.

It obviously did it’s job as you have meat in the freezer, I would learn from this and personally would start loading with a tougher bullet. Given you’ve already been using Hornady a good bullet for deer to allow for good expansion and better penetration than the SST would be the Interlocks or a slightly tougher bullet yet the Interbonds.

 

[horsey300]

I have been following the .308 hunting load work up thread and found some great information. I decided to create a new thread to ask my question in order to not get off topic.

Yesterday I went hunting for the first time and was lucky enough to kill a deer first time out. I used one of my hand loads. I had settled on using the Hornady 165 SST using IMR 4064. My rifle is a T/C Compass with 22” 1/12 twist barrel and hosting a AAC Cyclone suppressor.

My question is, should I be concerned that the bullet did not exit? I have a friend with many years of experience that insisted there should have been an exit wound. I was in a stand about 15 ft above the ground and I would say the deer was about 75 yards away. Despite shooting a hypersonic round, using the suppressor I heard a distinctive thud upon impact. The deer ran about 50 yds before dying. You can see the entry wound but no exit that we could find.

The round that killed this deer was as follows:
Caliber - .308 Win
Bullet – 165 gr SST (P/N 30452)
Powder – 42.3 gr IMR 4064
Case – Starline (new) 2.205”
Primer - WLR
COL – 2.75"
Crimp – light FCD
Avg FPS - 2635 at 63*F

The temperature yesterday evening was about 58*F. Is it unusual to have no exit wound? Obviously my hand load was effective, but again it was only about 75 yards. Should I be concerned? Maybe I should consider a 150 gr bullet with a higher velocity. Any feedback is appreciated.
View attachment 873309 View attachment 873310

That did what ssts do, lighter faster will just get worse, pro hunters, partitions, bonded, mono, even a 165 nbtip should hold up better, as well as the above mentioned interlocks. If you HAD gotten an exit, I'd be surprised, I don't mind performance like that but I plan my shots for the detonation point. You could always load slower.

 

[jmr40]

A note; SST's earned a reputation for being too soft. But if these are newer bullets made in the last few years Hornady has gone to a thicker jacket and the bullets are now a bit tougher than the older versions.

It's about bullet construction. They range from soft to hard and SST's are on the softer end of the spectrum. They expand well at slower speeds which makes them a great bullet for long range shots where speed has dropped off. A harder bullet stays together better and penetrates deeper.

Everything is a tradeoff. Soft bullets do more damage and tend to put game down quicker, but may not give the penetration needed for larger game shot at bad angles. Hard bullets give the penetration, but animals tend to run farther and you risk not finding them. You are most likely to get the bang/flop kills with soft bullets that don't exit. But you may have to pass on shots from bad angles.

All bullets have a range of impact speeds where they work best. Most bullets work well if they impact between about 1800-2800 fps. Impact too fast and they explode on impact and don't penetrate enough. Impact too slow and they don't expand and act like FMJ. Bullets on the soft end of the spectrum might still expand at speeds slower than 1800 fps. Bullets on the harder end of the spectrum don't expand at all unless speeds are above 2000 fps, but will stay together at speeds well over 3000 fps. You need to be using premium hard bullets in magnum rifles used at closer ranges.

The bullet you used, in the rifle you used, at the speed it left the muzzle, was just fine. I'd bet that even a soft 165 gr SST at that slow speed would exit virtually every time on a deer. Your shot angle may have hit the shoulder and heavy bone, or it may have traveled nearly the entire length of the deer and may have traveled 2-3' and still not exited. That is a lot of penetration.

That same bullet leaving the muzzle of a 300 WM @ 3200 fps would have impacted well over the bullets design parameters and might have failed. As it was it worked. I'd not worry that it didn't exit. It is a good choice in a 308 at close ranges and won't drop below 1800 fps until about 500 yards. I'd choose something a little tougher for elk, but for deer it is a good choice.

 

[Bfh_auto]

Congratulations.
How was the blood trail?
An exit would makes for a better blood trail.
Half my family believes in the light fast bullet, the other half believes in heavy round nose bullets.
I don't care if I get an exit as long as I can put the bullet exactly where I want to.
If you're happy with it, don't worry.

 

[Random 8]

Congratulations on your deer. As for the Sst, as others have stated and you and I have observed, they tend not to exit. It's also been my experience that they tend to destroy a lot of meat if muscle is near the impact vector. In your weight range of 165, if you desire an exit on deer (in my experience of hunting heavy cover that is a must) you'd be well served with a standard interlock, Rem Core Lokt or Speer Hot Core. They're inexpensive, get a sample of each and see what shoots the best for you. In a 150, I'd look to a premium such as Speer GS, Nosler Partition. I shoot the Speer Mag Tip (discontinued) in my Wife's. 308 at a reduced velocity around 2600 fps. and am very pleased with results. Sufficient damage to vitals with pass through penetration and the slightly reduced 150 loading in the. 300 Savage range is very pleasant for her to shoot. Pretty sure the Speer GS 150 would perform similarly as they are a similar bullet. When I used to shoot factory. 308, I got pass through with the Winchester power point 150 if no heavy bone was hit.

 

[Arkansas Paul]

I shot that same bullet for a while in .30-06 and experienced the same thing. For whitetails it's fine. I had a few "drop em in their tracks" type kills with them because they expand so violently.
I've switched to Sierra Gameking BTHP bullets, but really couldn't tell you why. The Hornadys never failed me.

 

[Ej3]

I really appreciate all the replies. Meat in the freezer! The blood trail was minimal at first and steadily increased starting about 20 ft from where it was hit. I will try a bonded bullet.

 

[Nature Boy]

You found the deer dead, 50 yards from where you shot it.

That's a success, not a failure

Congrats!

PS. A lot is talked about "dead right there" and "drop in it's tracks". I put those sayings in the "MOA all day" category.

 

[Deadeyejedi]

I have shot many deer with many types of bullets including the sst. It seems some exited and some didnt i never really gave it a thought as to why .i suppose the hardness or softness of a bullet could have a lot to do with it .When im hunting in areas with lots of hunters i would prefer my bullet not to exit ,for obvious reasons.As with all hunting, shot placement ,imo is most important .The 308 is an excellent round and a well placed shot will always put them down exit wound or no .congrats on your deer!

 

[stillquietvoice]

Congratulations on your buck. Feels great to put them down with home rolled ammo. I too killed a spike yesterday morning with 7mm08 140 gr nosler ballistic tip 46.5 gr imr 4350.

 

[Gtscotty]

Congrats on your first deer!

I've had those 165gr SSTs do some squirrelly stuff (shedding jackets on entry, not exiting broadside deer) running them about 200 fps faster in a .30-06. They kill deer, but just seem very unpredictable compared to other bullets. I switched to Sierra Game Kings for deer and got more reliable performance with better penetration, Nosler BTs are also a similarly good option.

Now I used Accubonds for pretty much everything, they open up very well, dig deep, and since I use blems, aren't really any pricier. Accubonds would be a good option if you wanted to go to a lighter 150gr bullet.

 

[stringnut]

I really appreciate all the replies. Meat in the freezer! The blood trail was minimal at first and steadily increased starting about 20 ft from where it was hit. I will try a bonded bullet.

Nothing wrong with trying something else. Don't go overboard. Something that is known for very deep penetration may be too much of a good thing. They will do the trick, but if are too tough, may not expand well. You then can end up with a pretty sparse blood trail because of a small exit. Once again the result is the same. You recover your animal.

Really not a huge deal either way. Just make sure you can get enough velocity for the bullet to expand and you're good. Most manufacturers list a range.

 

[gotboostvr]

Even though I can't use a bottle necked cartridge in my state I do have a few batches of 165gr SGK's loaded up for my 308 that I wish I could use on whitetail.

Just chiming in to say congrats!

 

[Grumulkin]

I shot three deer the summer before last. All were bang flop and only one had an exit wound. Really, I couldn't care less if there's an exit wound.

 

[Gtscotty]

I shot three deer the summer before last. All were bang flop and only one had an exit wound. Really, I couldn't care less if there's an exit wound.

Bang-flop is nice, but you can't always count on that kind of reaction. when you get a bang-no flop, a decent blood trail can become quite important.

 

[stringnut]

Even without a pass through doesn't mean you won't get a blood trail. Within 2 or 3 jumps you will have blood out the mouth and nose as well as the entrance. It doesn't spray out 4 feet wide like hitting a rib on the entrance side and passing behind the shoulder on the exit. However , it is more than sufficient.

Some of the sparsist blood trails I have seen have been pass throughs. This occurs with a high lung hit when no bone is hit going in. The lungs have to fill up before any blood comes out. I have seen them go 30 to 50 yards without a drop. Usually a huge spray then and your deer is within 20 yards or so. Sometimes this drops them
like a rock. I believe , as the OP stated, that it shocks the spine.

All I know is that if you put a hole in both lungs it doesn't matter if the bullet exits or not. Your deer isn't going far.

I like pass throughs on broadside shots because then I know it will penetrate enough for straight on or quartering . Happy thanksgiving and hunting everyone.

 

[whatnickname]

Congratulations on your first deer! Good job. You have just discovered a universal truth regarding Hornady SST bullets. I’ve killed deer with the following SST bullets:

6.5X55 / 129 grain doing about 2700 fps. Neck shot at 80 yards on a 140 pound 8 point...No exit

264 Winchester Magnum / 129 grain SST doing about 3100 fps. High shoulder shot on a 190 pound 10 point at 140 yards...No exit

264 Winchester Magnum...Same load as above. Same day. 70 yard shot on a 120 pound doe. High shoulder shot. No exit.

6.5-06...129 grain SST. Bullet was going around 3000 fps. 110 yard shot on a 100 pound doe through the rib cage. That one exited and took some of her lungs with it.

6.5-06...Same load as above. Next day. 140 yard shot on a big 8 point buck. Just as I sent that one down range the buck spun around unexpectedly to pay some attention to a doe. The bullet caught him way back in the rib cage with what should have been a diagonal path up through the chest cavity. Bullet disinter-graded and core separated. Fragments clipped his spine at the small of his back in front of his hips. Took out his rear legs but I had to finish him off with a handgun. Felt bad about that.

338-06...200 grain SST doing around 2800 fps. Big 10 point called in from 375 yards. Came to the base of the hill I was on and turned broadside at 50 yards. Dead center neck shot where the neck meets the shoulder...no exit.

That’s six deer with a variety of Hornady SST bullets and only one pass through. Five of the six went down in their tracks and the one that didn’t managed to travel about 25 feet before I finished him. The SST isn’t a bad bullet. It’s just a different bullet. Don’t count on getting an exit wound. Pick your spot and put the bullet where it needs to go.