Joe Manchin in Washington Post

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Atbat82

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Joe Manchin had this to say in the Washington Post yesterday:

"I make this solemn pledge to all my friends who are proud, law-abiding members of the NRA: I will defend the Second Amendment with every fiber of my being. And I make this solemn pledge to all my friends in the media and entertainment industry: I will defend the First Amendment just as vigorously.

I’m never going to give up my guns — that will not happen. I support a sensible, comprehensive process that can lead to reasonable solutions regarding mass violence. I will weigh the evidence for any proposals put before me, including ways to address high-capacity magazines and military-style assault weapons, improve mental health treatment, and transform a culture that glorifies violence."

I'm not sure what to make of it. Sounds like he's trying to find a way to make gun control palatable. Seems like an uphill battle to me.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/opini...1d4e94-4adc-11e2-9a42-d1ce6d0ed278_story.html
 
I think he came out last week, essentially saying that he'd go along with gun control. Once their email server was overloaded, fax run out of paper and totes of mail delivered amiongst the phones ringing off the hoof from West Virginia, he's taken a different tone.

Jeff B.
 
"Military-style assault weapons, improve mental health treatment, and transform a culture that glorifies violence." sounds like his mailbox must have burst from outraged constituents.

Except that he's glommed onto the magazine capacity limits -- which living in a state with magazine limits I just find plain stupid -- I might agree with much of what he's saying now.

I would interpret "military style" to mean full-auto, and I would think an AR in camo with a stainless barrel was something designed for a farmer or rancher who has a problem with varmints and certainly not "military style".

IMO, Hassan, Loughner, Holmes, and Lanza were <deleted> crazy and it demonstrates the complete failure of gun control that they managed to get anywhere near a firearm. And violent video games and movies can't be doing the psyche of either gangsters or crazies any good.

Focusing on crazies, Hollywood and video games isn't in Obama's or the media's script. But unless the Republicans in the House rush into this (and they aren't budging on tax increases) we should see some hearings diving deeper than ugly, scary black rifles and magazine limits.

I remain curious as to why the State of Connecticut thought bayonet lugs were dangerous, but 100 round magazines were safe when they wrote their own AWB. Just curious. And why haven't they rushed to change their law?
 
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Not sure about the original CT law, though I suspect they just extended the federal AWB, perhaps someone else on here knows more (I was a little young when it passed). I do know there a number of CT pols rushing to pass some new laws. Not sure what Kim of traction they're going to get. Hopefully not much.


Sent from my iPhone
 
I seriously thought Manchin wouldn't become an Obama man, however, I was wrong. He proved it when voting favorably for Obamacare and now speaking against semi-auto rifles.

If he looses his NRA endorsement, it will help us get a Republician senator into office.

Thankfully, I didn't vote for him as Senator.
 
sounds like he is trying to play both sides, first he comes out in support of a AWB, then he says "no no no the nra are good guys I just want to weight all the possibilities and give everything a fair chance to be discussed".
 
Here is the letter he received from me yesterday.

I would like to give you my opinions on the proposed assault weapons ban that is to be brought before congress in 2013.

Our state has always leaned pro 2nd Amendment. You yourself used your pro 2nd Amendment stance to help get elected. In the aftermath of the horrible tragedy that fell on the victims and their family in Connecticut you made the statement that we need to have a sit down conversation. I agree with you that there needs to be a conversation but the topic of this conversation is where we differ. You commonly use you’re A rating with the NRA as talking point. You also state that you are pro 2nd Amendment. In all of your interviews you talk about the need for weapons in the context of hunting and self-defense. While I agree that these are two important reasons for being a gun owner you fail to touch on the topics of why the 2nd Amendment was written.

After the Revolutionary War, when our government was formed and the Bill of Rights written, our Forefathers saw the need to protect our rights and freedoms. The true meaning of the 2nd Amendment has been clouded by the media and government. Somehow the 2nd Amendment is now construed to be the right of the people to own firearms for hunting and sporting purposes. Nowhere in the 2nd Amendment does it state hunting and sporting purposes. The 2nd Amendment states “A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed”. In the aftermath of fighting a war for freedom from an unjust and tyrannical government it is easy to see why our forefathers gave us these rights. Deterring a tyrannical government, repelling invasion, and enabling the people to organize a militia system are all topics that our forefathers had to overcome to gain the freedom of our nation. They then made sure that, we the people, would not have to fight for these rights ever again. Now, with your stance on supporting a proposed assault weapons ban this would infringe on my rights as a law abiding citizen. It is not feasible that this proposed assault weapons ban would be applicable to the military or law enforcement agencies whom are technically government agents. This would then place the power balance between the people and government in an unbalanced manner. The Bill of Rights was written to place limits on power of the federal government and to provide the people with basic inalienable rights.

The 2nd Amendment and the rights of the people have been upheld time and time again. One recent example of this is in the case of Heller v. District of Columbia. In this case the Court held that the people had a right to keep and bear arms for self-defense, without the need to be connected to a militia, which is a frequent argument against private citizens from owning fire arms. In the case Heller v. District of Columbia the majority cites the late William Rawle, a prominent lawyer and member of the Pennsylvania Assembly when he stated “No clause in the constitution could by any rule of construction be conceived to give to congress a power to disarm the people”. The Court also cites Chief Justice Parker when he made the statement “The liberty of the press was to be unrestrained, but he who used it was to be responsible in cases of its abuse; like the right to keep fire arms, which does not protect him who uses them for annoyance or destruction.” These arguments show that private citizens have the right to keep and bear arms. Our current gun laws cover a wide spectrum of who is not authorized to own a fire arm. This is where the focus needs to be, the follow through and enforcement of our current gun laws. Not additional restrictions on law abiding citizens.

There are several ways to work on enforcing our current gun laws. Cooperation and sharing of information needs to be streamlined between local, state, and federal agencies. The ability for family’s and mental health professionals to have persons with mental issues, be removed from having access to fire arms, needs to be addressed. Lastly, a person needs to be held accountable for their actions. There is never going to be an answer on how to stop the random act of a disturbed individual. However, placing restraints on law abiding citizens is not the answer. Throughout history these acts of random violence have occurred. Many acts of violence have occurred in our nation’s history that did not involve “assault weapons” to include the assassinations and attempted assassinations of Presidents Lincoln, Garfield, McKinley, Roosevelt, Jackson, and Reagan. All of these incidents were perpetrated with handguns, mostly revolvers, which were not attacked or attempted to have banned in the aftermath. These individuals acted in an unlawful manner and were dealt with accordingly.

The next topic I would like to touch on is the affect that an assault weapons ban would have on the nation’s economy. Currently with just the threat of an AWB rifles, handguns, and ammunition are flying off the shelves in record fashion. It is estimated that there is currently 10’s of millions of “assault rifles” currently in the US. How would an AWB stop the use of “assault rifles” in crimes or mass shootings? In 2011 there were nearly 11 million firearms sold in the US. Let’s say that the average firearm costs $300. That’s 3 billion dollars spent on just firearms not including accessories and ammunition. The media is saying that all "semi-automatic firearms" need to be outlawed. Let’s say that 1/4 of all firearms sold are semi auto's. That’s 750 million dollars cut out of our yearly economy. Small gun shops, Firearm manufacturers, and other related industries would all be affected by these bans. With the state of our economy is this issue really what we need. To cause a financial break down of an entire industry just does not make sense to me at all.

I would like to thank you for time and service to our country and hope that you look closely at the facts and make an unbiased and well educated decision if and when this issue comes up for a vote by congress.
 
Sounds like we're rewriting history again. Like the ATF sporting purposes test people think the 2nd Amendment is about hunting.

Also divide and conquer. All gun owners need to stand together. There is no bad gun. If you really believe it is the man not the machine than don't get sucked in. Tell you rep you know the truth and aren't willing to go further down the path to slavery.
 
I'm from WV.

Expect Manchin to lose in the next election if he votes for any gun control.

The issue is HUGE here.
 
I think the former gov is starting to back peddle a little on his statements. He is hearing from his constituents now. I expect him to back peddle some more. If he votes for a bill like the new AWB, he won't be re-elected in WV. I view that as fact, by gawd.
 
I was being very giving to the other side. I was merley trying to make a point without having access to actual data. Thats why i used the hypothetical.

No politician is going to sit down and read that. Make letters short and sweet.

And if you're going to use data, make sure it's correct and provide references. Hypothetical means diddly.
 
Manchin wants to have it both ways; it's time for West Virginia to dump his duplicitous hide before he turns rogue again. In the fight for preservation of our liberties uncertain allies are more liability than help. On whose side will he be next time around...or next week?
 
Posted by Atbat82:
Not sure about the original CT law, though I suspect they just extended the federal AWB, perhaps someone else on here knows more (I was a little young when it passed). I do know there a number of CT pols rushing to pass some new laws. Not sure what Kim of traction they're going to get. Hopefully not much.

These are the weapons covered under Connecticut's AWB:

Algimec Agmi; Armalite AR-180; Australian Automatic Arms SAP Pistol; Auto-Ordnance Thompson type; Avtomat Kalashnikov AK-47 type; Barrett Light-Fifty model 82A1; Beretta AR-70; Bushmaster Auto Rifle and Auto Pistol; Calico models M-900, M-950 and 100-P; Chartered Industries of Singapore SR-88; Colt AR-15 and Sporter; Daewoo K-1, K-2, Max-1 and Max-2; Encom MK-IV, MP-9 and MP-45; Fabrique Nationale FN/FAL, FN/LAR, or FN/FNC; FAMAS MAS 223; Feather AT-9 and Mini-AT; Federal XC-900 and XC-450; Franchi SPAS-12 and LAW-12; Galil AR and ARM; Goncz High-Tech Carbine and High-Tech Long Pistol; Heckler & Koch HK-91, HK-93, HK-94 and SP-89; Holmes MP-83; MAC-10, MAC-11 and MAC-11 Carbine type; Intratec TEC-9 and Scorpion; Iver Johnson Enforcer model 3000; Ruger Mini-14/5F folding stock model only; Scarab Skorpion; SIG 57 AMT and 500 series; Spectre Auto Carbine and Auto Pistol; Springfield Armory BM59, SAR-48 and G-3; Sterling MK-6 and MK-7; Steyr AUG; Street Sweeper and Striker 12 revolving cylinder shotguns; USAS-12; UZI Carbine, Mini-Carbine and Pistol; Weaver Arms Nighthawk; Wilkinson "Linda" Pistol
or
A part or combination of parts designed or intended to convert a firearm into an assault weapon, or any combination of parts from which an assault weapon may be rapidly assembed if those parts are in the possession or under the control of the same person.
 
Well I'm another WV resident that was taken by Manchin. The way he talked and he did hunt, knowing his father I thought I could believe him. Well WV screwed up, both senators Rocky & Joe are following Obama's line and bringing the Governor Earl Ray Tomblin, born in the middle of the hills in Chapmansville. Rocky is a transplant that bought his way in. Joe & Earl Ray are natives of WV, talked to both and seemed honest. Usually I get kissed before getting screwed, not this time!
 
IMO, Hassan, Loughner, Holmes, and Lanza were bat**** crazy and it demonstrates the complete failure of gun control that they managed to get anywhere near a firearm. And violent video games and movies can't be doing the psyche of either gangsters or crazies any good.

Billions of people watch violent movies and play video games. Asseting that they are the culprit is just like saying Ozzie Ozbornes songs make people kill themselves. These people are broken in their own right and that is the problem. If there is fault I believe that is is the friends and family around these killers that fail to recognize that they need help.

I remain curious as to why the State of Connecticut thought bayonet lugs were dangerous, but 100 round magazines were safe when they wrote their own AWB. Just curious. And why haven't they rushed to change their law?
December 22, 2012 02:19 PM
We were just up there visiting my wifes family. The news is saturated with it. The legislature is currently discussing what they laws they will meddle with while emotions are high.
 
If the 2nd is attacked, then the 1st rights of the elitist hypocrites better be attacked as well.

In my state, the hypocrites have started making a lot of movies here in recent years. " blah, blah, blah we have contributed $$$$$$ to your state economy." They never acknowledge how much taxpayer money / concessions they get to do it here.

An ever expanding group of pro 2nd members are organizing to find out when / where they will make their crap and perhaps be in the same location when they are. Taxpayer money - taxpayer rights.
 
Translation: Oops I shouldnt have said anything about guns. I need to backpedal some without upsetting the other Democrats in the senate.
 
All that tells me is, he wants to hold onto campaign money from the NRA and the Holywood crowd. What is the evidence? How much will it wiegh?

As far as I can tell, he has no friends in the NRA. He's just another two faced politician. He better pick a side, plain and simply. Your either with the holywood crowd or your with the real people of this country.
Actually, he should be voting the way the people of WV want him to vote.

How can you talk about the screwballs in holywood and the NRA members all in one paragraph. Where did he get the notion that the members of the NRA don't see the 1st amendment as an important right for everybody. :cuss::fire::mad:

OK, thanks guys, I'm done now. Please continue....:banghead:
 
I think he realized he ticked off his constituents. West Virginians should bombard his inbox to voice their displeasure.
 
My letter to Senator Manchin

Im not the best writer, but it will work..........


Senator J. Manchin,
Subject: Gun Control In Wake of the Recent Tragedy

I watched the recent debate regarding gun control on MSN and I am in complete agreement regarding something needing to be done to help better protect our children, as I am a father of two very young children; however, additional gun control is not the answer. As a Life Member of the NRA , I’m very disappointed to listen to an A-rated NRA Senator speak in favor of additional gun control legislation such as what Senator Feinstein will be proposing to Congress. Banning magazines with capacities greater than 10 rounds and semi-automatic rifles (i.e. AR’s and AK’s), misleadingly named “Assault Weapons” is not the answer.

There are two proposals that will potentially reduce the possibility of another heinous tragedy like those that occurred in Virginia Tech, Columbine, Colorado, Arizona and Connecticut: (1) get rid of gun free zones; and (2) improve the mental health system. Gun free zones and mentally ill criminals are the common links between all these events.

I hope you have not retracted your opposition to the UN Arms Small Arms treaty being proposed March 2013 or support any future restrictive gun legislation. It would be a shame to lose your NRA endorsement. If so, I will unfortunately consider other candidates in future elections. Instead, please push your bill to support national reciprocity for concealed carry, as this would be a good first step.

Sincerely,
 
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