Rob96
Member
45/70
If you had to choose one caliber to hunt all North American game which do you choose?
- Thread starter blackops
- Start date
- Status
Uncle Mike
Member
-funny you say something like this... my safes are full of ' inadequate' calibers in which I have had the oppertunity to buy back from our clientele...
Many have purchased standard caliber firearms only to miss or wound and loose game with them do to inadequate marksmanship and or field skills....
Later they(the persons of lesser marksmanship) return with said inadequate caliber firearm telling of how they put round after round in the sweet spot only to have the game in question elude them unscathed.
This is when the 'I must have a larger, more poweful caliber' talk starts....
The lesser caliber is at fault (for my miss or poorly placed shot)... I hit that animal just right and it got away... if I only had a super sexy highspeed magnum I would have gotten that animal.
So off they go with todays latest, greatest magnum.... hmmm, I should start a magnum collection.... you know, they come back in with the same stories, only this time they are holding the big magnums in thier hands.
Many, if not all of these buy backs are in excellent, sparsely fired condition...
RugerOldArmy
Member
Gotcha. The writer wasn't trying to make a point, he was just ridiculous. All that experience hunting brown bears, and yet he dares to form an opinion that disagrees with Karamojo Saturno. Perhaps he has never seen those fine groups you shoot with your keyboard.
I'm convinced. I think you're right. An '06 is a suitable DGR...for you.
1911shooter
Member
338-378 weatherby mag. i love this gun and do not feel that a big magnum is the answear for everyone. but i use this for everything from deer to bears and it has never failed and as long as i do my part never will.
Art Eatman
Moderator In Memoriam
There is hunting, and then there is stopping--so I'm gonna leave the Big Bears out of it.
Since I can handload a 00 Buck for a squirrel load, an 80- or a 110-grain for varmints and on up to 180s for bigger critters, I'd most likely stay with my '06. It's nowhere near the only good one, of course, but it's the one with which I've been playing for nearly sixty years. You know how hard it is to break a habit.
Since I can handload a 00 Buck for a squirrel load, an 80- or a 110-grain for varmints and on up to 180s for bigger critters, I'd most likely stay with my '06. It's nowhere near the only good one, of course, but it's the one with which I've been playing for nearly sixty years. You know how hard it is to break a habit.
Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow
member
- Joined
- Nov 14, 2007
- Messages
- 13,146
Yikes!
Well, that's ONE way to do it. Yup, it's ridiculous. Some people think it must be the caliber's fault. Now it MAY be the bullet choice fault (wrong choice of ammo by the owner), but 99.999999% of the time, it ain't the caliber, and it's missing the mark more often than the bullet construction choice.
Reiterate that .280 rem is what I'd use if I could only have ONE centerfire rifle.
I don't think he was trying to make a point...He was dead serious...considering the fact the he thinks the 338 Win Mag is minimum acceptable....
He can have all experience you want blasting the woods with portable howitzers....point is that thousands of grizzly bears have been dropped by the 30-06 and similar, quite comfortably...ask the natives....this fact is undeniable...something that you, conveniently, decide to ignore....so don't argue with me....I just comment facts....go and tell them that their rifle is inadequate...
I guess that before the super boomers of the last 40-50 years everybody was crapping their pants in Alaska for lack of adequate power right???
And you confuse groups with caliber..power with accuracy...what is your point??
Like Float Pilot said, is a well known fact that the minimum accepted caliber for bears tend to get bigger the more close you get to urban areas....the "sunday hunters"....
Thank you for the Karamojo label, but as I said before I never hunted a bear and I have no desire to...but I know quite few people that did it and even got pictures to prove it....I have enormous respect for them...what my groups has to do with it???
The last one is a retired oil prospector that worked in Alaska for more than 30 years...his favourite bear defense gun??? A pump shotgun stuffed with Brenneke and his trusty Remington Model 760 in 30-06....
I like the words of an old ranger: When they say, "that monster was soaking up 375 bullets like candies!!!" they forget to mention that one went to the guts, the other busted the bear's foot, two others went in the air as the shooter was crapping himself....then the guide, to make his client feel good after the dollars he spent on the trip, told him that his shooting was perfect, spot on, nothing wrong with your ability... "
I do not think there is nothing useful to add anymore to this discussion so I stop here......some people rely on raw power some on accuracy....the 30-06 have proven itself up there without our bickering back and forth...
Look at this video of the typical sunday hunters shooting all over the place....I bet you think that the caliber was inadequate!!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0CNgwZgoKFc&feature=fvw
Last edited:
I pretty much always opted for my M70 '06 when I lived in interior AK, over the 338 win mag. Most guys that I know hunt with 308s 300 win mags or '06s. Native Alaskans living in the bush love 30-30s for subsistance rifles.
Handguns are 357's and 44's. My partner and I hunted grouse with our 1911's often when on greyling fishing trips.These were our SD weapons as well. Locals usually grin at the big yuppy stuff. (500 sw magnum with 9 in bbl type stuff.) There is quite an industry selling artillery to outsiders and newcomers though.
A fisherman stopped a charging brownie with a 9mm a few years back.
The bush is all about practicality and using what you have. In the unlikely event your attacked you had better use it well.
Handguns are 357's and 44's. My partner and I hunted grouse with our 1911's often when on greyling fishing trips.These were our SD weapons as well. Locals usually grin at the big yuppy stuff. (500 sw magnum with 9 in bbl type stuff.) There is quite an industry selling artillery to outsiders and newcomers though.
A fisherman stopped a charging brownie with a 9mm a few years back.
The bush is all about practicality and using what you have. In the unlikely event your attacked you had better use it well.
olyAR73
Don't worry...in a few years the 338-378 will become the minimum recommended for bears......you know, they evolve....becoming more and more bulletproof by the year....
Typical perfect CNS shot during a lion charge....severed spine I guess...game over......303 British or 458 Lott doesn't matter at that distance....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rIPAuLd-zvw
Don't worry...in a few years the 338-378 will become the minimum recommended for bears......you know, they evolve....becoming more and more bulletproof by the year....
Typical perfect CNS shot during a lion charge....severed spine I guess...game over......303 British or 458 Lott doesn't matter at that distance....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rIPAuLd-zvw
hogmanahoo.com
Member
30-06,
1911shooter
Member
If they are gonna tell us the 338-378 wby is the min. then i dont want to hunt those animals because there would be a problem. i only use it because i like my Accu-Mark and all my handloads are tailored to my game. and i shoot it better then many other rifles i own, it fits me perfect.
hogmanahoo.com
Member
m1a1 tank,can kill gut skin and wrap the meat all in one shot just as good as a big gut blowing magnum
Joe Demko
Member
.45-70
Joe Demko
Member
No doubt bears can be tough and grow to large sizes. It is a puzzlement how they were ever killed before the development of depleted uranium slugs and powered aircraft.
Very true...but it is one of the most misunderstood concept...
When you hunt, a broadshde shot by the book from 150-200 yards on an unmolested bear that takes lungs or heart is a perfect shot...the bear may die very quickly or require a little bit of tracking...
In a charge situation, only a CNS hit (very difficult) virtually guarantee a stop...a busted shoulder may slow the critter down a bit for you and give more chances at shooting more....
So when someone says that a 30-06 is good for hunting bears but inadequate at stopping them is simply not true...instead a different shot placement and set of skills (and a good dose of luck!!!) are required...the animal is the same and the caliber is the same.....the bullet still plow through bone and muscles...
From more than one person that been there and done that I heard that actually the newer super powerful high velocity rounds may be at disadvantage at very short distances because if you hit a bone even a premium bullet may fail....at one time a 300 Weatherby Magnum failed to penetrate at extreme short range (less than 10 yards) because the bullet literally exploded on impact...a slower caliber may have gone through.....
Vern Humphrey
Member
Read the title:
The question is not "What is best for brown bears?" or "What is best for antelope?"
For all North American hunting, the best choice would be a flat-shooting cartridge of reasonable power, falling some where in the middle range, neither a shoulder-bruising specialty dangerous game stopper, nor a pip-squeak.
When you look at candidate cartridges, and consider overall versitality, you wind up with something like the 7mm Rem Mag, the .30-06, or the .300 Win Mag.
The question is not "What is best for brown bears?" or "What is best for antelope?"
For all North American hunting, the best choice would be a flat-shooting cartridge of reasonable power, falling some where in the middle range, neither a shoulder-bruising specialty dangerous game stopper, nor a pip-squeak.
When you look at candidate cartridges, and consider overall versitality, you wind up with something like the 7mm Rem Mag, the .30-06, or the .300 Win Mag.
HydeSmyler
Member
- Joined
- Dec 20, 2008
- Messages
- 31
30-06
woof
Member
If I had to choose one caliber it would mean I was way too financially strapped to be hunting a fraction of the game in North America.
Master Blaster
Member
No Big game around here, and if I had to choose one for survival and feeding hungry children, Rifle it would be 17HM2 (.22lr otherwise if HM2 wasnt availible), but really it would be a 12 Gauge shotgun, shot slugs buck will take just about any game as far as I can see around here.
Yes....at barely more than 1/3 of velocity....in those distant times they had no choice other than to increase the size and weight of bullets because of the limitation of black powder...for example the monstrous .577 Snider cartridge of the late 1800s developed only ~1600 ft/lb at the muzzle....
The large caliber smokeless express cartridges of the early 1900 were built (including the medium caliber 375 H&H) specifically for the largest African mammals, Elephant, Rhino, etc... I doubt at the times the 375 H&H was considered necessary in Alaska
Large calibers have indeed their usefulness do not get me wrong....nobody is bashing the big bores here....Bell shootiung elephants with his 275 Riugby is the quintessential definition of being severely undergunned!!
But the tendency in the last decades is to increase what is considered minimum acceptable for every game....
The 30 WCF is nowdays considered entry level on deer.....100 years ago it was God's lightning on Bambi compared, let's say, to a 44-40 WCF.....
The 348 Winchester, the 45-70 or the 358 Winchester were considered very good big bears busters in AK, with muzzle energies, at best, on par with the 30-06....in the 1960's even 44 Magnum lever carbines were used as good light and handy bear defense tools up there....very flexible because of the revolver round, so you could have one cartridge for rifle and handgun like the good old frontier times with the 44-40 WCF....
But the tendency in the last decades is to increase what is considered minimum acceptable for every game....
The 30 WCF is nowdays considered entry level on deer.....100 years ago it was God's lightning on Bambi compared, let's say, to a 44-40 WCF.....
The 348 Winchester, the 45-70 or the 358 Winchester were considered very good big bears busters in AK, with muzzle energies, at best, on par with the 30-06....in the 1960's even 44 Magnum lever carbines were used as good light and handy bear defense tools up there....very flexible because of the revolver round, so you could have one cartridge for rifle and handgun like the good old frontier times with the 44-40 WCF....
Last edited:
- Status
