Just out of curiosity (.30 Luger)

[Nightcrawler]

Anybody own, ever own, or ever shoot anything in .30 Luger? What'd you think of it? How'd it perform?

Apparently it remains popular to this day in other countries. Lets you have a "WonderNine" in a country where 9x19mm is outlawed for being a "military caliber".

Winchester Ammunition still makes .30 Luger, item number X30LP. It features a 93 grain "Super-X" full metal jacket, with a muzzle velocity of about 1220 feet per second. Pretty anemic, but remember, this can be used in a 90 year old P-08 Luger.

Ruger made a run of P89s in .30 Luger for the overseas market. The P89 is hella over-built for 9x19mm; I wonder how much you could hotrod .30 Luger in it....

 

[MrAcheson]

Its most popular in the "no military caliber" countries in Europe. Its evidentally not a bad performer for what it does. You might want to search under .30 luger here and on TFL. There was a discussion about it a while back where it came out "most lethal" in a study someone did.

This might be off topic but isn't the .30 luger and the round fired from the cz52 similar (but with different power levels)?

 

[BigG]

You could probably convert any gun firing 9mm Luger to fire 7.65 (30) Luger with only a bbl change. I understand you need a weaker recoil spring also because the light bullet may not produce enough recoil to actuate the pistol compared to the 9mm slug. Same case, anyway. There are Browning Hi Powers and Colt Government Models factory made in 7.65mm Luger caliber.

 

[only1asterisk]

I've always thought that a 30 Luger loaded with a 95-100 grain JHP at 1250 or so would make a great SD gun for the recoil sensitive. A Kahr K9 would be a good launcher. I've always kind of wanted a HP in 30 Luger. I may just do that some day.

David

 

[Nightcrawler]

The .30 Luger cartridge is the American name for the 7.63mm Parabellum cartridge. It actually preceeded 9x19mm, and participated in the handgun trials that eventually gave us the M1911.

Another German 0.30" pistol cartridge was the 7.63x25mm, or 7.63mm Mauser. This cartridge had better performance and was too long to be interchangable with the Luger cartridge. It was made famous in the "Broomhandle" Mauser pistol.

The Russians liked the Broomhandle Mauser and the round it fired. Additionally, the Russians liked having all of their service weapons be the same caliber; it made mass-producing barrels easier. So, when they wanted a pistol to replace the obsolete Nagant Model 1895 revolver (which lacked a swing-out cylinder and fired a 7.62mm catridge of its own), they copied the 7.62mm Mauser cartridge, suped it up a little bit, and chambered it in the Tokarev pistol. Eventually, 7.62x25mm Tokarev became one of the most prolific pistol catridges in the world. Ppsh-41 "Burp Guns" firing this round were the most prolific weapon the Soviets used during the 2nd World War, and millions of submachine guns were produced.

 

[BigG]

The 7.63 Mauser/7.62 Tokarev also can be known by its original name, the 7.65 Borchardt cartridge of 1892. The Borchardt was the predecessor of the Pistole Parabellum, a refinement of the System Borchardt made by Georg Luger. Interestingly enough, IIRC, Hugo Borchardt was an American who worked for Sharps and maybe Winchester??

 

[Nightcrawler]

7.62, 7.63, 7.65....which is it?

7.65mm is .32 cal, right?

7.63mm is about .30 cal....7.62mm is exactly 0.3".

I guess the Europeans do the same thing we do, with .44 Magnum being a .429" bore and all....

 

[WonderNine]

There was a heck of a thread posted by "WildRomanian" on FNHipower.com awhile back regarding the .30 luger and HP's.

There's quite a bit of good .30 luger info on there. Personally I think the 7.62X25 round is much better though.

 

[Nightcrawler]

7.62x25 is indeed better...similar bullet, higher velocities.

I remember Wild Romanian...those were some angry threads (he had another name here, I believe). He certainly had some very strong opinions. I wouldn't go so far as to say that, when both bullets are FMJ, that .30 Luger is better than .45ACP, though.

 

[WonderNine]

WildRomanian.....that is the only person on any board who I can read a post and without looking at the name know who posted it....lol

I was reading one of his posts the other day and I was like, this sounds like WR....glanced up...yup...LoL...

 

[BigG]

The Luger cartridge is properly called the 7.65 or in America .30. Why the Euros call the same caliber 7.62, 7.63, and 7.65 is anybody's guess. Could be difference between bore dia and groove diameter? For example, 300 Savage, 308 Winchester, 30/06, 300 Whatsis Magnum, 307 Winchester, and many others all use a .308" diameter projectile. Why? ??

 

[Wildalaska]

I wouldn't go so far as to say that, when both bullets are FMJ, that .30 Luger is better than .45ACP, though.

I should hope not...although the 9mm is far better than the 45


WildwaitingtoattackAlaska

 

[Nightcrawler]

I should hope not...although the 9mm is far better than the 45

I prefer .45 Colt. *shrug*

 

[BigG]

Why .44 has a .429 bore. Back when metallic ctgs were first being introduced, they first converted old black powder models to use the new fangled fixed ammunition. These had an oversized chamber to hold the large ball that acted as a gas seal for the front loaders.

Many of the early ctgs thus came with a full diameter bullet with it retained in the case by a reduced diameter "heel." We still see a vestige of this practice in the .22 rimfire although all other ammunition has been altered since S&W, IIRC, changed to a bullet that fit entirely within the case per specification of the Russians during their production of the .44 Russian series of revolvers.

 

[Tamara]

Nightcrawler,

I wonder how much you could hotrod .30 Luger in it....

Well, I'd start by necking it up to about .355"...

I prefer .45 Colt. *shrug*

But .45 Colt is so common! I'd've figured you for a .455 Webley or .45 Auto-Rim man, myself.