IDPA vs USPSA vs Whatever

[ccw_steve]

I am new to competition....in fact I have never shot competitively before!

So my question is this, what is the difference between IDPA or USPSA or any of the other hundred acronyms I have heard??

Should I do one over the other?

How do I get started (in terms of joining an event)?

For reference, I live south of Seattle, WA and would really like an event that I could participate in weekly or biweekly.

 

[Justin]

The claim for IDPA is that it's supposedly more "real life" or "tactical" or whatever.

The biggest difference between IDPA and USPSA is that IDPA has certain rules requiring you to do certain actions "tactically".

For instance, in IDPA, you're required to execute reloads from behind cover, and can be penalized for reloading while standing in the middle of a course of fire. USPSA does not differentiate, and you are free to reload however/whenever you want.

Both games are fun and can be played by anyone who has a pistol, holster, mag pouches, and four or five magazines.

At this point, don't sweat the differences between the games so much. Go find local matches, sign up, compete, have fun, and learn the rules as you go along.

 

[MrBorland]

Check out the sticky at the top of the page. It might answer some of your questions.

http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=236788

Should I do one over the other?

How do I get started (in terms of joining an event)?

I'm pretty new to competitive shooting myself. IMO, just find out what's available, such as a local IDPA match, download a copy of the rulebook off their home page, read them, then show up. Be sure you're there for the safety briefing if there is one. IOW, find out what time you need to show up vs what time the shooting starts.

Once there, listen and watch carefully, especially to the RO. Then relax, be safe and have fun.

Seems to me that most people start with IDPA. Around here, there are several regular IDPA matches run, so one can easily shoot weekly IDPA. Also, it's more regimented than USPSA, with a fairly fixed course of fire, and emphasizes the use of the real-world gear one likely has anyway. That said, there'd be nothing wrong with starting with, say, USPSA, ICORE or steel challenge.

 

[Sam1911]

Welcome! You're going to love it!

How to decide?

Well, on the face of it, USPSA (IPSC) and IDPA are very similar. Both requiring one shooter at a time to negotiate a course of fire as quickly as possible while engaging (shooting) multiple targets from various positions and around obstacles, also while not shooting "non-threat" targets.

USPSA is more of what some call a "run & gun" event. You shoot targets as fast as you can in whatever order you wish, from whatever locations are allowed. There are various divisions to allow competition with off-the-shelf guns, single-stack guns, revolvers, and all the way up to "race" guns with compensators and optic sights. You may drop your magazines and ammo and reload whenever you wish. Concealment garments and the use of positions of cover are not required. USPSA also expands the game to include rifles and shotguns in special two-gun and three-gun matches. USPSA matches tend to higher round counts, and the competition can be extremely fierce, especially as they can have cash prizes.

IDPA was formed as a reaction against some of the "excesses" or "impracticalities" of IPSC. IDPA is supposed to more closely reflect "real-world" shooting scenarios that an average CCW type might have to deal with. It doesn't do this terribly strictly, and isn't much of a substitute for defensive shooting training, but some folks really do enjoy that focus. In IDPA you will be required to shoot from positions of cover (behind corners, obstacles, etc.) instead of from out in the open. You will generally have to wear a coat, jacket, or vest that conceals your handgun. You will have to retain all live rounds while shooting, as the philosophy of the game doesn't allow you to abandon ammunition that you could possibly find a need for later. Reloads are only to be performed in a position of cover, and, again, you can't drop a half-full mag -- you've got to retain it.

Your gun, ammo, holster, and mag pouches must conform to a set of guidelines which try to define what might be practical on the street. (No "Open" class race guns. No competition-only skeleton holsters. Etc.)

IDPA round counts are a bit lower, usually, (maybe 80-120 rds. per club match, rarely more than 250 for a major match). There are no cash prizes, and the competitiveness might be described as a little more relaxed.

Some folks find IDPA to be a bit stifling with all the rules of what you can shoot where and when, where you can reload, etc. Others find them a fun challenge.

Don't wait any longer. Just go show up at a match and talk to folks. If you've read over the equipment rules ahead of time, and think your gear would work (just use your carry gear at first), you can probably shoot that day. These folks all love to bring new shooters into the fold and they'll be happy to walk you through.

An even better option would be to call the contact folks for your local clubs and see if you can come out to one of their practice nights. Then you'll find they have all the time in the world to introduce you to their sport.

Good luck, and remember -- the only thing you'll impress ANYONE with is how SAFE you are!

 

[ChristopherG]

Search for the Renton Fish and Game Club; they host good matches of both IDPA and USPSA persuasions and are friendly and welcoming. Look at the webpages of both disciplines to decide which you'd like to try first (IDPA is generally easier to break into for new competitors, IMHO, but both are perfectly doable). Show up, sign up, tell them you're new to it, and they'll be glad to take you through your first match at the pace that's safe and appropriate for you. You will NOT regret it.

 

[Hk Dan]

Sam pretty well nailed it.

Shoot both! I do.

USPSA will probably lead to better shooting, with more emphasis on "the shooting", where IDPA lends itself to more tactical thinking. Neither are training--they're games--IDPA is generally less formal, more subjective, and easier going. USPSA is intense with people who are intense competitors, but the rules are nailed down a lot better and there is almost no subjectivity in their interpretation.

Of the 2, USPSA will be more fun (generally) and IDPA will be more relaxing.

One man's opinion,
Dan

Ps--IDPA clubs vary INCREDIBLY. Some run USPSA-Lite, and others run real, defensive stages. If you can find the latter, I'd far prefer to shoot that than USPSA.

 

[ccw_steve]

Wow, this is the reason I love this forum

I ask a question and get clear, concise, well formulated ideas that help answer my question (not to mention all within a couple of hours)!

Thanks everybody, these kind of comments are exactly what I was looking for!

As of now, I think I'll start with IDPA at Renton Fish and Game Club, and we'll see how it goes from there...

 

[1SOW]

Be sure to try USPSA too. It isn't what would be called relaxing, but it is addictive and also lot of fun. In both, your going to meet friendly people glad to help you enjoy the sport.

Steel Challenge is also a great shooting venue, also more relaxed rules. There tends to be less movement and the emphasis leans toward accuracy. The 'kid' will come out in you when you fire and that steel target goes "D I N G" and falls down. Expect Steel: round plates, squares, triangles, bowling pins and those pesky poppers to name just a few.

Some ranges offer USPSA/IDPA "League Shooting". This is a great way to shoot every week and learn the ins and outs of the games.

Shoot what you've got. I started with a Sig 239 and some cheapie Uncle Mike's holsters and had a ball. I'm still enjoying it years later (different equipment) and now compete against my son. He's faster. I'm more accurate. He wins, but that's good.

Be prepared to enjoy yourself.

 

[ny32182]

The only thing I really find subjective in IDPA is use of cover. At a sanctioned match they will have the same SO staying on one stage and running everyone, so as long as he/she is consistent, subjectivity can be brought down to a minimum.

Some people don't like some of the other IDPA rules, but all games have rules. I have never shot a USPSA match, so can't speak to the level of competition there, but especially if you are new I think you will find that IDPA can provide as much competition as you can handle for a while: There will be dozens of shooters there, but only one can win.

 

[W.E.G.]

Similar games.
Neither one really "like a real gunfight."
After all, in a real gunfight, you should occasionally get shot, and that won't fly at most ranges.

Big variation in "customer satisfaction" based on who is running the match, and where the match occurs.

Try the events in your A.O., and decide what entertains you best.

 

[David E]

www.uspsa.org

www.idpa.com

Both sites have a "club finder" feature to locate matches near you.

 

[Jim Watson]

Try to avoid the "Whatever" shoots.

There are a lot of places putting on IDPA or IPSC "style" shoots where the local range operators edit the rules to suit themselves. You can have fun, but you will have a potential for confusion if you then go someplace that plays by the official rules. IDPA and USPSA/IPSC are large sanctioning organizations that try to keep things consistent.

 

[raz-0]

Most people are talking about "what it is". About the only thing they left out is there will be more backing up in IDPA than in USPSA. Which can be an issue for some people.

I'll talk about it from a competitive standpoint.

From a show up and shoot things while socializing a bit, either can be great. However, if you are there to compete, IDPA bothers the heck out of me. Mainly because IDPA has less rules and more cheating. The crux of the problem is "failure to do right". What constitutes reloading behind cover? Whatever the stage officer says, which might not be the same from one stage to another even at the same match. What makes it worse, is that it's often not the same even on the same stage, even if the SO isn't playing favorites (which happens a lot more than it should). If you have a good, fast shooter they often get away with more stuff than a slower shooter simply because the SO can't keep track of everything they are doing as well.

If you like competing and don't want all the rules of USPSA, you can try any of the various flavors of static steel. It's a pretty good stepping stone to some of the more complex games.

 

[David E]

raz-o, sounds like you have a bad IDPA club.

I've found that the higher classified shooters get scrutinized (screwed?) more often than the lower class shooters. Everyone should get the same call for the same offense.

But the OP needs to know the matches and rules aren't that complex, at least, they don't need to be. Do what the stage requires the best you can and let the penalties, if any, fall where they may.

Go out and shoot either IDPA or IPSC/USPSA and have fun!

 

[Black Dime]

The IDPA game allows the semi-auto AND the revolver. IDPA has a class for single stack 45acp. Two revolver classes and two additional semi-auto classes. Power factors for each class. Glocks generally rule and the S&W claims the revolver crowd.

Then there is ICORE. Study IPSC/USPSA and you have IPSC/USPSA with a revolver.

 

[Hk Dan]

Black Dime, USPSA has a revolver and a single stack division too.

The other main difference between IDPA and USPSA is that IDPA is generally more scripted. USPSA is designed to allow each shooter to solve the shooting problem in his or her own way, and IDPA was designed to test a given solution to a given problem. Everybody has to shoot the stage pretty much the same way.

Of the 2 sports, I prefer IDPA, but you just can't ignore USPSA. It's fun, and it'll do more for your development as a competitive shooter than IDPA. The rules are written to take out all considerations except the shooting and the stage rules. They are well thought out and very complete. They have a system in place for clarifying rules by asking the NROI staff. As much as I like IDPA, they just ain't that hot in those areas.

Dan

 

[racine]

Whatever?

"...Of the 2, USPSA will be more fun (generally) and IDPA will be more relaxing..."

I shoot both when possible and have to say USPSA is competitive but only as much as you want it to be. I find USPSA(evolution of IPSC-with similar IPSC rules) to be the most relaxing shooting of all. There is a camaraderie in this sport and only you will create that tension. Most folks shoot for fun and with several divisions you're bound to find one that fits you. What you get is proficiency in handling your firearm, trigger time, proficiency at troubleshooting the intricasies of your particular gun, proficiency at reloading and shooting from many difficult situations. The competition is there but only you can make it as stressful or enjoyable as you want. I have a stressful job and find that USPSA is a relaxing alternative and more so than golf.
IDPA that I participated in was originally at the Firearms Academy of Seattle(but it was not in Seattle). I wanted to check it out and found the atmosphere somewhat tense with mostly cops at that venue. They have since dropped IDPA as not being "...truly tactical or practical enough..." for their own philosophy. I found the realistic scenarios very trying and troubling both from a legal and real world sense. I usually left those matches tensed up, befuddled, perplexed and in general not getting enough trigger time. I know that the FAS facility is a great training ground attended by many renowned shootists. I rarely shoot IDPA now because I feel their weapon regulations are a bit stiffling and unrealistic. I mean that I can carry 15 round mags so why use a 10 rounder and why limit 45acp to 8 rounds or so when new guns hold 12-13??? MY experience is more with USPSA but I'll continue to shoot IDPA in some clubs that are more of an IDPA light. If I want to train 'tactically and correctly' I'll go to Thunder Ranch or Blackhawk or someplace to do that. HTH...

 

[Marc257]

Whatever competitive arena(s) you choose to try (there really is no try, you just do), be sure you have secured an avenue for acquiring or producing plenty of ammo. It’s like heroin, one shot and you’re hooked.

 

[pwrtool45]

It depends on the match director. Club matches, run by the book for both USPSA and IDPA will vary. Wildly.

There are stereotypical matches for both. There are IDPA matches that are "IPSC lite" (as another posted intimated). There are USPSA matches are are little more than "2 rounds each at 4 targets, move, repeat". And all manner in between.

When you ask the question "what's the difference" people will give you differing answers because where they shoot, that's how it is. That's the state of action pistol. I hope you find good matches-- either IDPA, USPSA, or both-- and enjoy them. But be advised, just cuz Cletus sez IDPA sux for reason X or Jim Bob sez USPSA sux for reason Y, doesn't mean that's going to be your experience.

For sports having so many bloody rules, the experience sure varies from one club or MD to the next.