Hunting Rifles Vs. Military Rifles...

[woof]

Amazingly, I agree with everything in this thread. It is the cartridge not the rifle etc etc. I don't care who hunts with what and I don't want laws to dictate any of that. That said, if I meet you out in the woods and you have a military style semi auto, I'm getting away from you quickly because (sorry) I do think you're a rambo wannabe.

 

[JesseL]

That said, if I meet you out in the woods and you have a military style semi auto, I'm getting away from you quickly because (sorry) I do think you're a rambo wannabe.

I'm curious, which feature of a "military style semi-auto" (does a Garand qualify?) is it that triggers that triggers your projection of a hunter's motives?

 

[SteyrAUG]

Andrew S


I find it funny that you all seem so upset that they label you a rambo wannabe when you refer to them as fudds.

Well as I don't hunt he wasn't even talking about me, but about "Rambo's" in general.

And I wasn't referring to "hunter's in general" as FUDDs, but to this guy specifically who was a FUDD.

But hey, thanks for playing. We have some car wax as a parting gift.

 

[SteyrAUG]

woof
That said, if I meet you out in the woods and you have a military style semi auto, I'm getting away from you quickly because (sorry) I do think you're a rambo wannabe.

Amazing... :banghead:

So you wanna take a crack at explaining why my HK91 is not as suitable as my HK SL7?

 

[Ithaca37]

That said, if I meet you out in the woods and you have a military style semi auto

So my AK with a 5rd mag is more scary (not that I think either is scary) than a Remington 7400 with a 5rd mag? Why?

Why aren't military bolt guns scary? They are generally more powerful than the semi-autos.

 

[Deer Hunter]

Woof,

So my Mosin is perfectly Ok then, right?

*continues to clean his teeth with a spike bayonet*

 

[woof]

If you are asking for my personal opinion here ya go. It isn't the gun I find scary but the person carrying it. I find the "black rifles" to be basically replica guns. The military doesn't make these rifles in semi-auto form. But civilians want them. Why? Because they look and feel like something they aren't - replicas. Why does someone want a rifle that looks like something it isn't? The only reason I can think of is that they want to pretend they are doing what they real thing was intended for. And I don't want to be in the woods with someone on that kind of trip. You asked.

 

[woof]

Deer Hunter, Its ok with me if you can't afford anything better.

 

[Deer Hunter]

Says you.

I'm a college student, but I own better/more accurate rifles. My go-to rifle is a DSArms FAL. I don't own anything "hunting" weapons, as you may put it. They don't do anything for me. They are much too linear. I want my rifles tough and flexible. I avoid specialization for the most part. I use my M44 because I enjoy the gun and I actually hunt out in the woods where a scope would simply get in the way. It's perfect for that application, and the bayonet makes one hell of a great tool for when you don't have a good place to put it. Extend bayonet, rotate rifle, and stick into ground. Problem solved.

All I use is military-style weapons. And it doesn't matter one bit WHAT kind of weapon YOU use, because at one point in time, your choice of hunting tool was used to kill someone on a battlefield. Don't care if you hunt with a handful of rocks, Because you see, there was this guy named David who was a crack-shot with a sling back in the day.

 

[ArmedBear]

A lot of this is just about prejudice and stereotyping.

Some experienced hunter sees some guy hunting with a FAL, and Mr. FAL is a complete idiot, unsafe, unethical, a slob hunter. Mr. Experienced Hunter may be smart about finding deer, but he's not real big on critical thinking, so he applies instant bigotry: "all black-rifle people are alike."

Pretty soon, he'll start agitating for separate bathrooms for black-rifles, and make the black-rifle guys sit in the back of the bus.

OTOH, the Tacticool guys who go deer hunting drunk with the only rifles they own (all black rifles or AK's, usually with rails everywhere, but not even sighted in) as a break from playing videogames and paintball, see a guy with a walnut boltie who's been hunting for 30 years and make a bunch of assumptions about him, too, like "Fudd."

Then some Hmong dude steals a treestand and shoots them all with an SKS, Fudds, paintballers, women, children, whomever, anyone but the deer.

Now my AR seems to get along with the Mini-14 on one side of it and the walnut boltie deer gun on the other side in the safe.

Now why can't people get along as well as guns do?

 

[JesseL]

If you are asking for my personal opinion here ya go. It isn't the gun I find scary but the person carrying it. I find the "black rifles" to be basically replica guns. The military doesn't make these rifles in semi-auto form.

The military doesn't make these - period. Companies like Colt, FN, & H&K do.

But civilians want them. Why?

Maybe because civilians have some of the same valid criteria that the military does. Lightweight, ergonomic, easy to control, readily available ammunition, etc.

Civilian rifles and military rifles have always followed parallel courses of development. My great grandfather hunted with a state-of-the-art military rifle - a .30-40 Krag. My grandfather used military rifles - 1903 Springfields, Mauser 98s, M1 Garand etc. Neither of them was on some military combat fantasy trip; why would you assume that I am, if I choose to hunt with an AR-15 or Kalashnikov?

 

[ArmedBear]

The military spends a bunch of money on guns. Why not take advantage of their R&D?

Besides, variants of the most popular field guns like the 700, 870 and 500 are used by the military, too.

Hunters also drive Jeeps, which, while they've changed over the years, are still based on a vehicle that wouldn't exist were it not for military contracts.

 

[Cannonball888]

I'm hunting with a walnut boltie this year. And it IS a military gun (SA M1903A1). How many 1903s have been sporterized for hunting? Not mine.
I also wear old military camo which I prefer to RealTree. But I hunt on private land, so I don't often meet hunters with or without these predjudices. I do own black rifles and I don't see any problem using them as hunting rifles, but if I ever go on public lands, which I probably won't, I'd wrap them with some camo cloth so no one will wet their pants.

 

[biggameballs]

"Lightweight"

Yea AR's are light weight LOL!!!! The only reason I wouldn't hunt with one of those is that they are TANKS!!!!!!

 

[Keith Wheeler]

Now why can't people get along as well as guns do?

You gonna put that on a t-shirt? I'd wear one to my next subgun match!

Underneath the name calling though there is the sad kernel of truth that some "traditional" gun owners have some ignorance with regards to what is and isn't "military" and whether or not a self-loading rifle is "sporting". The thing that scares me is that this ignorance plays right in to the goals of the antis.

For me, well, if it weren't for military/military type rifles, I'd have no rifles at all. Well, there's my Mini-14, but since it has the factory folding stock, I'm sure it's far more evil and less sporting than a common sense ranch rifle.

 

[Cannonball888]

The only reason I wouldn't hunt with one of those is that they are TANKS!!!!!!

The 1903? Yeah, it's heavy duty. It's even heavier with a 24" steel Unertl scope

 

[ClickClickD'oh]

That said, if I meet you out in the woods and you have a military style semi auto, I'm getting away from you quickly because (sorry) I do think you're a rambo wannabe.

Heck, if you run into me in the woods while I'm hunting you better get away from me as fast as possible...

What are you doing hunting on my land you poacher!!!!!


j/k

 

[biggameballs]

OK you tote your 11lb gun through the swamps here in northern MN on a 1/2 mile deer drive. I will take my 7lb winchester featherweight.

 

[ArmedBear]

My 20" HBAR doesn't weigh anywhere NEAR 11 lb.

I'd also prefer the featherweight for hunting, but 8 lb. isn't 11.

 

[biggameballs]

8lbs empty and with no scope. My feather weight is just over 7lbs decked out

 

[Deer Hunter]

My mosin is probably around 8 pounds. I've carried my scoped FN FAL out into the field. My pump action shotgun weighs in close to 17 pounds.

"too heavy" depends on the person.

 

[41magsnub]

Quote:
"3. Do they deserve to run for their lives as a hail of 20-30 bullets rains down around them (and/or through them?) That doesn't seem like much respect to me."
- no beef with the poster of this, just using it as an example that other people have commented on

Its all well and good to sit around the campfire here and complain about the potential for some nut job to cut loose with 30 shots at a deer.

Has anyone actually seen anyone do this?

How is it not sporting to use a 30 round magazine if you only fire 1 or 2 shots at a time? Most hunting rifles can hold around 5, is firing 5 from that not sporting?

The safety issue I can agree with, but again, I go back to my above statement that just because someone is using a 30 round magazine does not mean they are going to turn the forest into WWIII.

There is a large gray area for what is "sporting," but there is also a lot of gun bigotry that people try to claim under the "its not sporting" clause.

I have seen somebody dump an entire Mini-14 mag at an antelope hitting it in the leg, butt, another leg, spine about mid back, and finally a boiler room shot which killed it (I guess that was when he finally settled down and aimed). It was not pretty, the poor thing was actually bleating and screaming in fear and pain. If I would have had a safe shot to do so I would have finished it for him way before it got that far even though I didn't know the guy.

 

[Vaarok]

I got my first deer with a Gew98, and this year I've been alternating between a M1941 Johnson and a Gew 88 Commissiongewehr. Stalking the hedgerows on the north side of the farm, same as always. Weight isn't that much of an issue for me.

 

[MCgunner]

Well, I do understand what Woof is sayin'. However, I don't go to the East Texas woods to hunt. Whether they're carrying a 700 Remington or an AK, I don't trust the people who flood the woods up there every year. Does that mean I think everyone up there is a city slicker duffus that makes "sound shots"? No. But, I don't wanna be around anyone that is. And, if I see someone totin' an AK or an AR, I immediately suspect them more so than someone with an old M99 Savage, for instance. Why do I worry more about the guy with the black gun? Well, I figure if they're totin' an AK, they're more into the gun than the sport. I figure they might not know what the heck they're doin' out there in the woods. I figure they might hear something and start layin' down cover fire. It's just a notion, but it does make me nervous. I see some guy with a scarred up old M99 or a pre-64 winchester, or a M700 Remington, I figure they probably know how to hunt safely, identify their target, make sure of their target and background before taking ONE shot. I mean, that's just me. Go ahead, take offense, I'll still feel the same way about strangers I meet in the woods with an AK. Now, if I KNOW the guy and know he's a good hunter, fine. But, it's the first impression I'm talking about. Everyone makes first impressions, why you don't see an Exxon CEO wearing his jeans down around his butt crack in the board room. He'd never made CEO if he'd dressed that way, no matter his credentials. All about first impressions.

I do know, however, the east Texas woods ain't safe this time of year on heavily hunted weekends, regardless of what people hunt with. I hunt my own place. If I see someone else where I'M hunting, I draw my cell phone and call the law. Ain't nobody supposed to be there, but me or my friends. And, I don't care if a friend wants to hunt with his browning or his AK, don't matter to me, because I know him already and he wouldn't be on my land if I didn't trust him. No first impressions need be worried about, already been made and forgotten.

I have killed a deer with an SKS and yet I still have these impressions of people I meet in the field with black guns. Sorry if it offends you.

 

[Wildfire]

Sorry.

Hey there.
Sorry about calling him your freind. I should have known better.

Happy Hunting whith what ever...

All I know for dead nuts sure on this suject is that I hunt with what ever I want to hunt with and when some idea-not tells me different WE got a problem. As hunters and shooters we all need to support all we do.
There will always be differences of how we do it, but I have no right to tell any one what to do it with.