Informal Benchrest shooting issues.

[DasFriek]

My CZ Ultra Lux .22kr fights me, How do i stop that?

This has been confusing me and i cant figure out how to stop it without cutting my guns barrel. Which i wont do.

50 yards is my range position.
I shoot off a Caldwell Rock with a CZ Ultra Lux with 28" barrel.
I have been using my own self made rear bags as i cant tell if my issue may be related so i keep changing its style.
Trigger has an 8oz pull.
I use Mostly Aguila Match rifle for bulk shooting but for serious shooting i use Wolf ME, RWS TR and Lapua Center X.

The problem is the gun fights me with what id guess is barrel whip but its like a wave where the gun feels like its doing the dance move the "Worm". And it tries to get away from me. I can actually call a flier before it hits the target as my scope will settle there after a shot. But im hopeing correct equipment placement and technique will fix my issues.

I did a measurement of my last outing and i average .5' groups and 1Moa groups. But it was a fatiguing battle to do it.

Ive tried to position the front rest under the screw that holds the stock and barrel together where i was told was the best place and keep it rearwards toward the magazine.
Ive even moved it out as far as to touch the sling stud.

The rear ive tried about every thing i can think of. A dual bag setup with a leather vise style clamp just behind the hand drop.
Then again with a bag in the middle and with it at the tip of the end.

My best results so far have been with the front rest at the stock/barrel lug and the 2 bag setup in the middle of the rear stock. Then even tho the stock is clamped in the rest pretty well ill put my finger on the stock to help hold it down on the rest. Then i firmly put the stock into my shoulder.
My right hand grabs the stock at the drop tightly and i relax my pull finger and just have a lite touch to fire the gun.

Then the gun jumps and its not a recoil jump either and its like a wave moving backwards like i said before.
Id bet if i just layed the gun on the rests and just touched the trigger with my finger it would come out of the rest and not even hit close to where it was aimed.

Any suggestions or reading material id appreciate it.

 

[benzy2]

Your front bag could be too full. I have heard you see a bit of vertical jumping with an overpacked front bag. Another thing to remember is the lux stock was never designed to ride the bags and isn't going to be a benchrest stock. It wants to roll and be all over the place. It takes a lot of work to keep that stock on track even with a good rest and rear bag. Second, you shouldn't clamp the stock in the rest. The stock should ride in the rest. Again I hear you get a bit of vertical jump if you try to clamp the front of the stock into the rest. I'm not sure how you are clamping the stock but ease out on it so it can slide easily. Recoil is your friend and you want it to come straight back. If you mechanically stop the rifle from recoiling back it will turn that linear force into torque and you will see the barrel try to jump. So get rid of any clamping action and depending on what type of front bag you are running maybe soften it up a little. Just know that the front end of a lux is as far from a bench rifle design as you can possibly get and you are going to fight on a bench to get every ounce out of her. If you wanted a bench gun you should have looked at the varmint model.

 

[DasFriek]

Good advice, And yeh the UL wasn't the best choice for a BR gun and i know that now.
Mainly due to the stock, Luckily i can always swap it out also.
While waiting on answers to the thread i found some info online also that backs what you say so ill definitely be giving it a try.
I think the rear bag will be where i make or break the gun as i have to fight the large droop in the stocks rear. I have a few rear bag designs i can work with that should work out ok.

 

[kenno]

Fights YOU?
It's a freaking machine. Switch back to a machine that does not 'fight you'.
And yes, I am a proffesional consultant; that will be $5,000.00
TYVM
BTW I open in Vegas next July

 

[benzy2]

On mine I notice that the rear sling swivel would hit the bag a bit. I took it off because it was tossing the rifle around. Its something to consider as well. I find even the sling studs became an issue at times and would remove as well if needed, but I will say I don't use a sling on most of my bench rifles so I didn't worry about it being removed.

 

[kenno]

Let me know when your paper targets start to move, and grasp RPKs or RPGs
and before you say how important the skills learned on the 50 ft range are,,, NO don't say that. DO NOT SAY THAT

 

[M1key]

The CZ Varmint model shoots Aguila SSS into one hole at 50 yards fairly consistently. Give one a try.

 

[Runningman]

I have a CZ 452 Lux and a CZ 453 Varmint. I can tell you the CZ Varmint style stock has a lot more going for it shooting from a benchrest set up. The varmint stock is wider at the forearm with less radius and doesn't have nearly the drop off at the butt of the stock. Consequently it sits more stable in a Benchrest setup.

Not saying the CZ Varmint is the ultimate set up for benchrest either, it just better than the Lux style stock. I can really see a difference when I shoot my Suhl 150 off a benchrest compared to the CZ 453 Varmint.

Those Lux stocks are mostly designed for iron sights. Everything gets whacked out when you scope them.

As suggested already you might take some of the sand out of your bags.

How much scope are you using?

 

[MythBuster]

You sandbaggers are some really weird folks.

 

[Uncle Mike]

You scoped a Lux....and now you have a 'chin' gun. The less than stellar cheek weld you have to utilize with a scoped rifle that has a 'hog back' stock will definitely blow the wind out of your accuracy sails, not too mention the thin forend and pistol grip that stock has.

I have never seen, or heard for that fact, of a 22LR exhibiting noticeable or detrimental barrel whip! I'm sure there is some, found only with a super pueter' and a slide rule, but seriously...the rifle worms around from barrel whip...no, I ain't buying it!

More than likely the problem is the result of the way your having to drive that thing, with its stock dimensions.

You could get a CZ Varmint stock, or an aftermarket stock that has a comb more suited for scope use...one with little or no drop across the comb, and put your barreled action in that.

With a wide(r) forend a beter pistol grip and a high comb, you'll have to fight your rifle no more!

 

[Walkalong]

You sandbaggers are some really weird folks.

Ya don't say.

Yep, shooting off bags takes some getting used to. If the gun doesn't fit the bags well, it won't shoot well because it's hard to be consistent.

I think Uncle Mike is onto something about the "chin gun" thing.

 

[d2wing]

+1 what benzy2 said. Do not clamp the rifle at all. A soft bag works better than a hard surface. Try to be consistent in your hold or lack of hold. It is benchrest not benchgunclamp. You should expect to resight after each shot.

 

[DasFriek]

Well i got some good advice, I suppose thats not bad.
I am kicking around the idea of restocking the gun with a target stock.
But until then i think body position and bag positioning will help alot.

 

[Art Eatman]

I have a concave front rest into which I lay a soft sandbag. No roll with a round forearm, as there is some support from the sides.