IWB Carry Qualify as Open Carry in VA?

[JJNA]

So I will be relocating to VA shortly from WA.

I have a WA CCP permit, and intend acquire something similar in VA once I establish my residency there.

In WA, one can carry concealed -- with the permit -- at a restaurant whether it serves alcohol or not (provided one is not located in a "21 or above only" area).

I understand that is not the case in VA (no concealed carry in a restaurant that serves alcohol even if not a bar per se). On the other hand, I also understand that open carry is allowed in VA, including such establishments.

My question is: in an open carry situation, does one have to have an OWB holster OR can one wear an IWB holster, but worn with such clothing (say a t-shirt tucked under the grip area) so as to show all the parts of the gun above the pants?

 

[thorn726]

man i am so new and clueless to all this i had to look up iwb.
yeah throw tomaotes, whatever, im getting there.
hehe. anyway, i found this, you might find it helpful, it refers specifically to
VA right quick too.
http://www.spw-duf.info/holster.html
wow, this is cool- (packing.org)-
In Virginia, one may carry a handgun in the open with no license. Loaded handguns on the seat or dashboard in plain view while in a vehicle are fine. Carrying concealed in places that serve alcohol is prohibited, even licensed, but open carry there is allowed.

theres also this- A. If any person carries about his person, hidden from common observation,

 

[Leatherneck]

"Common observation" is the key here. If you flirt with the law, plan on getting hassled eventually. Just go ahead and openly carry--nothing to be ashamed of, and most PEOs are now knowledgable about the law, thanks to the tireless efforts of VCDL.

BTW, it's not just establishments that serve alcohol; it's any place that has a permit from ABC to do so. May be a distinction without a difference in most cases, but that's the actual statutory language.

Also, why don't you get a non-resident CHP? It's simple to do, and would give you a jump start on getting a resident permit once you move.

TC

 

[hightech]

Va Concealed Carry

I have excerpted the portion of the law that you are interested in. You can read the entire law if you call up the Virginia code and go to sections 18.2-308. Welcome to Virginia.

§ 18.2-308. Personal protection; carrying concealed weapons; when lawful to carry.
A. If any person carries about his person, hidden from common observation, (i) any pistol, revolver, or other weapon designed or intended to propel a missile of any kind by action of an explosion of any combustible material

For the purpose of this section, a weapon shall be deemed to be hidden from common observation when it is observable but is of such deceptive appearance as to disguise the weapon's true nature.

J3. No person shall carry a concealed handgun onto the premises of any restaurant or club as defined in § 4.1-100 for which a license to sell and serve alcoholic beverages for on-premises consumption has been granted by the Virginia Alcoholic Beverage Control Board under Title 4.1 of the Code of Virginia; however, nothing herein shall prohibit any sworn law-enforcement officer from carrying a concealed handgun on the premises of such restaurant or club or any owner or event sponsor or his employees from carrying a concealed handgun while on duty at such restaurant or club if such person has a concealed handgun permit.

 

[Smurfslayer]

this is slightly ambiguous...

The courts have held that a gun was concealed even though holstered in plain view, but obscured by a back pack (or duffle bag). Further, they held that a knife was concealed behind an open jacket on a belt holster.

Obviously it depends on the totality of the circumstance, but the other postings and code section do clue you in - hidden from common observation... and note that it is prohibited on any abc licensed PREMISIS, not the actual restaurant itself... This is also a 'grey' area, technically if you're in the parking lot, and concealed aren't you in violation ???

I don't think that's ever been a problem though.
More specifically, is exposed IWB ok ? I have done it periodically, and in a pinch, I'll do it if I'm not wearing clothing which may *really* obscure the gun. IOW, if it's a black gun & holster, & a black shirt or dark blue, I wear a paddle or similar holster. Why give the law a reason to suspect me of worse crime? OTOH, if the gun is exposed enough that everyone seeing it will know it's a gun... sure, IWB exposed is not hidden from common observation... logically anyway...

 

[BrokenPaw]

Smurf,

As I understand it (and that's worth the money you paid for it) open IWB is ok because the butt of the gun is visible. So as long as your shirt isn't untucked or so baggy that it conceals the butt, you should be OK.

I run into a grayer area of this, because my Beretta's black, and so are most of my shirts, so one could argue that the gun is "concealed" by virtue of indistinct color. SInce I have my CCW permit, I generally don't worry about it, but I suppose someone could split that semantic hair if I was carrying openly in black attire in a restaurant, for instance.

-BP

 

[Shootcraps]

One of the things that confuses some people is the fact that there are no "bars" in Virginia. In order to get the ABC permit, a large portion of your revenue must come from food sales.


And welcome to The Commonwealth.

 

[JJNA]

Thank you all for the replies.

Also, why don't you get a non-resident CHP? It's simple to do, and would give you a jump start on getting a resident permit once you move.

Because I have a WA CCP permit, and VA recognizes it. I still have a couple of years left on my WA permit.

So I figure my WA permit can tide me over until I acquire a VA permit as a VA resident.

 

[brickeyee]

It is correct that there are no bars in the state of Virginia. Many years ago a 75% food/25% drink revenue law was in affect. This moveed to 50/50, and to the present state of 25% food/75% drink. The closest thing we have to a bar is a portion of a restaurant.
A crackdown on 'Happy Hours' occured about 5-8 years ago. Half price drinks are not allowed, but '2 for 1' is allowed. Not the bightest way to cut down on consumption.
Beer and wine are availabel at food stores, but everything else is purchased from state run stores. The prices vary depending how far the store is from a state border. The further you ae, the higher the price. In Northern Virginia the prices are lower, but still much higher than across the river i Washington, DC with private stores.
At the holidays the Virginia State Police have tried to 'stake out' some of the closest to the bridges stores in Washington, but hte DC police tend to run them off if given a chance (tax revenue you know).
Just as an example, a 1.75 l Tanqueray is almost ~$35 in Nortern Virginia state stores. Many stores in Washington have it for ~$25.
All in all we stil have it better than Washington. Handguns are banned over there and the Virginia crime rate is still lower..