And should! I love it when folks gripe about the big retailers driving the locals out of business. But, then they shop there, and contribute to the situation. The big boys (online or bricks and mortar) wouldn't be in business if they weren't more efficient at delivering what people wanted. If you're local shop can't differentiate itself in some way they should be gone.
I want to support my local shop but......
- Thread starter Mooseman
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And should! I love it when folks gripe about the big retailers driving the locals out of business. But, then they shop there, and contribute to the situation. The big boys (online or bricks and mortar) wouldn't be in business if they weren't more efficient at delivering what people wanted. If you're local shop can't differentiate itself in some way they should be gone.
BikerRN
member
Three of my last four purchases were from online dealers.
My local shop either doesn't have it, or is priced way too high and won't come close to the price. They have managed to get me some guns for what I could get them online for, but that was before the obamessiah got elected.
I also use someone besides my local dealer as my FFL for Transfers, as the local dealer charges $50/Transfer.
BikerRN
My local shop either doesn't have it, or is priced way too high and won't come close to the price. They have managed to get me some guns for what I could get them online for, but that was before the obamessiah got elected.
I also use someone besides my local dealer as my FFL for Transfers, as the local dealer charges $50/Transfer.
BikerRN
if you want to support your local shop then support them... I choose not to buy guns online for many reasons but chiefly because I want to see my local shop succeed... not to mention in the end after all shipping and insurance costs the savings (in most cases) just arent worth the risk of throwing my account information out for all to see or sending a money order to someone I have no reason to trust. Call me paranoid or call me old fashioned, but as soon as WE allow our local small shops to go out of business, somehow I doubt the online prices will stay low.
after all, they are only low to compete. What happens when the competition goes out of business?
after all, they are only low to compete. What happens when the competition goes out of business?
bobotech
Member
I don't see where local dealers HAVE to charge so much more than online sales.
What I mean is I buy about 80 percent of all my guns from my local dealer because his prices are very fair compared to online. When he has Ruger LCPs in stock, he charges 279. When he gets plain jane used XDs in stock, they are around 400-450. When he gets used AKs, they are around 320-up. Last week I just bought a used Yugo fixed stock AK from him for 325. And he is a local dealer.
I go to other dealers in my area and they are WAYY more expensive than this guy. One shop is near my house and I like it and go into it for fun but I have never bought anything from them. Just too expensive.
So why can't all dealers be like my dealer who sells almost all his stuff for very reasonable prices including ammo. His 7.62x39 is 6.50 a box right now because of the ammo issues.
What I mean is I buy about 80 percent of all my guns from my local dealer because his prices are very fair compared to online. When he has Ruger LCPs in stock, he charges 279. When he gets plain jane used XDs in stock, they are around 400-450. When he gets used AKs, they are around 320-up. Last week I just bought a used Yugo fixed stock AK from him for 325. And he is a local dealer.
I go to other dealers in my area and they are WAYY more expensive than this guy. One shop is near my house and I like it and go into it for fun but I have never bought anything from them. Just too expensive.
So why can't all dealers be like my dealer who sells almost all his stuff for very reasonable prices including ammo. His 7.62x39 is 6.50 a box right now because of the ammo issues.
rbernie
Contributing Member
The dealers around me who succeed do so because they either offer something that you cannot buy over the Internet (range time at their indoor range, gunsmithing on premises, and so forth) or they adopt the Internet as their business front (less inventory and more transfers and special orders).
A bunch of dealers sell in their shops AND online with great success. Look at how many auctions on gunbroker come from a store with a storefront. Tons. I wonder how many guns per year Bud's gun shop sells. I'll bet it's far more than any mom and pop store I've ever walked into.
Anyone can compete in this business if they try hard enough. If they want to be lazy and charge more than everyone else does for items, they will eventually lose business over it. That's just how it works.
Anyone can compete in this business if they try hard enough. If they want to be lazy and charge more than everyone else does for items, they will eventually lose business over it. That's just how it works.
I don't mind paying a little more for something local, but my local gun dealer also knows that he cant keep every type gun that every one of his locals like in stock. He does not get mad when people order items on-line, he usually makes fun of one or two of them, people don't realize that the 50 dollar cheaper gun on-line actually cost them about the same or a little more because of the shipping and transfer.
Its always good to be on one of your local FFL's good side, I have called on Tuesday morning and asked him to put something back I saw over the weekend and he will and I have called him in the middle of the week when I was 200 miles from home, gave him a description of the gun I wanted and within 2 weeks it was waiting on me, I didn't have to give him a credit card (he doesn't take those) or any cash down. Can you do that with your on-line retailer or mega outdoor store?
Yes the prices are going up but his last ammo shipment was not much higher than his previous ones around 2-4 dollars a box higher, that not bad considering how much it went up last year.
Its always good to be on one of your local FFL's good side, I have called on Tuesday morning and asked him to put something back I saw over the weekend and he will and I have called him in the middle of the week when I was 200 miles from home, gave him a description of the gun I wanted and within 2 weeks it was waiting on me, I didn't have to give him a credit card (he doesn't take those) or any cash down. Can you do that with your on-line retailer or mega outdoor store?
Yes the prices are going up but his last ammo shipment was not much higher than his previous ones around 2-4 dollars a box higher, that not bad considering how much it went up last year.
Baneblade
Member
After reading this thread I started to think about my purchases over the last couple of years. I have never purchased a gun online, but that is because one store won't do a transfer, another charges $100 (not kidding), and the guy I like to use lives pretty far away (but only charges $15).
There are a couple of guns I would like but haven't purchased because they would be WAY overpriced at my local store and I just haven't been willing to purchase online. A RIA Tactical 1911 is a perfect example. My local store sold the GI model for over $500, I can only imagine what they would charge for the tactical.
I guess I will just go without. Each time I have used the $15 transfer guy it was part of a combined order with someone else. I might break down and order a RIA Tactical and stripped 1911 frame through SARCO and just make the drive out of town for the transfer.
I always try to support my local shop... but sometimes it is just too much of a gap.
There are a couple of guns I would like but haven't purchased because they would be WAY overpriced at my local store and I just haven't been willing to purchase online. A RIA Tactical 1911 is a perfect example. My local store sold the GI model for over $500, I can only imagine what they would charge for the tactical.
I guess I will just go without. Each time I have used the $15 transfer guy it was part of a combined order with someone else. I might break down and order a RIA Tactical and stripped 1911 frame through SARCO and just make the drive out of town for the transfer.
I always try to support my local shop... but sometimes it is just too much of a gap.
RonellCooper
Member
Speaking of supporting local gun shops. I was on the way home last Sunday and saw a shop on the way home. I went in to see if they had anything I could use i.e. powder, bullets, primers, etc. The owner (Ron Hess on Tidewater Drive, Norfolk Va. was a total jerk. I put up with it because he had what I wanted and the other shops in the area didn't. I purchased some 160 Nosler Partitions, IMR 4350 and 4320 powder, and 200 Winchester lg rifle primers. Once he saw that I was there to spend $$$$ he tried to joke around with me. I paid for my merchandise I was outta there never to return. Throughout the whole ordeal I maintained my composure and didn't reduce myself to his level. Before I go through that again I'll just do without.
I'm sure their overhead has a LOT to do with their pricing. A nice shop in an expensive building will more likely have higher prices because of higher rent, utilities, etc. Where I grew up in Oklahoma, the best gun shops were the ones located in the country on an old farm in a converted outbuilding. Those are hard to find now.
41022collector
member
- Joined
- Jun 14, 2009
- Messages
- 143
Personally, I go for price. If the firearm is the exact same model, I see no reason to support a shop that does not have the business sense to be competitive, nor will I waste MY time in begging a shop to be competitive. Price and convienence is what drives my purchases. Shops and the auction sites have outpriced themselves. Except for the one or two fun pieces I want to get and shoot, I bought all my personal pieces back when it was an honest deal for the most part. One of my best methods for gaining various firearms is a local ad in the local paper of "I will buy your legal firearm, call me with what you have and your price wanted. <phone>" Then if it is something I want, I set up a face to face. If not, I just pass on the phone. Most pieces, I get for close to 1/3 market price. I have acquired very nice pieces this way. Do I feel guilty, no, do I resell some, yes. Most of my parts pieces have been had this way. I do it all legal, get ID, signature on a sales receipt, video at the counter in the shop. I even hold the piece for 10 days while I allow my local district police station (2nd district, Cleveland) to run it for theft. If it is stolen, I have a deal with the county DA to rec my purchase price back in exchange for the piece and details of the purchase. If it is clean, I either sell it or keep it or ????? The only way I can legally sell pieces are at Gun Shows, auction sites, forums or face to face outside of Cleveland, as Cleveland does not allow people to buy firearms in the city limits from a retail shop.
Regards,
Mike
Regards,
Mike
DammitBoy
Member
I'm loyal to a local shop in town. We have three shops here.
One shop won't order anything and charges $45 per transfer. One shop has everything, but has the worst prices, and charges $35 per transfer.
The last shop does transfers for $15 each, orders anything I ask for, at internet-like pricing. He has a decent selection of used long guns and pistols and will run down what you are looking for used for the price you are willing to pay.
So, I do all my transfers at shop #3 and I keep an eye on the used case for something I might want. I order new through him on ocassion and try to make a few ammo and target purchases there too.
One shop won't order anything and charges $45 per transfer. One shop has everything, but has the worst prices, and charges $35 per transfer.
The last shop does transfers for $15 each, orders anything I ask for, at internet-like pricing. He has a decent selection of used long guns and pistols and will run down what you are looking for used for the price you are willing to pay.
So, I do all my transfers at shop #3 and I keep an eye on the used case for something I might want. I order new through him on ocassion and try to make a few ammo and target purchases there too.
Phydeaux642
Member
- Joined
- Jul 16, 2007
- Messages
- 1,886
When it comes to internet pricing this attitude makes me want to:banghead:.
Maybe I live close to shops that don't sell their new stock at much more than you can buy it for on the internet after shipping/transfer fees. For instance I go into my local shop and find XD9s for $489 and Glock G26s for $499. Doesn't seem like gouging to me, I'm just not looking for those guns. But, if there are folks that think that that is gouging, then you need to open up a local shop and see if you can make it by selling guns at what you want to personally buy them for.
The retail business I'm in stays in business because we are a brick and mortar store. We can't sell many of our products for what they go for on the internet because we pay more for them than some of these guys are selling the same product for. We are a $3-$4 million a year operation. One of the stores on the net is a billion and a half a year business. They get special deals - we don't. We offer help and support with the products we sell. That's what sets us apart. So, the next time you take that smarmy attitude about your local guys not competing, remember that they may not be there one day to offer you anything.
christcorp
Member
Because of buying power; profit margins; etc... I expect my local gun shop to be a little higher. But I normally put a limit of 20%. I.e. If a gun can cost me $500 on the internet; I can accept and appreciate a local gun shop going as high as $599 for the gun. I consider local tax to be a wash with Shipping and handling; so I don't even consider that as extra. But when the local gun shop wants to go higher than 20%, I let them know. And the best way to let them know is by using their FFL transfer. Most dealers allow transfers. They charge about $20-$30. So, when you see the gun you want for $500 and the dealer wants $650; tell them that is a lot more than you are willing to pay. Ask them if they would mind you buying a gun and having it sent to them for transfer. They'll say yes. But they won't really like it. They will make $20-$30 for filling out 10 minutes of paperwork. OR; they could make $50-$100 profit selling you a gun. Let them Suggest that maybe they can lower their price. If in fact they aren't getting the gun for $500 like you saw on the internet, then they should be questioning their OWN buying practices. If I was the merchant, I would be asking the customer; "Where did you find it at that price?" Then, I'd be thanking the customer for finding me a new source at a much better price. The problem is; many gun stores might know something about guns, but many don't know crap about business. They have their 2-3 sources that they buy all their guns, ammo, magazine, holsters, etc... from. They don't have the business sense or internet skills to go out and do better. HELP the local shop buy at a better price. I've even had some thank me to the point that they ordered 5 of an item I wanted that was much cheaper than they were selling it from normally. it was half price. In turn for them getting a new reliable source at a better price, they sold me what I wanted when it came it; "AT COST". So that was even cheaper than me ordering online because I didn't have to pay shipping. USE YOUR KNOWLEDGE to be a partner with your gun store instead of trying to get them to compete with the online stores.
MartyG
Member
I'm searching for a Bond Arms derringer. The local Gander Mountain has it right there, in stock, but $60 over MSRP, and about $100 over internet prices. But they have it. When you add in shipping, and some real exorbitant transfer fees, much internet savings is eaten up.
Here's a hint. On a whim, I went to a NICE local pawnshop. They are gun dealers, but mostly for pawning. However, they can get me anything I want. Their policy is 10% over their price plus shipping. No credit cards. 1/2 due at order, the other 1/2 due at pick up. That's where I'm going.
Gun shops have a seller's market right now, and some are acting like it. The big retail outlets like Gander Mountain have enough floor traffic that they'll sell regardless of price, the rich guys will walk through and take what they want without pricing.
Go to Gunbroker, and see who the FFL's are in your local area. Then call them. You WILL be surprised!
Here's a hint. On a whim, I went to a NICE local pawnshop. They are gun dealers, but mostly for pawning. However, they can get me anything I want. Their policy is 10% over their price plus shipping. No credit cards. 1/2 due at order, the other 1/2 due at pick up. That's where I'm going.
Gun shops have a seller's market right now, and some are acting like it. The big retail outlets like Gander Mountain have enough floor traffic that they'll sell regardless of price, the rich guys will walk through and take what they want without pricing.
Go to Gunbroker, and see who the FFL's are in your local area. Then call them. You WILL be surprised!
Everyone is talking about internet this and that. What gun shop doesn't have a website running and trying to sell things online? Well, they are all out of business, so none. Every business takes every advantage possible. Selling anything online for a local business is not that uncommon. It is free advertising, and more business without the customer service involved in it.
Yea, I will support local businesses, instead of buying my first gun online, I shopped around and bought local. Do I feel bad getting eyes, ears, targets, and keeping all my shells for reloads? Not really, I have to save money somehow right?
I saw a Taurus 24/7 45 for 350.00 brand new at the local shop. That is a steal imo. They must not be able to get rid of it.
Yea, I will support local businesses, instead of buying my first gun online, I shopped around and bought local. Do I feel bad getting eyes, ears, targets, and keeping all my shells for reloads? Not really, I have to save money somehow right?
I saw a Taurus 24/7 45 for 350.00 brand new at the local shop. That is a steal imo. They must not be able to get rid of it.
Kind of Blued
Member
If a gun is more than about $600, I'll buy it online to save money.
If a gun is less than about $600, I'll buy it locally to save money.
Depending upon your state tax rate and your FFL's transfer fee cost, there is an exact point (to the cent) at which the two mediums are equal.
My reality is that my schedule keeps me busy from the time that gun stores open, to the time they close. Consequently, I buy most of my things online because I don't have the means to actually go visit a gun store.
On top of that, I'm a heartless capitalist that doesn't feel guilty that I'm not helping a semi-retired guy compete against a faceless superstore run by robots who bring the store's shelves to your couch at 1:24AM.
On top of THAT, the closest gun shop lists most things ABOVE MSRP.
If a gun is less than about $600, I'll buy it locally to save money.
Depending upon your state tax rate and your FFL's transfer fee cost, there is an exact point (to the cent) at which the two mediums are equal.
My reality is that my schedule keeps me busy from the time that gun stores open, to the time they close. Consequently, I buy most of my things online because I don't have the means to actually go visit a gun store.
On top of that, I'm a heartless capitalist that doesn't feel guilty that I'm not helping a semi-retired guy compete against a faceless superstore run by robots who bring the store's shelves to your couch at 1:24AM.
On top of THAT, the closest gun shop lists most things ABOVE MSRP.
lamebums
Member
I'm someone who will not buy anything unless I can see it in person first - which rules out pretty much any website or mail-order business that doesn't at least have a walk-in window and/or isn't within driving distance.
That said, I have a hard time buying from a little guy when his prices are twice as high as can be found at Wal-Mart, Aim, or even by hunting for deals at the shows. There are some that will cut you a fair deal, but there are others that are just flat-out overpriced.
(Anyone in the Cincinnati area, if you'd ever been out to Mark's Guns... you'd know what I'm talking about.)
That said, I have a hard time buying from a little guy when his prices are twice as high as can be found at Wal-Mart, Aim, or even by hunting for deals at the shows. There are some that will cut you a fair deal, but there are others that are just flat-out overpriced.
(Anyone in the Cincinnati area, if you'd ever been out to Mark's Guns... you'd know what I'm talking about.)
JohnBT
Member
"What gun shop doesn't have a website running and trying to sell things online? Well, they are all out of business, so none."
Just to prove you wrong.
They've been working on their web site for years - slowly, oh so very slowly - because they have about as much business as they can handle already.
"Winchester 2008 Ammo Dealer of the Year"
www.greentophuntfish.com
Just to prove you wrong.
They've been working on their web site for years - slowly, oh so very slowly - because they have about as much business as they can handle already. "Winchester 2008 Ammo Dealer of the Year"
www.greentophuntfish.com
ThePunisher'sArmory
Member
All ways support your local dealers! Say for instance you buy a gun and need some sort of tech support, you know most internet dealers cant be reached as easy or if they even care. Secondly internet sales of guns will be one of the first things king obama will try to dismantle. In my area within 25 miles of my house there are about 6 different dealers that i can go to, one of those is my favorite and will work with me on pricing all the time. This store is Ron Joes sporting goods, in Ofallon, Il if your ever in the area. As for ammo one word of advice to everyone, RELOAD. The impending doom of the US 2010 budget will drive the price and availability of all products up especially ammo. Good luck to all and God bless.
DammitBoy
Member
I support the one shop in town that treats me with respect as a customer and makes an honest effort to make me happy.
He remembers what I'm interested in, and actually calls me when he sees a deal at a show or online. He is prompt with calling me when my guns come in, he doesn't try to bs me with any nonsense.
He will go online and show me the price he pays for what I want and gives me a small mark-up over his cost.
I've bought about 6 guns from him this year and did five transfers through him so far this year. When he can't find what I want he doesn't give me flack for ordering from others through his FFL.
He gives me a discount on his ammo prices as marked, he is friendly and considerate whenever I talk to him, no matter how many customers he has. We remind each other of upcoming gun shows and he doesn't moan and complain about my gun show purchases.
I have got him interested in starting to sell at gunbroker.com and we have discussed what I look for when purchasing online.
The other places in town don't know my name, even though they have seen me every month for years and I have bought guns &ammo from them. They do not want to order anything they don't stock, whether it is guns, ammo, or accessories. They refuse to do transfers on any weapon that they already carry. These guys don't deserve my business.
He remembers what I'm interested in, and actually calls me when he sees a deal at a show or online. He is prompt with calling me when my guns come in, he doesn't try to bs me with any nonsense.
He will go online and show me the price he pays for what I want and gives me a small mark-up over his cost.
I've bought about 6 guns from him this year and did five transfers through him so far this year. When he can't find what I want he doesn't give me flack for ordering from others through his FFL.
He gives me a discount on his ammo prices as marked, he is friendly and considerate whenever I talk to him, no matter how many customers he has. We remind each other of upcoming gun shows and he doesn't moan and complain about my gun show purchases.
I have got him interested in starting to sell at gunbroker.com and we have discussed what I look for when purchasing online.
The other places in town don't know my name, even though they have seen me every month for years and I have bought guns &ammo from them. They do not want to order anything they don't stock, whether it is guns, ammo, or accessories. They refuse to do transfers on any weapon that they already carry. These guys don't deserve my business.
DammitBoy
Member
Yeah, I can order that for me works though, because if I order it - I'm paying shipping and a transfer fee.
If the local shop is willing to order it for me at the same price or close to it - why not order it from the shop?
It saves hassles and you support a local gun shop.
If the local shop is willing to order it for me at the same price or close to it - why not order it from the shop?
It saves hassles and you support a local gun shop.
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