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I got a BP revolver... now what is it???

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DrDanke

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Feb 27, 2004
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I got this BP revolver from my uncle. All he knows is that it was built from a kit back in the days. Obviously it is a .44 or .45 because I measured the cylinder, but what model is it a replica of? What company made it, or made the kit? What size balls do I fire out of it? Everything in it seems tight, its never been shot, the grips need a little finishing work, the function is perfect. I looked it over, and I have taken photos of all of the marks on it. No caliber stated anywhere.

Is there anything I should double check for function or fit to be sure it is safe to shoot? I know it needs a good scrubbing, I made the bore pristine again, but I will need some kind of brush for the cylinder. I used a .45 caliber bore brush on the bore. I don't have a nipple wrench, I will need one of those, and I am definately going to replace the nipples. Are nipples going to be impossible to find? Or do you think it just takes standard nipples? Anything anyone can tell me or suggest will help.. I know nothing about this thing. It's got a great look to it!

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Colt Army Holster Pistol Model 1860.

This one has the "Navy grip" as opposed to the straighter (almost Bisley like) Army grip.

BTW, nice Mauser calipers. :) I use to use a vernier but my eyes don't work so I got a Starrett. Press a button and it converts from English to Metric.:cool:
 
Star over the PN = Italian black powder proofmark, in use since 1951.

I tried finding the other marks in "Official Guide to Gunmarks" by Robert Balderson but didn't recognize them.
That reolver is a brass-framed copy of the Colt 1860 Army. Colt never made them in brass frames.
Brass-framed cap and ball revolvers will wear quicker than a steel-framed version. Therefore, keep your loads rather light to ensure longevity.
Don't use 777 powder in this revolver as it's stronger than plain black powder. I'd suggest you stick to black powder and Pyroxdex P.
A maximum load should be considered to be 30 grains of FFFG, or its equivalent by volume when other powders are used.
But for most uses, I'd use 20 to 25 grains of FFFG in that pistol. You may use a bit of corn meal to occupy space in the chamber, so you don't have to seat the ball down so far.
If the ball is nearer the end (forcing cone) of the barrel, it has much less of a jump before it engages the rifling. This long jump can affect accuracy.
Buy some Wonder Wads by Ox-Yoke. Then soak them in melted lard, Crisco or Bore Butter. In my experience, the dry lubricant of Wonder Wads doesn't go far enough to keep fouling soft.
Use a .454 inch ball, contrary to recommendations to use a .451 inch ball. The larger ball will, when swaged into the chamber with the rammer, create a wider bearing surface for the rifling to grip. Accuracy is helped.
To load that revolver:
1. Fire nothing but percussion caps on the cylinders, before you add powder. The blast of the caps will clear any crud in the nipple channel and dry the chamber of oil.
2. Add 20 grains of FFFG black powder.
3. PUsh a greased felt wad into the chamber, over the powder, and seat it firmly on the powder with the rammer. Do this to all chambers before loading the ball. Why? Because if you forget to add powder to a chamber, it's a heck of a lot easier to remove a wad than it is a stuck ball!
4. Add a little corn meal on top of the chamber. A large pill bottle is a good carrier for the corn meal. A Popsicle stick makes a dandy spoon.
Add enough corn meal until it's about 1/4 inch below the mouth of the chamber.
5. Drop a ball onto the chamber containing corn meal. Speer and Hornady makes .454 inch balls that don't have a sprue because they're swaged, not cast. If you use cast balls, and they have a teat on them, center the sprue up and in the middle.
6. Using the rammer, ram the ball down firmly on the load. Ensure that the ball is slightly below the mouth of the chamber, or its protuberance will keep the cylinder from rotating.
7. When all chambers are loaded with balls, place the caps on the nipples. I pinch my caps into an oblong shape so they cling better to the nipple.
You'll have to learn which size caps your revolver takes. Buy both No. 10 and 11 caps. I prefer Remington but buy CCI if that's all you can find.
If the No. 10 cap is hard to fully seat on the nipple, go to the larger No. 11.
Don't throw away that tin of No. 10 caps. You may use it for clearing the nipple channels before loading.
If the No. 11 caps are loose on the nipple, try the smaller No. 10.
When capping the revolver, keep your fingers away from the front of the cylinder. This is easy to do. Caps can be sensitive and a moment's inattention could blow off a couple of fingers if the cap goes off while you're putting it on the nipple.
8. If you use a well-greased felt wad between ball and powder, there is no need to put grease over the ball. However, if you wish to do so, use only natural greases or waxes such as Crisco, lard or beeswax.
Petrolum products, when mixed with black powder, create a hard, tarry fouling. You're much better off to use natural ingredients.
NOTE: Colt revolvers typically shoot high at 25 yards, from 6 to 12 inches above the point of aim. The old originals were made to hit dead-on at 75 to 100 yards. The reproductions have been copied so faithfully that they hit high too.
CLEANING -- Remove the cylinder and remove the nipples from the cylinder. Remove the barrel assembly and strip the rammer parts off it. Dump these in a container of hot water, into which you've added a little dishwashing soap or Ivory soap.
A couple of small brushes help to get into the tight areas. Scrub the bore with a cleaning rod and patch to remove most of the fouling, followed by a .45-caliber brush.
You shouldn't have to use a brush on the chambers. They usually don't get lead in them from the ramming of the ball.
When all parts are clean, rinse in hot water, shake dry, and place on a low baking sheet. Place the sheet in the oven at 150 degrees or lower, with the oven door open a bit to allow steam to escape.
Leave them in the oven for 30 to 45 minutes, to drive out all moisture. Remove from oven and cover liberally, bore included, with Crisco, lard or olive oil. The hot metal will soak up a lot of grease, but don't worry. That's good.
As for the grips, hammer and frame, they most often can be wiped clean with a damp cloth. From time to time, you'll have to totally disassemble the frame and and its parts and give them a good scrubbing as fouling buildings from each session.
If you live in a very damp climate, you'll need to totally clean the revolver each time, and put natural grease or oils on it liberally.
When clean, smear Crisco on the cylinder pin and into its grooves. This will keep the cylinder turning and overcome fouling buildup. A light coat of Crisco on the internal parts will keep them going longer than just plain oil.
Regular gun oil will be blasted or baked off in the first cylinderful, then it will become progessively harder to cock the revolver. Crisco or a commercial grease such as Bore Butter will keep the innards lubricated longer.
ORGANIZING --- Buy a medium fishing box to keep all your items together. I suggest a box with at least two horizontal trays, to hold smaller items. Add a notebook and a couple of pens too, to take notes at the range. This can save a lot of duplication of effort.
Q-tips and pipe cleaners should go into the box. They're great for cleaning.
COLT NOTE: The Colt is particularly prone to allowing cap fragments to fall into the innards are you cock it for the next shot. You can avoid this by turning the revolver upside down while still pointed downrange, and cocking it. Cap fragments will then fall clear.
Some shooters hold the pistol vertically up by their head and cock it, but rangemasters frown on this. A small, thin screwdriver is handy to get cap fragments off nipples or to fish out fragments from the action.
Have fun with that revolver. They're a lot of fun and a good one will surprise you with its accuracy.
 
Now this question. What kind of nipples does this thing use for replacements? Since the maker is unknown, will it use regular Colt 1860 nipples? I took a pic of the nipples, so do they look like regular ones?

AND, is there any place that shows further disassembly of the frame, or do you have any pointers about weird stuff that can happen when I start taking screws off? If anyone could tell me the general procedure for frame disassembly, that would be great.
 
I have found out that the kit was made by "Armi San Paulo S.r.l.", by the "DGG" mark by the serial number. The proofmark in the rectangular box is the date "AI" which means 1982.

The company Armi San Paulo S.r.l. is now called Euroarms Italia S.r.l, whos website can be found at http://www.euroarms.net

I found the exact specifications of their model 1860 army, which should be the same specs for my pistol as well.. They list the recommended round or conical bullet of .451 (I will try both .451 and .454) and size 11 percussion caps. Here is the link to their model 1860 army.

http://www.euroarms.net/Avancarica/AVHTM/Scheda1210.htm
 
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