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How Familiar Are You With The AK?

Discussion in 'Rifle Country' started by Gomez, Jan 3, 2003.

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  1. Gomez

    Gomez Member

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    A friend of mine recently attended a briefing conducted by John Holschen on the Al Quada Training Tapes. I've posted a bit more info and a link to John's origional analysis in the General Discussion forum. Anyway, the tangos are utilizing stockless AKs in most of the scenarios on the tape. If you were present and got access to one of them, how quickly could you bring it into action? How familiar are you with switches, levers, sights, etc on the AK family of weapons?
     
  2. Triad

    Triad Member

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    #1. Real quick.
    #2. As familiar as anyone can be I suppose.
     
  3. 4v50 Gary

    4v50 Gary Moderator Staff Member

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    Insert magazine, set safety to fire, pull bolt back and you're ready to go.

    Of course, you can set the safety to fire, insert magazine, pull bolt back and still be ready to go.
     
  4. PATH

    PATH Member

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    Made to be simple and mass produced. You gave a hard time killing these things!
     
  5. Al Thompson

    Al Thompson Moderator Staff Member

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    Sounds like good news to me. Maybe we can influence them to get pistol grips for their shotguns and hold their handguns sideways.
     
  6. Kevlarman

    Kevlarman Member

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    I have an airsoft AK47. Does that count? :D

    Really, the only thing new (to the AK) people will have to get used to is inserting the magazine (front end first, then pivot back) and the selector switch.
     
  7. Politically Incorrect

    Politically Incorrect Member

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    I'm sure familiar with them. When my brother's friend's AK wasn't cycling on occasion, I knew was was wrong.

    Seems that when it was put back together, the bolt assembly wasn't aligned in the rails right. I popped off the top, pulled the spring off and inserted the bolt and made sure it slid along the rails smoothly. No problems after that. Took me a matter of seconds. And it looked like I knew what I was doing.

    I have an urge to take all my guns apart just to be amazed at the simplicity and mechanics that these engineers designed. Of course, sometimes foul language :cuss: is necessary when reassembly of doesn't go the way as planned. :banghead:

    Then, once I figured out how, then I could cuss at myself for not noticing how simple it is.

    stockless AK? I guess there are no riflemen in the Al Quada.
     
  8. Gomez

    Gomez Member

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    Yep, stockless. They are holding the guns sideways, with the ejection port up, mag to your right, gun more or less on the body centerline.

    No one seems to have a very good idea of where they came up with that method of employment.
     
  9. Nightcrawler

    Nightcrawler Member

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    I've seen those tapes. I think they're AKS paratrooper models with underfolding stocks folded and not used. In any case, these guys are a bunch of freaking jokers when it comes to basic combat. They don't aim, they just spray ammuniton all over the place. They don't even shoulder their weapons.

    Hard to imagine a bunch of jackasses like that could actually do so much damage. :fire:
     
  10. Poodleshooter

    Poodleshooter Member

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    That sounds like the way certain subguns used to be employed before they hit on the idea of equipping them with wire or other shoulder stocks. The theory is that the muzzle will move horizontally, spraying an enclosed area with bullets instead of wasting the AK's excessive muzzle climb in a vertical direction.
    Still, this sounds as if they need better tactical instructors.
    I can easily strip and reassemble my SAR-1 in the dark. Is that familiar enough? :)
     
  11. geojap

    geojap Member

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    I have an AK (a VEPR II) and it is the easiest gun that I own to use in an ugly situation. It is extremely easy to take down, load and rack, clear jams (if that EVER happens to an AK), sight and fire. Very handy gun. Utterly reliable. Simple design. With no stock, and the inherent AK capabilities, they muct be training for encounters under 40 yards, because using the sights and getting an accurate shot will be nearly impossible with no stock and it's inherent inaccuracy. They must be training for urban fighting in close quarters.

    One advantage that the grip they are using might have (holding the rifle and pistol grip so that the back of your hand and the ejection port are pointing straight up), is precisely that the magazine is turned sideways. An AK 30-round magazine is really long, and can get in the way if you are in a prone position firing, or if you have anything underneath the rifle that will hit the mag. That's why shorter 20 round AK mags are so popular. By turning the rifle and mag sideways, you can lay on the ground and be almost flat, hugging the ground. Or you can ride in the back seat of an attacking car, roll the window down, climb halfway out the window so that you are sitting on the window sill, face back towards the middle of the car, and spray the AK sideways without the mag hitting the roof of the car. You can get a flatter shot and don't have to hold the AK up as high over the roof of the car.
     
  12. Chipperman

    Chipperman Member

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    What's an AK?

    ;)
     
  13. 4v50 Gary

    4v50 Gary Moderator Staff Member

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    We're going to have to get John Woo make some flicks with people holding shotguns & real assault rifles sideways and blasting everything in sight. When our opponents see it, they'll think it's the most advanced technique from America and hopefully they'll adopt it. It may just make it safer for our troops.
     
  14. Hazwaste

    Hazwaste Member

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    .

    More and more every day.
     
  15. Schuey2002

    Schuey2002 Member

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    Gary's answer is brilliant,yet simple, all rolled into one neat little package.

    :D
     
  16. Hkmp5sd

    Hkmp5sd Member

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    Just remember, unlike the M16 in which the selector switch goes from safe to semi and then auto, the AK47 goes from safe to auto and then semi. :D

    Speaking of pistol grips, I'm reading 13 Cent Killers: The 5th Marine Snipers in Vietnam by John J. Culbertson. He talks about a Gunnery Sergeant Roberto Guiierrez of Hotel Company, 2nd Battalion that used a M14 with the stock chopped off to a pistol grip.

    Gotta be one tough Marine!
     
  17. AK103K

    AK103K Member

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    I think its important to be able to do this with evey gun you can get your hands on, not just the AK. The weapon isnt the gun in your hands. You could have the absolute best gun in the world in your hands, and if you cant work it, what good is it? The AK's a good gun, but its not the weapon, nor are any of the other supposed "best guns", the sooner you figure that out the better off you'll be. Learn to work them all. ;)
     
  18. Tamara

    Tamara Senior Member

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    Is anybody not familiar with the AK?

    I mean, everybody owns one, or has owned one before, right? :confused:
     
  19. 12 Volt Man

    12 Volt Man Member

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    Tamara is right........Get out there and buy one or at least shoot one if you haven't ever done so. Very fun to shoot and the ammo is inexpensive.
     
  20. Zip06

    Zip06 Member

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    I agree with Tamara. The AK is kinda like a 1911 or a 10/22 in that everyone should know how to get one up and running.
     
  21. Dr.Rob

    Dr.Rob Moderator Staff Member

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    Well I didn't hump one as a footsoldier under the snapping red flag of freedom, but I'd say I'm pretty handy with one. Admittedly, I could be better with it.

    You know I haven't seen all the Al-Qeda tapes, but they look like they are training just like our guys do, only there is no such thing as a no-shoot target.

    :uhoh:

    No matter how you hold it an AK on full auto isn't exactly a precision instrument.
     
  22. Justin

    Justin Moderator Staff Member

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    Ok, from the footage I've seen on the news, I have to say I'm underwhelmed with Al Qaeda's abilities with small arms.

    However, I wonder if by hold the weapon sideways they are somehow indexing off of the charging handle to get some sort of flash sight picture?

    Just a thought.
     
  23. Politically Incorrect

    Politically Incorrect Member

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    Is the AK a new kind of rifle? :neener:
     
  24. clem

    clem Member

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    If you're talking about the AK-47 type of assault rifles, the answer is:

    Been on both sides of these things. and, yes, I can put it into action real fast and even fix it IF , one would ever fail/break.
     
  25. Gomez

    Gomez Member

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    AK103K;

    I absolutely agree. You (generic, plural, meaning everybody) should be able to bring any gun you happen to encounter into operation. If you don't have particular familiarity with the particular gun, you should be familiar enough with the concepts to bring it online. (find the safety, find the operating handle, mag release,etc). The reason that I asked about AKs, in particular, was because they are featured so prominantly in the Al Quada tapes and because there are so many (AKs) around the world (more than 50 million!).

    Justin;

    The footage that you've seen on TV is not footage from the Al Quada training tapes that I'm refering to. John Holschen compared the footage that's been aired on CNN as watching a high school football team as compared to the Super Bowl. To the best of my knowledge, none of the footage from the Al Quada tapes have been aired on TV.

    For what it's worth, I knock the safety off (all the way down to Semi) first, then run the bolt, then pull and check the mag and reinsert it. I do this because, if you are not overly familiar with the AK, you can run the bolt to the rear with the gun on Safe (visually see a round in the chamber) and think that the gun is ready to fire. I knock the safety off with my firing hand prior to establishing a firing grip. I run the bolt with my off-hand, then remove the mag with my off-hand. Visually and tactilely verify ammo and reisert the mag. But that's just me.:)
     
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