info on a rifle (St Etienne Mle1890)

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runfrumu

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updated*info on a rifle (St Etienne Mle1890) w/pictures

Trying to find out some info on a rifle for a friend. I've googled and can't find alot about it. From what i've read so far it's a French Mannlicher Berthier, model 1890 and I'm pretty sure the caliber is 8mm lebel. It has St Etienne Mle1890 on the barrel and also 3080 which I'm guessing is the serial number. I havent got to see it but he's sending me some pictures of it soon. anyone got any info on these things?
 
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Stock and barrel both have 3080 on them.
 
It is French, probably re-arseneled sometime after 1927. On the barrel opposite the side where it says MLE1890, will be a year. That will be the year the barrel was made. Mine says MAC 1908, the MAC tells who made the barrel and 1908 is the year. The gun is worth about $200 in good condition. It does shoot 8mm Lebel, you can get custom loaded ammo from Gad's Custom Cartridges and the best deal on brass is Grafs and Sons Reloading. The brass is about $40.00 for 100 shipped and uses large rifle primers, I use large rifle magnum because I had a problem with squibs. The bullet diameter is standard 8mm which is .323" and I shoot 170 grain bullets. Lee Pricision carrys the reloading dies. Be careful shooting surplus WWI or WWII ammo. Look at the head stamp - if it shows an "N" on the headstamp, do not shoot it unless the receiver on the gun has an "N" stamped centered on the top. N is more powerful than the standard ammo and could damage the gun if the gun was not tested and rated for the N ammo. I got the opportunity to shoot one round from WWI era. It went, "Click", wait, wait, "BANG!". I have an AR-15 and an SKS and the Berthier is the funnest of them all to shoot to me.

I love my MLE M16 Berthier - it is a great shooter and piece of history. If you google French Berthier Rifle you should get plenty of hits. I am on a remote dial up connection now, so I can't post any of the links I have found.

Also there is a 5 round clip for that rifle. The rounds load into the clip and the clip with rounds push down into the magazine box. When the clip is empty, it will drop out the trap door in the bottom of the magazine box. You can shoot the gun without the clip, just sit a single load on top of the magazine follower and push it into the chamber by closing the bolt. I haven't had much luck with clip loaded ammo, so I shoot mine single shot.

Looking at the pictures that have finally downloaded, that gun may or may not have been re-arsenaled. PM me with more pictures of all the markings you can find and mid-next week I can research and tell you more about it.
 
Thanks for the info. I've sent you a PM with a link for 7 pictures total. The rifle is in pretty rough shape, a couple of places have pretty good chunks of wood missing. All the numbers I can see on it match, 3080. My friend is gonna bring it to the gym this coming weekend so I can look at it better. His father-in-law gave him the rifle, but from where he got it i have no idea.

the number opposite the barrel says MAS 1892 and some kind of circular stamp beside the 1892. so is his one of the earlier ones?
 
That one is very similar to mine. The pic below doesn't show it very well (it is the 3rd one on the left). Mine is a 1892/27 Chattleraut. It only has the 3 round 8 mm Lebel magazine. The original sling is on it. Mine is like yours in that the stacking swivel is broken off the nose cap (I've been searching for years for one to no avail). It is also has a "N" rated barrel.

I've enjoyed shooting my reloads. As posted above, Lee makes dies. Graf's has brass.

I'd say yours has had some work/upgrade done to it at arsenal because the ramrod channel is filled in on the left side of the forestock. That's the only clue I see but NavyLT seems to know more than I do.

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Tamara's writeup
http://cosmolineandrust.blogspot.com/2006/11/berthier-mannlicher-mousqueton.html

GUNS magazine writeup
http://www.encyclopedia.com/doc/1G1-140411696.html

Here's some for sale
http://www.collectiblefirearms.com/RiflesMannlicher.html#a rifles Mannlicher-Berthier

General pics
http://www.rememuseum.org.uk/arms/rifles/armfrc.htm
 
I always liked the looks of these rifles.
The Apes in the original "Planet of the Apes" movie were armed with full stock Turkish Forestry Carbines.
Cool rifles.
 
iamkris: "I've enjoyed shooting my reloads. As posted above, Lee makes dies. Graf's has brass.

I'd say yours has had some work/upgrade done to it at arsenal because the ramrod channel is filled in on the left side of the forestock. That's the only clue I see but NavyLT seems to know more than I do."

What is your reload recipe? There is lots of very conflicting info out there. Most of the unofficial info says 45-49 grains of 4895, but the Lee reloading manual I have says 31.5 to 33 grains max. I have tried 36 grains of 4895 behind a 170 grain bullet and that seems pretty weak. But that's a big jump to 45-49 grains! Cartridges of the World publishes 45 grains 4895, I think, to duplicate the military load.

My favorite reload is 33.0 grains H335 behind 170 grain bullet with a LRM primer.

The cleaning rod channel filled in means it was re-arsenaled. When I get off of the travel assignment and get back to my broadband connection, I can find out the exact information regarding when they filled in the channel.
 
The cleaning rod channel filled in means it was re-arsenaled. When I get off of the travel assignment and get back to my broadband connection, I can find out the exact information regarding when they filled in the channel.

I "think" it was in the 1927 series of upgrades...but don't quote me...I'll do some research as well.

I haven't done a bunch of reloading for it yet, so I wouldn't call myself an expert. I would agree...that is a lot of diffrence in powder. I've only tried IMR 4350 and a 220 gr bullet but the loads are closer to 40 grains. What concerns me is 4350 is a slower powder than 4895 so I need to go check my sources again.
 
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