Is it better to carry an unreliable pocket auto or no gun at all?

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albanian

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This is a serious question. I had a few tiny autos that I would have carried and kept if they worked. The Kel-Tec P-32 comes to mind. If it had been reliable, it would have made a good CCW. When I had it, it was so easy to carry that I actually would carry it with me any and everywhere. It weighed not much more than a pocket knife and it had a clip so I just stuffed it into my pants pocket and clipped it on. It was not reliable so I dumped it.

The thing is, there are times that I don't carry my S&W 642 that I would carry if I had a smaller and lighter gun. Is it better to at least carry a gun even if it may not be reliable rather than go without? What I carry now when I can't carry my S&W 642 or Kahr K-9 is a good knife like a Spyderco Para-Military. It is not a gun but it is much better than nothing. Is a jam-o-matic P-32 better than a knife? What are the pros and cons of that situation? This doesn't have to be about Kel-Tec so if you happen to own a reliable P-32 or P3-AT, good for you. I am trying to say how bad Kel-Tecs are, it is just that they are the perfect weight and size but reliability was the issue for me.
 
Get the keltec fixed, in the meantime carry that big ol heavy 642. I'd invest in a good pair of shoes since I wouldnt want to fight with either of them.
 
If I don't trust it, I won't carry it. I do trust kel-tec products, provided they pass my reliability testing. I've yet to see a kel-tec that couldn't pass, although most of them need some work first.

The Rohrbaugh R9 comes to mind, it's expenisve, but small and light enough for a true pocket gun. Great gun, but they have priced it out of my range.

Seecamp, AMT Backup, NAA mini revolver, there's several choices in good quality pocket guns these days. Even a derringer might work, if you had no other choice.

I'm not young enough, strong enough, fast enough, or experienced enough to get into a knife fight, and I know it. I carry a knife as well, but things would have had to get pretty bad before I would challenge a street punk with it.
 
I've never thought of a 642 as a big heavy gun. Why not just use it instead of the Kel-Tec. The 642 is in a more effective caliber, and there is nothing wrong with the 642 as a defensive weapon by any means.
 
I've already dumped the Kel-Tec and there is no way I will be getting another one. I tried to get it fixed but apparently you can't fix a turd.

I know the 642 is not that big and heavy but I still find that I don't carry it as often as I would carry a Kel-Tec P-32 sized pistol. If during those times that I choose not to carry the 642, should I carry a lesser gun or no gun at all? That is the choice. I will carry a knife all the time anyway because I used it for more than just defense of course. I have no wish to get into a knife fight and I have not had much knife fighting training but it is still a weapon and as such, it is better than bare hands. I have enough knife training to know that if the chips were down, one could do some damage with a knife. It is not idea but I am trying to decide if it is better than a POS pistol that may or may not work when you need it. I think I have already made up my mind because I ditched the small auto idea until something better comes along.
 
cmidkiff said:
The Rohrbaugh R9 (expenisve, but small and light enough for a true pocket gun)
Seecamp, AMT Backup, NAA mini revolver, there's several choices in good quality pocket guns these days. Even a derringer could work
Click to expand...
 
albanian said:
This is a serious question. I had a few tiny autos that I would have carried and kept if they worked. The Kel-Tec P-32 comes to mind. If it had been reliable, it would have made a good CCW. When I had it, it was so easy to carry that I actually would carry it with me any and everywhere. It weighed not much more than a pocket knife and it had a clip so I just stuffed it into my pants pocket and clipped it on. It was not reliable so I dumped it.

The thing is, there are times that I don't carry my S&W 642 that I would carry if I had a smaller and lighter gun. Is it better to at least carry a gun even if it may not be reliable rather than go without? What I carry now when I can't carry my S&W 642 or Kahr K-9 is a good knife like a Spyderco Para-Military. It is not a gun but it is much better than nothing. Is a jam-o-matic P-32 better than a knife? What are the pros and cons of that situation? This doesn't have to be about Kel-Tec so if you happen to own a reliable P-32 or P3-AT, good for you. I am trying to say how bad Kel-Tecs are, it is just that they are the perfect weight and size but reliability was the issue for me.
Click to expand...


This is why I've kept a 950 as a pocket BUG. It has never, ever, ever failed to go "bang" no matter what's put in it or how fast it's fired. Derringers, to me, are just a relic of the riverboat and saloon age...two shots isn't enough to matter.
 
albanian said:
The thing is, there are times that I don't carry my S&W 642 that I would carry if I had a smaller and lighter gun. Is it better to at least carry a gun even if it may not be reliable rather than go without?
Click to expand...

Unless you work as a swim suit model why are you limited to such a small pistol?

Carrying is not about comfort -- atleast that is what I thought?
 
I own a Kel-Tec P32, and while mine has been 100% with FMJ ammo, it doesn't like many hollow points. I've carried it as a "last-ditch" at times but my faith in it and it's caliber isn't that high. Honestly, I would rather have my Benchmade folder and OC spray than the Kel-Tec anymore. My general opinion is no gun rather than one of questionable reliability. Not sure how you dress or your line of work, but some of the small revolvers outfitted with a clipdraw or similar practically disappear when clipped IWB and such.
 
I'd probably rather carry a decent fixed-blade knife than an unreliable pocket auto. Bigger holes, usable at about the same range, and knives don't jam.

You may want to look into an alternate carry method, if you can't have your 642 or Kahr with you 24/7. Or maybe a higher quality mousegun, like an NAA Guardian, or a Bauer Baby Browning clone.
 
The benefits of a Keltec are worth getting/making a good reliable one. I've got over 2000 rounds through my P32. The first 200-300 showed a few glitches. After some smoothes and fixes it has been 100%. I carry only hot FMJ and I shoot my carry loads, as-is, every couple of months. Having all your carry gear go bang after sitting in your pocket for a month or two is a great confidence builder.
 
"Am I the only one who wonders why you couldn't carry a RELIABLE pocket pistol? They do in fact make them."

I don't know of any that are smaller and lighter than the 642 and are just as reliable. It seems that when you go to the tiny autos, reliability suffers.

"I'd rather have 1 shot from the Keltec instead of 0 shots at all."

If one shot was a sure thing, I would carry one. The problem is, the trigger axis will break and you may not ANY shots. You may think you do until you pull the trigger. This happend to me. I had shot my P-32 at the range and it worked okay and then I loaded it and put it back in my pocket. The next time I went to the range, the first time I pulled the trigger, nothing. I guess the trigger axis had broke on the last round I had fired the week before. I had been carrying a broken pistol and didn't even know it.

It shook me and spooked me to the point that I decided to dump the P-32. It really let me down and I couldn't trust it after that. Also, it had to go back to the factory TWICE before that happend due to reliabilty issues. All that combined to make me finally give up on the design and the company. At some point, your confidence is just gone and you can't trust a gun like that. I really tried to like it but it let me down and kept letting me down. If I had got one of the reliable ones I have heard rumors about, I would be carrying that right now.
 
I wouldn't carry a gun I couldn't trust.. It could tempt me into a situation where I should have run instead of standing and drawing.

If I'm gonna run, I don't want a POS weighing me down!!

:uhoh:
 
Even a Jennings is a reliable single shot pistol. I'll take that over a knife anytime. YMMV.

I've not seen a gun yet that I can't make reliably empty the magazine when clean -- Jennings included. Still might not get thru a whole box of ammo though.

I have a Jennings .380 I used as a "toolbox" gun. It sat loaded for about eight years, untouched. When I decided I didn't need this anymore, took her to the range and emptied the mag wihtout incident. It'd have done the job up close and personal if needed.

If it fails to fire a chambered round then its not worth carrying until fixed. Other than that remember the 1st rule of a gun fight: "have a gun!".

Edit: if you could leave without a fight and don't, it'll be a bad shoot most everywhere, hope you've got a real good lawyer and lots of cash to pay them with socked away.

--wally.
 
albanian said:
"I'd rather have 1 shot from the Keltec instead of 0 shots at all."

If one shot was a sure thing, I would carry one. The problem is, the trigger axis will break and you may not ANY shots. You may think you do until you pull the trigger. This happend to me. I had shot my P-32 at the range and it worked okay and then I loaded it and put it back in my pocket. The next time I went to the range, the first time I pulled the trigger, nothing. I guess the trigger axis had broke on the last round I had fired the week before. I had been carrying a broken pistol and didn't even know it.

It shook me and spooked me to the point that I decided to dump the P-32. It really let me down and I couldn't trust it after that. Also, it had to go back to the factory TWICE before that happend due to reliabilty issues. All that combined to make me finally give up on the design and the company. At some point, your confidence is just gone and you can't trust a gun like that. I really tried to like it but it let me down and kept letting me down. If I had got one of the reliable ones I have heard rumors about, I would be carrying that right now.
Click to expand...

Thats an interesting story and concern. I didn't think about that.

I was figuring if the gun was unreliable, the person would at least have one shot with the round in the chamber before the gun jammed.
 
From all your comments, I get the feeling you don't like autos anyway, so why not wait until that little .32 magnum N.A.A. top break mini revolver comes out and get one? I think I might want one, myself. The caliber packs a better punch than .32 auto, will push 200 ft lbs even in a safe in a weak action load. I figure it'd be about as effective as the .380 I carry now, at least in terminal ballistics. I'm anxiously awaiting that gun's release. I plan to read a few tests of it, but depending on price and when I can amass the discretionary income...:rolleyes: ...always an effort, I might get myself one. I haven't had to buy reloading dies in a while and kinda like .32 mag as a caliber. I'm hopin' the little thing will be capable of some really decent accuracy. My little .22 can amaze me sometimes, though it's less than a target gun I must admit. But, whadda ya expect out of a 1" barrel with only a slightly longer sight radius? :D

hr32b.jpg


hr32a.jpg
 
I wouldn't carry a gun I didn't trust.
I can just imagine drawing on an armed opponent and just hearing a click.
I'm standing there open mouthed and trying a tap, rack, try again, while my opponent is attacking or shooting.

Bad situation - may have been better off complying or using another weapon.

A knife (or something else) that works trumps a gun that doesn't.
 
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