Indian Army dumping the INSAS assault rifle

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nathan

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Hope we see parts kit of these coming into the United States,

Yet another move by the Indian Army to dump indigenous equipment has come under sharp focus within the services and outside. The decision to look for a foreign replacement for the Indian small arms system (Insas) assault rifle ¡X the standard rifle of an Indian soldier ¡X came as the army is under attack from various quarters for its resistance to the Arjun tank. The Insas and Arjun are indigenously made, and are among rare successes for India, which is heavily dependent on foreign firms for defence equipment.
The army wants to dump the Insas as it allegedly doesn¡¦t measure up to its requirements. One of the arguments is that it does not instantly kill the enemy (owing to the use of 5.56mm ammo). But its defenders pointed out that it was not supposed to kill the enemy, but injure him so that in a battlefield more of his fellow soldiers are busy evacuating the injured.

A serving senior officer from the infantry said it was baffling that the infantry directorate has issued a global tender for replacing the Insas. ¡§It has been designed precisely according to our quality requirements. If we have new requirements, we should ask the ordnance factory board to rework it, and not scrap the project,¡¨ the officer, who was involved in the induction of Insas, told DNA. He pointed out that the rifle had undergone several refinements, so it is now a ¡§good weapon¡¨.

Insas is a 5.56mm rifle, and performs as well as any in its class, argued its supporters. ¡§It may not be as finished as others, but then you get an Insas for only Rs24,000. Its comparative guns are in the range of Rs1.25 lakh,¡¨ an official pointed out.

The global RFP (request for proposal) issued for a new assault rifle for the army stipulated that it had to be lighter than 3.5kg, making impossible for the Insas to even compete in the tender; an Insas weighs 4.1kg.


Related link: http://www.dnaindia.com/india/report_now-army-wants-to-dump-the-indigenous-insas-rifle_1349259
 
This being about India I am guessing there were multiple bribes involved in this process. Nothing happens in India unless a lot of palms are greased.
 
It will be intersting to see how this plays out. We met be seeing the beginning of a resurgence of country specific military cartridges.

First china and now India.

What's next?
 
FN is salivating. Someday, perhaps they can achieve the arms maker's ultimate goal: supply both sides in every conflict!
 
If I recall correctly the INSAS is slightly over 10 pounds loaded. I sure wouldn't want that kind of weight in a combat rifle.
 
If America adopts the 6.8 SPC or whatever that 6.5 is, would that be a county specific cartridge?

Looks like it could be a fun gun if they import part kits in and someone makes recievers.
 
What were they expecting, Klingon disruptors?
They're Indian! who cares what they expect just as long as the world gets another cool larger than 5.56mm assualt rifle cartridge

would that be a county specific cartridge?

some historical and recent examples
6.5x55 Swedish
303British
7.5x54French MAS
6.5x50mm Arisaka
30-06 Springfield
45/70 Gov't
and the new 5.8x42 mm Chinese
 
Probably they are just as satisfied with the Lee Enfield No 1s and Ishapore 2A1s , hehehehe.


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Because TTIWWOP:
600px-800px-INSAS_Rifle.jpg
Looks pretty much like a Galil to me.. and I already have one of those. If parts kits were available, under current regs the barrels cannot be imported.
 
with the whole "doesn't kill instantly, made to wound so they have to evac, etc. etc." argument, I'd say they should switch to something new, and possibly catch up not only in modernization, but also in closing the (mis)information gap they seemingly have on firearms knowledge.

Besides, I heard this had been in the works for awhile that they were planning to switch to the AK-103 under license.
 
Indian Army uniform regs. "Pants should pretty much be lighter in color than the shirts. Any color except blue and red are OK. Light green, brown or khaki is preferred.""
 
Its a hodgepodge of a design , with FAL and AK influences
...and G3...and Galil. Seems like they took the worst from each...G3 charging handle, rear sights on cover, front sight on GB (short radius), proprietary rock-n-lock magazines (and everything else), and heavy weight. Yep, looks like a winner to me...crazy Indians. Go Pakistan! :p
 
Neither India nor Pakistan have that great a military.... at the moment, the main advantage both sides have is large numbers, and large potential numbers.

The INSAS by the way also had problems in very cold and very hot weather. It was a joke in the desert... and India is a very diverse nation with many different ecosystems....

By the way, it is quite natural that different nations go to an indigenous cartridge. But, in the case of India, I would bet that they adopt an AK variant (probably the AK-103), and either use 7.62 Combloc, or .308 WInchester (and knowing how cheap and dinky the Indian Military is, it will almost certainly be 7.62x39mm)
 
We all know India is synanymous with mere talk than real substance. They probably just end up ordering a lot of Russian AKs. Problem solved. But again, they hate to give up the old warhorse, the venerable Lee Enfiled NO 1s . They are loyal to anything British as much they wanted to be seen as an independent nation.
 
What do you want to bet they end up with a supply of M-16/M-4s? I still remember seeing all those M-4s destroyed by the Russians following their b-slapping of Georgia.

Yes, I think our tax dollars will fund the project to help fight terrorism in India with products procured from American defense contractors (not necessarily American owned companies, but those that supply our needs.)
 
The Pakistanis have been sold to the AK 47 s reliability for many decades. India will probably followed suit . While M 4s performance in Afghanistan has been an issue of controversy, for which theres no doubt the Indian commmanders are fully aware of.
 
What do you want to bet they end up with a supply of M-16/M-4s?
Not hardly, as least not from us. We are allied with Pakistan, and not terribly friendly with India (somewhat akin to our relationship with China). I think they are more likely to end up with AKs, probably something along the lines of the AK-74, despite the "weak" cartridge.

:)
 
But its defenders pointed out that it was not supposed to kill the enemy, but injure him so that in a battlefield more of his fellow soldiers are busy evacuating the injured

Do suicide bombers really want to go to Hospital?

India is having its share of religious terrorism. India scrapped its 308 ( the FAL) back in the 80’s, so maybe there are some smart guys left in the Military who remember how effective a full power round is in combat, and want one back. Unlike in the US where the 308 was phased out of service rifles in the 60’s, and no living memory exists in a post Vietnam hierachy. For most of the Brass, the most dangerous duty they had was attacking beer bottles in Germany.

You can count on our anti gun American Government to block importation of these Indian rifles and their parts.
 
The newer AK-100 series are dramatically improved in the accuracy department. There's really nothing wrong with them. It makes sense that India would switch to them. Honestly, if I had to go into battle with an AK-1xx or an M-16, I'd choose the AK. They're accurate out to the maximum effective range of the cartridge, they're absolutely reliable, and they're cheap. They're also easily customizable to individual needs with a furniture swap. Magazine changes honestly aren't that bad once you get used to them.

Even if these rifles were available as a parts kit, I'd rather have a Galil. Lighter weight, and looks a little better.
 
Having read that among western aircraft (Lockheed, Boeing, SEPECAT, Mirage), the Indian Air Force also consists of Russian-built Mi helicopters, Antonov/Ilyushin transports and Mig/Sukhoi fighters etc, nothing would surprise me regarding weapon systems for their army.

After the Mumbai terrorist attacks in late' 08, the Indian Army or police on the streets were filmed with Lee Enfields.
 
India would be a very natural ally for the US, too bad politics and our Pakistan entanglements will probably get in the way.

FN could make them a bunch of M-4s chambered in 6.8, let them test it out.
 
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