Huge 7.62 Nato problem.

[LRShooting]

I bought 100 lake city 7.62 brass awhile ago. I finally got 30 rnds to test loaded up after full length sizing, neck sizing, trimming, and crimp removal. Went to fire it a couple minutes ago, but it won't go in. I could feel it getting hard and I didn't wanna have a stuck case. The dimensions of the cases were slightly different. Why would the dimensions be any different if I sized them in the same die though? Is it possible that since the case necks were so long that it didn't size right because it wasn't going all the way in? Dimensions I measured on average in the following.

7.62 Nato:
Case width at base-.4705 in
Case width at shoulder-.4575 in

.308:
Case width at base- .4685 in
Case width at shoulder-.4560 in

All cases are within 1/1000 of 2.005 in
All cases are seated to 2.800 OAL +/- a couple hundredths due to bullet variation.

Only thing I can think of is that the cases came pretty long. I had to trim quite a bit. Im going to run a couple through the sizing die again at the trimmed length and see what happens.

Update:
Resized NATO:
Case width at base-.4685
Case width at shoulder-.4530
Gun fitment test=Good to go

What the heck is that about? Resized for the second time and it works. Im new on this once fired military brass stuff, so maybe its an obvious mistake...... Anybody got a good idea for a bullet puller to do 30 rounds. An impact would work ok wouldn't it? I don't hope to ever have to pull any after this, so no expensive ones. Collet pullers are the same price for the actual puller, but I don't wanna buy 18$ collets every time I have a new round.

 

[George44]

If your cases are G.I. 7.62 brass they were probably fired in machine guns ,which are known to have somewhat large chambers and violent ejection. You could possibly correct this by using a small base sizing die for reloading this type of brass.

 

[LRShooting]

Im sure they were. Its all LC brass, or thats the title given to them. Some of its SBS and PMJ too which they said it would have some other brands in it. Besides that, I noticed that quite a bit of it has dents in the necks which in my experience, occurs in auto loaders. Ive never had one do that in a bolt.

 

[rcmodel]

Make sure your sizing die is adjusted down to make hard contact with the shell holder.

If it's not, press spring & linkage flex is not allowing you to put the shoulders back where they belong.

In the mean tine, color one of the rounds that won't chamber with a black magic marker and try to chamber it.

Where the black comes off is what is tight.
Dollars to donuts, it's the shoulder not pushed back far enough.

rc

 

[Scooter22]

Another thought is you didn't have your resizing die screwed down all the way to take the spring out of the press. Did you have to reinstall the die in the press on the 2nd resize?

 

[LRShooting]

Yea. I resized them a while back. No different adjustments were made though. I did the normal 2 turns past flush that I usually do. Some don't even do it that much. They sized correctly the second time. I still can't figure out why they did that. Come to think of it, the first time I sized them, they didn't go up all the way. It was consistent so I didn't bother to think about it twice. Something about trimming allowed them to go in deeper. However, the allowance for the neck length is pretty big, so even a way long neck shouldn't stop it from sizing that far. At any rate, my cases are working now. They fit into the gun nicely. Now, I just have to order a bullet puller and get 30 rounds undone so I can resize them and reload.

 

[rcmodel]

Two turns past flush?

Are you taking about the sizing die contacting the shell holder + 2 more turns?

If so, no press would allow two turns past shell holder contact and still be able to reach full toggle extension at the top of the stroke.

If that's the case, you are not getting full leverage at the top of the stroke, or a consistent 'stop' each time you size a case.

rc

 

[LRShooting]

Hmm, never thought about that, but I just press until I feel a firm stop. Maybe I misread, but Im pretty sure one of Lees instructions said to go 1.5-2 turns past flush to prevent over cam or something like that. I may be wrong though, and just misread.

 

[USSR]

LRShooting,

Your problem is one of two things: either the shoulder was not pushed back far enough (most likely), or the web area of your machinegun fired brass was so out of spec that your FL sizing die could not reduce it enough. I ALWAYS use a small base sizing die when resizing newly purchased once-fired 7.62x51 brass. Unless the brass has "Match", "NM", or "LR" on the headstamp, assume it is machinegun fired.

Don

 

[Gadawg88]

From Lee instructions:

Full Length Sizer
Screw the full length sizer in until it touches the shell holder. Then lower the ram and screw the die in 1/4 to 1/3 turn more. Raise the ram and tighten the lock ring finger tight.

 

[Walkalong]

If you are going to size brass by screwing the sizer die down until it contacts the shell holder, then make sure it barely kisses it when actually sizing a case. Don't just screw it down to touch.

 

[LRShooting]

From Lee instructions:

Full Length Sizer
Screw the full length sizer in until it touches the shell holder. Then lower the ram and screw the die in 1/4 to 1/3 turn more. Raise the ram and tighten the lock ring finger tight.

Oh wow, I am way off lol. I was thinking of collet neck sizer. It actually is 2 full turns. Its even in bold print. Im looking at the instructions right now.

Your problem is one of two things: either the shoulder was not pushed back far enough (most likely)

Actually both. After the second sizing, they were up to spec on dimensions, but the shoulder is still not pushed far enough back. I went and fired 22 rounds of it just to do it and see what happened, but some of them went all the way in, and then became extremely hard as I was closing the bolt. Shoulder length issue i suppose. I probably wasn't getting consistent sizing as suggested because I was using the settings for collet neck sizer...... Thats pretty much 8 times the suggested amount of turns that Lee recommends.

 

[rcmodel]

+1
You were getting inconstant sizing because you were not getting full ram travel to cam-over or handle stop each time.

 

[W.E.G.]

What type of case gage are you using to measure your finished product?

If you aren't using any case gage to measure your work, you're doing it wrong.

 

[W.E.G.]

From Lee instructions:

Full Length Sizer
Screw the full length sizer in until it touches the shell holder. Then lower the ram and screw the die in 1/4 to 1/3 turn more. Raise the ram and tighten the lock ring finger tight.

This will only get you in the ballpark.

You are only guessing at the dimensions of your finished product unless you use a tool to measure it.

 

[primalmu]

Why were you full length resizing AND neck sizing?

 

[hartcreek]

The guys have hit it on the head.....you had your sizer die agusted incorrectly......not tight enough.

 

[LRShooting]

Why were you full length resizing AND neck sizing?

Because full length sizer doesnt size the neck consistently. The collet neck sizer does since it forms the neck over the mandrel. With military brass, there is alot of issues with dented necks and a FL sizer does not reform neck, just makes it slightly better. The collet neck sizer isnneeded to actually form it back into the proper specs.

 

[LRShooting]

What type of case gage are you using to measure your finished product?

If you aren't using any case gage to measure your work, you're doing it wrong.

I don't use one ATM. I have one coming. It should be here Wednesday. I wouldn't necessarily call it wrong to do it without one, but it would sure help me catch issues like what I had from happening again. Its a pain to deal with.

 

[Rule3]

A Wilson case gauge would have alerted you to the fact that you sizing dies was set incorrectly.

As mentioned it is 1/4 to 1/3 turn past hitting the shell holder but that is not absolute. Try it there then plunk it in the gauge You may have to tweak it a little bit one way or the other, It's not the brass.. After the cases are resized and fit the gauge, then trim them if needed.Gauge will show you length also.

 

[LRShooting]

then trim them if needed

Oh, crap. Something just occurred to me. I had to trim a abnormally large amount of brass off those shells. The fact that the cases were stretched out so much wouldn't have led to that. I bet after FL resizing after I get my HS gauge, its gonna be a couple hundredths to short. Oh well, I suppose they will still work. They just won't have the same pressures. I do my rounds according to brand name anyways since cases vary a little depending on what company they come from so as long as all the NATO cases are the same, I hope Ill be alright.

 

[TheCracker]

As rc said make sure your full length sizing die is making firm contact with your shell holder.

I learned that the hard way after screwing up 100
308 rounds. It totally sucked pulling all those rounds and re reloading. This is when I learned to always check of new loads will chamber before loading a ton of them.

 

[deepskyridge]

7.62 Nato Reloading

I did not read if you said what gun you are loading for. I run all my brass for my semiauto rifles through a small base die. Also they all go into the case gauge before I prime, charge with powder and seat the bullet. I have never had a problem with them not feeding.

Good Luck
Gary