Kids and real guns!

[Grandpa Shooter]

Story reported by ABC 15 News----Phoenix AZ


What would your kids really do if they found a gun?
Reported by: Anne Yeager
Email: [email protected]
Last Update: 3/09 11:26 pm



From behind a two-way mirror, parents, a police officer and ABC15 crew members were surprised when watching what a group of children would do if they encountered a gun.

We try to teach our kids to do the right thing, but we don't always know how well our lessons stick in their minds.

We wanted to test a group of children to see what would happen if we planted a real gun in their mix of toys.

Would the children alert parents if they found a gun or would they play with it?

With extreme precaution to ensure no child was ever in danger parents, a police officer, and ABC15 crew members watched a group of children from behind a two-way mirror.

To make sure the gun was safe, police removed the magazine, checked the chamber and removed the firing pin.

Two groups of children ranging in age from 2 to 12 were tested.

As the first group entered the playroom, their parents, who agreed to the test, watched from behind a double-sided mirror not knowing how their children would respond.

The first group of children quickly immersed themselves, exploring Legos, train sets, and Barbie's Playland.

We talked with parents before our test.

"It's comforting to see it like this first," said Jeannie Wilhoit.

Bruce Hartig added, "I would hope Nicholas would recognize it's a real gun."

When we brought in our test bin and it quickly caught the children's attention.

The children dumped the bin to get more toys, but an 8-year-old found the gun in less than 50 seconds.

He pointed it at a smaller boy and pulled the trigger.

Another boy joined in, wrestled it from him, and swung it around the room triumphantly.

"What I saw [was] several kids seriously injured or killed," Lockhart commented.
The parents were left understandably shaken.
"As soon as he pointed it at his head, my heart stopped," said Hartig with tears in his eyes.

Mike Wilhoit added, "There's my son pointing a gun at somebody else. You're like, 'Wow...scary.'"

None of the nine children went for help.

In our second round of tests, there were seven children ranging in age from 4 to 12, including a 12-year-old Boy Scout.

His parents hoped he'd do the right thing.

When we took our test bin into the second group, we instructed the children what to do in case of an emergency.

It took a 10-year-old boy just 20 seconds to find the test gun.

He pointed the gun and attempted to shoot it.

The Boy Scout wasn't watching at first, but when he saw what was going on, he asked to see the gun.

The 10-year-old tossed the gun to him.

When the Boy Scout got it, he didn't do what his parents thought he'd do.

He looked into the barrel instead.

In all, 16 children were included in two tests and none of them alerted a parent.

We informed the children about the test they were placed in taught them about gun safety.

It's a serious conversation that can mean all the difference when you're not there.

As for how to protect your children, experts say the best way is if you have to have a gun, make sure it's properly stored with a gun lock installed.

 

[Officers'Wife]

So the twelve year old boy scout looked down the barrel... In short, instead of a hands on in depth training session in firearm safety the parents believed the child would know by instinct the weapon was dangerous.

My daughter is two and she already knows that the firearms and my husband's swords are grown-up stuff and not play stuff. We have let her satisfy her curiosity of these items under our supervision. I would be more than willing to have her take the same test.

As someone far wiser than I was fond of saying- 'Ignorance isn't bliss it's a deadly danger.'

Selena

 

[Matthaios]

Wouldn't it be interesting if they had used a third group, a group of children which were taught by their parents about gun safety to see what they would do...

 

[denfoote]

This is part of an attempt to inact California type "child safety" laws here in AZ. In short, they want to make you keep every gun locked up with the ammo seperate. Just like back east!!

 

[Professor Gun]

Officer's Wife, you are right on.

When our two sons were 3 or 4 (they are now 16 and 14) I allowed them to be with me as I handled guns. When they wanted to handle the guns I explained to them that the muzzle had to always be in a safe direction and no finger on the trigger. I would check the action before handing over a gun. If a safety rule was violated, we were done looking at guns.

By the time they got to about age 6 or 7, they were allowed to look at guns if they asked me or my wife. If we were not busy, we would open the gun safe and they could handle guns under our close supervision. By this time they were expected to open the action as soon as picking up a gun while keeping the muzzle in a safe direction and no finger on the trigger. If any safety rules were violated, we were done looking at guns. It was made clear to them if they ever found a gun they were to not touch it, leave the area, tell an adult (I tested them a few times, it worked). It was also made clear to them that if they ever tried to get any guns out of the safe without our close supervision, it would be a very long time before they would handle any guns (along with other punishment)-we never had that problem.

When they were old enough to shoot (as decided by me and my wife), I took them to the range with me. On the way they recited the basic rules of gun safety. At the range only one got to shoot at a time (one string of shots) with me standing over them and they took turns. If one of them violated a safety rule, he had to go sit in the truck for 15 minutes and miss his turns while his brother got to shoot.

Now at ages 16 and 14 they are safer with guns than most adults. They shoot in USPSA matches with me, we are not that good on scores but we have a lot of fun. If they want to look at guns now, my wife or I open the gun safe and go do whatever we were doing because we now trust our sons with firearms. My younger son is turning into quite the little gunsmith.

Education with specific and consistent rules is the best way to keep kids safe around firearms.

 

[Heartless_Conservative]

I remember reading of another one of those a few years ago. Strangely enough, virtually all the kids who responded in a safe manner (didn't play with it, tried to find help, etc.) were graduates of Eddie eagle. To think that someone who had been taught gun safety would act safely around a gun, who woulda thunk it!

 

[shdwfx]

What baloney! Of course the kids behaved the way they did - no training. Without instruction of "if you see a gun, leave the area, tell an adult" and the Four Rules, none of these kids will instinctively know to do the right thing. This proves nothing.

 

[scurtis_34471]

If my daughter was in that room, she probably would have gotten an adult or taken the gun to an adult. Worst case is she would have dropped the mag and chamber checked it herself before getting an adult.

 

[Thain]

As for how to protect your children, experts say the best way is if you have to have a gun, make sure it's properly stored with a gun lock installed.

Funny. I've got a copy of the NRA's Personal Defense in the Home right here next to my computer.

The NRA is considered by most to be expert on this subject... and they say no such thing.

 

[Sans Authoritas]

Dropped magazine, checked chamber and no firing pin regardless, there's no way in the seventh circle I'd allow my kids to be in such an environment for a "test."

I wonder what those kids would do if they put a gila monster in there. Every kid has been taught to fear a skunk from an early age. I bet they'd say, "Eww, a skunk," and run away. Gee, let's have a test and find out these things.

-Sans Authoritas

 

[DaveBeal]

Grandpa, thanks for posting this. It's why I take my sons to the range with me. It's also why putting guns and ammo together in my house requires opening at least two locks, the combinations of which are known only to me.

 

[bnkrazy]

We try to teach our kids to do the right thing, but we don't always know how well our lessons stick in their minds.

I know exactly how my 4yo would react. She got curious watching me handle my guns and I satisfied her curiosity by explaining how they worked, what was the bad end, good end, etc.

She has had many lessons regarding the safety rules, and eventually she asked to hold one herself. I let her after once again having her go over the rules. I showed her how to take the magazine out and visibly inspect the chamber. When I handed it to her, she made sure to keep her fingers away from the trigger and the muzzle pointed in a safe direction. That seemed to have removed the mystery and curiosity for now.

My wife and I also tell her what to do upon finding a gun either here or at someone else's house. She is not to touch it and go get an adult.

I've left one of my guns (confirmed unloaded, and not ever out of my sight) on the couch/coffee table while hiding in a closet to see her reaction upon finding it. This isn't something we do often, but so far she's 3 for 3 over the past year in going to get my wife or I when she notices it. I'm quite proud and can't wait until she starts going to the range with us.

 

[Mr White]

I'd like to have see my youngest son, 11, in that room. He'd have cleared it, field stripped it, cleaned it reassembled it and then advised the cop that he should probably get a new firing pin since his was missing.

 

[hankdatank1362]

I'd like to have see my youngest son, 11, in that room. He'd have cleared it, field stripped it, cleaned it reassembled it and then advised the cop that he should probably get a new firing pin since his was missing.

HAHAHAHA! Amen, brother!

 

[TCB in TN]

My kids all currently have guns in their rooms (12, 13, and 14). Guns are NOT a mystery, they are not something bad, they are a tool, and are to be treated as such. In other words they are to be cared for, respected, and to be used properly. The worst thing that people can do is to add mystery to an object, it just adds to the attraction.

 

[Albatross]

I'd say that the children react differently dependent on the situation they are placed in.

If you take a special trip to a special place (the police station? What other buildings have one way glass mirrors) and then both a few cops and a bunch of parents tell a group of children to go play in that room all by themselves with a box full of toys. They are going to believe the authority figures and assume everything in the box is a toy and that they are in a safe place free from dangerous objects.

Take those same kids put them in a realistic situation, say unsupervised at a weekend neighborhood barbecue with a gun in an upstairs bedroom I suspect the children would have vastly different reactions when finding a gun (regardless of their level of training).

 

[Gunnerpalace]

I'd like to have see my youngest son, 11, in that room. He'd have cleared it, field stripped it, cleaned it reassembled it and then advised the cop that he should probably get a new firing pin since his was missing.

When I was a kid that is what I would have done.

 

[Soybomb]

We try to teach our kids to do the right thing,

I wonder just how many of those children were actually taught anything about guns and not just told "don't play with guns."


Of course I was the kid who had no gun safety talks and found a box of grandpa's .22's one day. I spent a period of time in the backyard with a brick and a hammer trying to get some fireworks. Its been a long time but I seem to think I may have been hitting the wrong end

 

[chris in va]

How were the kids supposed to know it was real, especially if none of them were given safety training?

And what gun was used? Full sized and heavy, or small and light like a 'toy'?

 

[Sergeant Sabre]

If a kid sees a toy box, wouldn't he/she think all the things in it are toys?

 

[ZeSpectre]

When I was just about 7 years old I asked Dad about his guns. He took me out back, put a pumpkin on a fencepost and shot it from fairly close up with a 1911. The "pumpkin guts" splashed all over including on me and him. It created quite a noise and mess and was really shocking and impressive. (I don't think we were wearing "ears" either at the time but it was a long while ago so I may be misremembering).

He said to me "THIS is a FIREARM and if you don't respect it THAT (pointing to the sludge dripping off my face) is what will happen to whatever it's pointed at. That includes me, your sister, your friends, Lefty (my dog) or anything else. THIS IS NOT A TOY and mistakes and horseplay are NOT ALLOWED!"

Then my first safety lessons with firearms began.

32 years later I can still see that pumpkin exploding and feel the splattered contents hitting me in the face. Nobody tried to "childproof" the farm I grew up on, it would have resulted in a dead child from one hazard or another. Instead my parents "farmproofed' the child and believe me I understood that the hazards existed and how to handle them safely or stay away from them completely!

 

[Thain]

If only there was some kind of association on a national level that knew about rifles, handguns, and other firearms... and wouldn't it be even better if this group put togetehr some sort of special program to teach kids as young as preschool what to do around guns.

If only...

 

[bumm]

This is a test that was set up to achieve the result that the antigunners wanted. They put a bunch of kids in a room together with a box of toys. One of the things in the box is a very real looking gun. It's easy to say that the kids with training would know what to do with the gun, but IT WAS DELIBERATELY PLACED IN A BOX OF TOYS by adults in a police station! Most kids would assume that they're in a safe, controlled, situation. I had a few "real" looking guns when I was a kid. I played with them. The parents with tears in their eyes really added to the desired effect.
Yes, the older kids "should" have known what to do. But this was a VERY contrived situation. Anybody in here or anyplace else who stores his guns in his kids toy box shouldn't have guns.
Marty

 

[The Lone Haranguer]

It's easy to say that the kids with training would know what to do with the gun, but IT WAS DELIBERATELY PLACED IN A BOX OF TOYS by adults in a police station! Most kids would assume that they're in a safe, controlled, situation.

Good observation.

Kids are not going to know these things instinctively. They have to be taught. And it doesn't surprise me that the kids "shooting" each other were the boys. As a youngster in the mid 1960s, I and my friends used to "shoot" and "kill" each other with cap or water guns, whittled pieces of wood, thumbs and forefingers or whatever was to hand (pun intended). My brother's Ruger Super Blackhawk would have been perfect to play "cowboys and Indians" with, or my dad's Enfield bolt-action to play "army men" (not that I could have even held them up anyway), but we knew better than to use real guns for play because we were taught not to.

 

[Prince Yamato]

It's easy to say that the kids with training would know what to do with the gun, but IT WAS DELIBERATELY PLACED IN A BOX OF TOYS by adults in a police station! Most kids would assume that they're in a safe, controlled, situation.

Well, maybe these kids will grow up to not trust authority. After all, it was the authorities who put a REAL gun in their toy box and looked on and did nothing as they pointed the gun at one another.