In a 1MOA barrel do you count a miss less than an inch a hit?

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jon_in_wv

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A while back a "sniper" on Youtube was ripping my shooting ability yet bragged incessantly about his prowess shooting "dimes" offhand at 100 yards with his AR. When I watched his video he was shooting at black dime sized pasties and in fact missed every single one. BUT here is the kicker. He said his barrel was a 1 MOA barrel and being so if he missed by less than an inch it was in fact a perfect shot and he counted it as a hit. I don't want to bash the guy but rather address that concept. Do any of you guys agree with that and if so help me out. It seems to me if I say I can reliably shoot a dime at 100 yards I better darned well be able to do it. If I hit it, I hit it but if I miss it then its a MISS and I can't do what I said. I can't see missing and calling it a hit. If I knew my rifle could only shoot 1 inch groups and I was shooting at something smaller than that I would feel that anything around the mark was pretty good but then I wouldn't brag that I could hit it either. I bet a friend of mine I could shoot a 6 inch pie plate at 600 yards with my 308. I think my 308 will shoot less than 6 inches at that distance if I do my part so there is a fair chance I'll hit it. I wouldn't tell people I could reliably hit a 3 inch plate at that same distance though. To me the other guys logic seems like I could just shoot at the 3 inch plate and after I shot and missed I could say, "See, hit it. My rifle shoots 6 inches and I only missed by 2 so BULLSEYE." :scrutiny:
 
"It seems to me if I say I can reliably shoot a dime at 100 yards I better darned well be able to do it. If I hit it, I hit it but if I miss it then its a MISS and I can't do what I said. I can't see missing and calling it a hit. "
I'm with you. Now if he said he could hit within 1 MOA of a dime that would be different. Also a black dot is not a dime, even if it is the same size. Either can be hard to see at 100. I bet the lighting would matter.

How do I get to the videos.

Also How does one establish a barrel is 1 MOA? I have shot a sub 1/4 moa group @ 100yds with my rifle, that does not make it or me a guaranteed 1/4 moa shooter.
 
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As much as I hate to jump in on these things, a HIT is a HIT and a MISS is a MISS. Pretty much black and white there, nothing in between.

I agree, if you say you can hit a dime at 100-yards every time, then hit the dime. If those had been steel plates or actual coins, a close shot that didn't take it out is still a miss. That's actually one of the things I like about shooting reactive targets; there's no fudge-factor ("Oh, it was pretty close so it should count"). It's either HIT or MISSED.

And your 6" target at 600 yards is 1-MOA. It's perfectly possible to hit, but you'll need to be fairly close with your wind reading ability.
 
I think you should bash the moron and also critique his claims. As was said, a hit is a hit and a miss is a miss. Claiming a miss is really a hit is just part and parcel of the "everybody gets a trophy" stupidity that is tanking this country.
 
The guy sounds like a tool, close only counts with horseshoes and hand grenades! A hit is a hit and a miss is a miss.

FWIW the average shooter couldn't hit the head of a barrel at 100 yards offhand let alone a dime.
 
The guy who commented on your video sounds like a jerk. I guess that means that if I miss a deer at 150 yards with my 8MOA mossberg 500 then it's actually a hit...

Would somebody mind finding bambi and telling him? I'd like some venison for supper and feel I am owed as much for trying really hard!
 
Lemme see now....
A dime is roughly .75 inches in diameter, so a hit 1 inch from the pasty is right about ... ummm ... add the one.. carry the naught... 1.35 inches from the center. Add another shot that misses by an inch on the other side and you've got a group 2.35 inches or so.

In the immortal words of Inigo Montoaya, "One MOA? You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means."
 
Jon,
I shoot my air rifle daily. 2500 rounds this year. I only shoot open sights with it. This week I shot on 3/4" dots from 14 yds. In prone I got 15 out of 20 in the black with 3 on the left edge. Of the 5 that went out to the right All were due to mistakes I made. I can't blame the rifle or pellets. The sight picture is not an easy one.
A dime measures about a 1/16" less.

I am not a big fan of talking stuff or making excuses. The 2 together are even less appealing.
 
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Amazingly no it was not him. The guy must have been a clone though. I would post a link to this guys video but you know how the mods frown on the bashing and that isn't my intent anyhow. I'm just trying to make sense of the logic or at least validate to myself that he was full of "you know what".

Funny, another claim he made was that he shot it offhand because shooting off the bench is SOOO much harder because even an ant crawling across the table will throw your shot off! He also shoots his Kimber Desert Warrior at 50 yards and brags about his groups which are at least 3 feet around. I don't get some people.

But back on topic at least I think we all agree that calling a miss is NOT a hit?

And BTW, I was cracking up reading some of your responses. I love it.
 
Jon,
post links to your videos. I can figure out where to look from there.

"But back on topic at least I think we all agree that calling a miss is NOT a hit? "
Anytime a person doesn't do what they claim they will it is a miss.
 
MY videos are under my same name on Youtube. If memory serves me I was originally attacked because I said my personal converted Saiga AK has shot 2-3 inch five shot groups on another persons video. I was quickly attacked at how stupid I was because AKs are only capable of 4 inch groups at best and I'm a moron.
 
Next time I go to a small silhouette match I'll let them know that all the plates I didn't knock down should count because I was within an inch. I'm sure they will count them. As has been said a hit is a hit, a miss is a miss.
 
"Next time I go to a small silhouette match I'll let them know that all the plates I didn't knock down should count because I was within an inch. I'm sure they will count them. As has been said a hit is a hit, a miss is a miss."

If I was match Director I would let that fly. If and only if you wore a boony with 12 gauge shells in it, a 'Tap-out' shirt, have bad lighting, out of focus images and have an overly long intro. Oh yeah, you also need to start calling out all those dirt shooters!! Plus you need a rocking sound track.
 
I'm just trying to make sense of the logic or at least validate to myself that he was full of "you know what".
Click to expand...
It's not logic he's using, it's excuses. There are competitions where if your hole even touches the edge of the ring it doesn't count as a hit.
BTW were these one shot groups? I can shoot .224" one shot groups all day with my AR-15.
 
I just saw two videos the "dime" is missed on the first 'engagement'. It was missed and then 'engaged' again. Wait 'operators' say 're-engaged'.

Search for 'shooting a dime' on you tube. Actually I am not going to crack on his shooting. I don't belittle anyone shooting. His perception of it is off, IMHO.

Hold on someone is walking up asking where I learned to shoot like I do. gotta go . . .
 
My opinion, for what it's worth, is that if the guy says he can hit a dime at 100 yards or meters and he didn't actually hit the dime, it's technically a miss because the target is the dime, and the dime wasn't struck by the bullet so therefor the shot was a miss as it did not strike the intended target.

The only way this guys' logic works is actually shooting at live targets. If you're aiming center of heart and miss the dead center by 1/4 of an inch, it won't matter, you still hit the heart and they'll be dead.
But this doesn't go for dimes. Say you can hit the dime, then hit the dime and if you don't then you missed.
 
And claiming that "well, the rifle is 1 MOA...therefore I get any shots within that range around the target" is silly. There are times a shooter is 3/4" high, but the rifle counteracts it and it's a hit. There are times you're 1/2" high and the rifle adds 1/2". Shooting is the combination of the shooter and the rifle.

So if you say you shoot a dime sized group at 100, a dime should cover the group. If you claim you can consistently hit a dime at 100 yards, the edges of every shot should touch it. If I claim I can shoot a dime-sized group with a Mac-10, and then make a 15' allowance for it, that's just stupid.
 
I'm always open to critique of my shooting albilies, especially by people that are more talented and experienced than I. However, this guy is sounds like a clown. The minute he's called to put-up-or-shut-up he'll just claim some bogus excuse, then change his user name and disappear for a while.

I've been shooting competitively for about 7 years now and the best score that I've ever mustered offhand was a 94-3X in a match and a 96-4X during practice. If this guy can shoot sub-MOA offhand, I'd expect to see nothing less than a 100-10X on his scoresheet.

Bottom line: you just gotta blow this guy off. Any competitor worth his salt is going to see this guy for what he's worth. Measure your abilities by marking your own progress. Once you can consistenly shoot master/high master scores, then you earn the right to talk a little trash ;)
 
jon, you're dealing with a guy who's covered all over with terminal stupid. My advice? Don't deal. Stay away. Ignore. Just figure, "His face was flushed, and his broad shoulders didn't save him."
 
Trust me, I have NO dealings with him. I blocked him and his buddies who STALKED me on Youtube and I didn't post anything for over a month just so the psychos would move on. Eventually they did. I was just talking to someone the other day and I was reminded of his "1MOA Barrel" logic and I wanted to know what you guys thought of it. Funny, all the guys in that little circle are all expert snipers who have infinite and limitless knowledge of marksmanship (though they didn't seem to grasp some of the simpler ones) yet none of them seem to have actually BEEN snipers. Everyone else is a "dirt shooter" because all we can do is shoot the dirt while they can pull off amazing feats of marksmanship at all distances. Of course the fact a miss is a hit and when they can't shoot a group they are actually shooting perfectly and its the weapon that is at fault helps a lot.
 
Just because he wants to call a cat's tail a leg does not make it a cat's leg. A miss by any other name still smells the same... or... you can wrap a turd in rose petals but it still smells like a turd.

He said he could hit the dime and he proved he couldn't, excuses, even had it been a good excuse, do not miraculously turn a miss into a hit... cept maybe in golf.
 
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