Idle musings on straw purchases

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White Horseradish

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Is any purchase of a gun that is for someone else and not a gift a straw purchase?

I've heard it said so and I've heard it said that only purchases for someone not legally able tobuy a gun is a straw purchase. So, if I buy a gun for my neighbor Joe who is a known alcoholic with a criminal record , that is clearly a crime. But what if I buy a gun for my other neighbor Jack who is an upstanding member of the community, philantropist, CCW permit holder and kind to kittens? If I know for a fact that he has a valid CCW, that tells me he can legally own a gun. Would buying one for him be a crime?
 
it doesn't matter if the person you're buying for is legal or not, it is ILLEGAL for you to lie on any government form.

In essence what makes a "Straw Purchase" illegal is that you have to lie to the question "Are you the actual purchaser of this firearm?"
 
Suppose you truthfully say you're buying it for him? Does the law state that you may not buy a gun for anyone else or that you may not buy a gun for anyone prohibited from buying a gun?
 
The paperwork (form 4473) must be filled out by the "actual purchaser" (and then the "actual purchaser" goes through the NICS check).

therefore if someone buys the gun for someone else and fills out the paperwork they would have to lie to answer "yes" to the "are you the actual purchaser" question.

Again, the crime of "Straw Purchase" is not "buying a gun for someone else" the crime is "Lying on a government form."

If you want to buy a gun for your neighbor, you buy it yourself ... put a bow on it and give it to him as a gift.



This instructional cartoon might help answer your questions http://www.atf.gov/firearms/ffrrg/theater/toon4.html
 
Buying a gun for your neighbor who is legally entitled to possess a firearm and then giving it as a gift = OK.

Taking $500 from your neighbor to pick up a Glock for him at the local gun store = straw purchase, lose FFL.

I remember the first pistol I ever bought. I was under 21 at the time but had a father who didn't think owning guns was all that unusual. We went to the gun store and I picked out a Browning Hi-Power. He told the clerk "OK, give us that one" and I took out the money to pay for it. The clerk about had a coronary since he recognized this could be a "straw purchase". However, since he knew us both personally, he was able to be persuaded that it was in fact a gift from father to son.
 
No gift giving

Buying a gun for your neighbor who is legally entitled to possess a firearm and then giving it as a gift = OK.

The above statement is wrong.:uhoh:

Regarding the gift giving, the person would have to do a transfer. More paper work. No gun can be a gift, without paperwork. Not in my state anyway.
 
No gift giving

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Buying a gun for your neighbor who is legally entitled to possess a firearm and then giving it as a gift = OK.

The above statement is wrong.

Regarding the gift giving, the person would have to do a transfer. More paper work. No gun can be a gift, without paperwork. Not in my state anyway.
Click to expand...

Not true. In California, gifts of firearms to members of your immediate family are perfectly legal and do not have to go through a dealer. The new owner of a handgun would have to register it with the state.

Also, anyone can give a rifle or shotgun that is over fifty years old to any other California resident that is legally able to possess firearms. No paperwork or dealer involvement is required.
 
Terminology

Neighbor, family. Gift, register it with the state. Transfer, no dealer involved.
Go to Sacramento and get it done, or go to a dealer or contact your local DOJ?:uhoh:

Some are right and some are wrong.
 
Neighbor, family. Gift, register it with the state. Transfer, no dealer involved.
Go to Sacramento and get it done, or go to a dealer or contact your local DOJ?
Click to expand...

Immediate family (grandparent to/from grandchild, parent to/from child, between spouses) no dealer involvement but have to register handguns with the state.

Anyone elso, with a few exceptions, you have to transfer the firearm through a dealer with all the DROS paperwork and waiting period.
 
I remember the first pistol I ever bought. I was under 21 at the time but had a father who didn't think owning guns was all that unusual. We went to the gun store and I picked out a Browning Hi-Power. He told the clerk "OK, give us that one" and I took out the money to pay for it.
Click to expand...
I have reason to believe this sort of father/son transaction is very common. ;)

Getting away from the father/son thing, in most states (Places like Califonia are an exception) there's nothing wrong with using your money to buy a firearm as a gift for someone you have no reason to believe is in the "prohibited person" category . . . heck, even gun-controller Sarah Brady (!) bought a rifle for her son as a gift. It's only a problem if the other person gave you the money to purchase the gun on their behalf.

IANAL, but it seems that without a paper trail (like a cancelled check) it would be difficult for .gov to prove - or even be aware of - a straw purchase unless you make a habit of it or the ultimate recipient is a "prohibited person."

And if he's not prohibited, there would seem to be VERY few reasons he wouldn't be buying it himself.
 
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