How Many Refuse to Fly?

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I used to work overseas for years I flew I don't know how many millions of miles, but put it grandly it was 20 years of pole to pole, and way over twenty around the world flights. Before 9/11 I was sick and tired of flying, all I had to do is think about getting on a airplane and my body hurt. Try about 50 hrs airtime once and you will know what I mean.

So before 9/11 it sucked to fly, now it reminds me of one bad trip when I was strip searched in a low rent country. It has gone from a dislike it to dread it, I have gotten so bad I won't pack more than a few hours in advance, just don't want to think about it.

I still have to fly, but I drive when I can. But I HATE IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! A trip to the dentist is more fun.
 
"Land of the free...

The insanity goes rampage. And all this because our PC sissies refuse to "profile" the kind of people nearly exclusively are the ones wreaking havoc. Instead, they search US Generals, blue haired 80 year old grandmas, pregnant American women, babies, and everyone that doesn't look Arab.

No flying for me unless this pathological behaviour called "political correctness" cease to exist."



I flew a couple of months ago and saw TSA do just what you said. I think the TSA is afraid of passengers with , I'll say it, middle eastern profiles.

Political correctness:barf: :barf: :barf:
 
Are you guys serious? You think TSA targets just anybody out of political correctness?

How would you protect our commercial airliners from bad guys?

And who the hell decreed that ONLY persons of Middle-Eastern descent OR people who APPEAR Middle-Eastern would want to hijack an aircraft? Didn't anybody notice what happened in Russia recently? (Yes, I know Chechens are Muslim, but some of them look as Anglo as me).
 
You couldn't get me on a commercial airliner at gunpoint these days. I refuse to pay hundreds of dollars for the privilege of being treated like cattle.

If I can't drive there, you won't see me.
 
I haven't flown since the TSA was created and instituted it's ridiculous excuse for security measures. I won't have everything I own be searched by lazy, theiving government employees. The TSA answers to no one and acts like it.

It hurts me because my wife and I would like to go back to the place we had our honeymoon, and we'd like to see Ireland again, but we're sticking to places we can drive to.

US Airways and and United can go bankrupt and disappear from the face of the planet.
 
For years I flew almost daily as a "Road Warrior" high end sales person and seminarist.

I grew up in an aviation family and we have several planes and one jet.

The TSA is a criminally disgusting pretense of visible security to cover up a great lemming test; of us allowing ourselves gradually into the trains that are going to the showers.

Soon there will truely be a two class system in America; in fact there is now - those who fly personal planes and those who don't.

I will not fly commercial again.

There is a new book out, a few days ago: "Flying Blind" which will cause you to join in the decision to not fly again commercially.

Those Road Warriors who still fly are armed to the teeth as a rule; many of them practice quick disconnects of seat belts and some even take classes in using the removeable seats and seat belts as shields and weapons. Many carry an extra credit card with sharpened edges or even a professionally laminated credit card made of titanium. Some carry pens and pencils of titanium or metal and some take lessons in using them as defensive implements. Sheeple are not allowed to carry plastic wire ties any more so some carry special dental floss that has about a 100 pound break strenth to use as bindings. Some carry special belts and learn to take them off quickly and use them. Some have a long sock and a plastic bottle of shampoo ready to put into the sock for use... there are many other expedient covert weapons. One fellow has practiced using extra long and extra long medical drinking straws and bamboo shishkabob skewers with a dab of cotton on one end as a blowgun... One pharmacist salesman claimed a couple of years ago on one of the Road Warrior forums that he had some long sewing needles, straws and a small bottle of Curare, the famed blowgun dart poison. And it goes on... Some are wearing police style bullet resistant vests or clothing, there are companies that cater to the Road Warriors that sell covert protective clothing that will stop a knife and help protect from bullets. MANY keep strong laser pointer pens in a pocket for eye-blinding terorists, and much more.

One Commercial Airline Pilot I heard speak on this issue; who can fly free anywhere and so can all his family - says that he will not fly commercial with his family and will not fly commercial himself unless he is the pilot. He read a galley copy of "Flying Blind" and said that not only is it truthful but that it is a bit understated if anything and leaves out many other dangers that are set up to allow the terrorists MORE access while terrorizing pilots, passengers and crew.

We need to REMOVE almost all of our politicians and almost all of our major media and all of our attorneys... or get them all nice agriculture jobs in the fields.

:cuss:
 
The whole thing disgusts me. First I don't like the fact that they need to see an ID to board a plane. It reminds me way too much of some not to friendly places I have traveled where a guy with a submachine gun says:

Papers..........


Second the whole arming of the pilots annoys the heck out of me. These guys are bus drivers in the sky. If they need to be armed so do bus drivers, and train engineers, and riverboat pilots. The aren't a select priviledged class that should be armed, to the exclusion of the general population.

On a recent trip through Denver it was an hour plus standing in line, to get through security. And then have some doughnut eating moron use the only two grey cells he's got to figure out if my belt buckle is a lethal weapon.

God I wish the train system in this county worked agian.

Yes I like driving, even the 24 hour drive home is better than 5-6 hours of airports and airlines, and the scenery better.
 
I have a strong distaste for metal detectors already. Haven't had to fly since 9/11, I don't think I want to, and if any long distance travel comes up again, Amtrak or the car is getting a hard look.
 
I think the airlines have been subsidized long enough. They should be cutoff from the government's money trough. "We the people" have built an infrastructure for airline industry. Because a few companies cannot operate efficiently they come to Uncle Deep Pockets for welfare assistance. The problem may be taxes, unions, management, fraud, greed or bad decisions. Regardless, it should not become my problem. Even though I will not fly, I still pay through payroll deductions.

TSA is another example of a goverment fix that isn't. More layers. Spread the responsibility around thin enough and no one can be held accountable.

Pilots ought to have guns as it's a better last line of defense than an F-16 shooting down an aircraft full of people. I would rather see the flight crew bring home a plane of dead and injured instead of blowing it out of the sky.

If an armed pilot cannot regain control of the situation onboard, then shoot it down.

Buses and airplanes have entirely different clientele and stops for off/onloading passengers. The kids, punks and yahoo's aren't hanging around the terminal gates like they are at bus stops.

I walk, drive or motorcy--------------cle,

Vick
 
I haven't flown since 9/11 because of the invasive and humiliating security measures--friends and relatives have endured outrageous treatment--not any fear of terrorism. I'm an American, dammit, not a citizen of some police state.

I intend to use trains and cars in the future whenever possible. The TSA madness stems from the same sort of thought that got us the invasive, anti-Constitutional Patriot Act (thanks, George Bush). So many people are perfectly content to give up their freedoms as long as they can still drive their car to the mall, buy trinkets, and go home to watch Oprah.
 
:fire: I don't have a choice. There is no other way in and out of the Bush unless you are on a river system. Fortunately the commuters aren't yakked up like the larger airlines. I have no reason to go down to the Lower 48 so I won't be getting on a flight anytime soon.
 
Good post, Cosmoline. I detest flying because of the TSA. I once wrote the 3 airlines I have frequent flyer plans with, telling them to raise hell with Congress on behalf of their customers against the TSA. 2 ignored me, the 3d said "thanks for your comments, we've passed your letter to the TSA":fire:

I flew on 9/11/02. I think I was one of 10 passengers in the entire airport. I have a steel plate and 11 pins in my ankle. Security was high, which I could understand, and the goons made me take my shoe and sock off and pull up my pants leg to inspect why my ankle kept setting the wand off-- which I could understand.

THEN, even seeing the large surgical scar, they kept running the wand up and down my bare naked ankle, debating with each other whether to let me on the plane. :banghead: After I offered to stick my ****ing leg in the Xray machine, they begrudgingly let me on the plane.

No flights for me, thanks: if I wanted to be treated like a criminal, I'd commit crimes.
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Hear Hear!!
 
I won't fly as long as the TSA is harassing passengers. My parents would buy a ticket for me to visit them down south during the winter but I have always turned it down. If I ever take some vacation days I will drive down there.
 
I'm amazed at some of the attitudes here. Sure, flying commercially sucks. Yes, the lines are bad, service is not friendly, but to postulate that ALL TSA employees are "lazy, thieving government employees" who "harass and humiliate" passengers at will is a little extreme. I fly A LOT. In and out of this country. By far, our security measures are less painful than most (try flying in/out of some countries such as Greece, Israel, Saudi Arabia for example). I fly with firearms, have had some irritating moments, but the most humiliation I've undergone -- or witnessed -- is having to take off shoes and be wanded. Yes, I've heard the horror stories. But those are a small percentage of people who fly -- ever take a look at how many passengers go through even a medium sized airport per day? The volume is still huge. Everyone by now who flies should know that if they try to board with any item that looks as though it could be used as a weapon, the situation will escalate beyond routine.

I detest flying, but only because it's uncomfortable, the cabin air quality usually makes me ill, the service onboard by the stew ... ah, flight attendants is routinely surly, one's space is cramped, there's no legroom, the food sucks, the bathrooms are ridiculous and yes, one's treated like cattle. But for most of us who have to travel, particularly overseas, there's often no alternative.

How many of you write letters to the airlines, airport managers, your congressman, seek out TSA supervisors and make written complaints, write or call your local media to get publicity about bad experiences or in general do anything beyond bitching on internet forums about how bad big bad TSA is just another example of government run amok?
 
It would take more than Barney Fife to keep me from traveling. Do you refuse to buy a handgun because you have to show ID and fill out forms?
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Not sure where you're buying guns, but I havn't ever had it take more than 15 minutes, and I was free to wander around the store and drool while the sales person was on hold.

I've stood in line at DIA for 2 hours, herded like cattle, and they sure don't let you look at pretty guns the whole time. :(
 
By far, our security measures are less painful than most (try flying in/out of some countries such as Greece, Israel, Saudi Arabia for example).
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I've flown to Israel since 9/11 and it wasn't that bad. Of course, domestically, the airlines can't take the time that El Al takes to interview each passenger.
 
I don't trust my safety ...

To anyone. I HATE public transportation. If I am flying, I'll get a license and do it myself. Also, as I am untrusting with my personal safety, I also won't go anywhere that disarms me unless I have to.
 
Old Dog: You seem to have a high tolerance for abuse. Yes I have, and will continue to write my congress persons, and call them before they make any big descisions.

Wildalaska: You do not look dangerous.

Everyone: My step mom worked for TSA after being layed off as a machinist, and she has nothing good to say about the way it is run, or her fellow employees. She would get there at about 1:00 AM IIRC and sit there until morning on the clock waiting to find out if she was going to have to work the second part of her shift. Many of her fellow employees could literally not hold down a job at a fast food restaraunt. They also fit about every mall ninja stereo type.

I used to love to fly commercial, now I am planning on building my own airplane after I buy a house. Many of you guys on THR should consider buying an used airplane or building your own. There is still a lot of freedom in flying your own airplane. Small local airports are everywhere and give you the white glove treatment, as opposed to the latex glove treatment you get at major airports.

http://www.homebuiltairplanes.com/forums/
 
DustinD, yeah, I guess I do ... comes after spending too many years of my life in some areas around a certain gulf; I appreciate living in this country. That said, I do not enjoy the experience of flying commercial these days at all, and when I leave my present job, I will do everything in my power to never have to fly again (unless it's in my own or a friend's aircraft).

Anyway, I appreciate the efforts of all who work to try and improve the current situation (and by NO means am I trying to defend TSA; however, I don't believe TSA is the real problem, only the symptom). The point I was trying to make is that there seem to be too many people who just sit around and bitch about how bad things are, but expend no effort beyond keystrokes on their computer to work for change.
 
I'm basically okay with it.

That's OK with it as long as EVER SINGLE GOVERNMENT OFFICIAL must be subjected to EXACTLY the same "random, routine" searches the TSA does, including the TSA.

Any TSA official, upon arriving at the airport, should have to take off their shoes, belt, and all that and wait while everyone else walks by and check's 'em out.

Anytime Dubbya flies, he should also have to go through what we go through.

How long exactly do you think this would all last?

You forget, Andew Jackson was part of the elite, he would never have had to be subjected
to the laws the rest of us are required to live by, any more then, than now.
 
I have not flown since 9/11 and have no plans to in the future. Living in Hawaii I can either fly or swim.

I can not swim 2500 miles to the Californina coast, maybe when I was younger, so I will stay where I am.

I refuse to fly because I refuse to be treated as a terrorist.
 
It's a pain in the butt, however, I refuse to let inept government agencies or bad service prevent me from going wherever i want too.

Give me cheaper alternative that will get me there as fast, and I'm in.

Smoke
 
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