Kimball .30 Carbine Pistol

[Speedo66]

Saw this on Ebay, an old American Rifleman ad for a .30 Carbine Kimball pistol. The grips are reminiscent of a 1911, the frame vaguely looks like a Luger or Nambu. Coming in 1956, not long after the war, perhaps they thought it would attract vets, especially chambered in the Carbine cartridge. It was also available in .22 Hornet, .38Spl., and .357Mag, all for $215.

I've never heard of this gun before, curious if anybody had any info on it. If it was a well made, well functioning gun at a decent price, you'd think it would have taken off. On the other hand, it may have been none of those things. Seems like a lot of money for the time. Anybody know anything about it?

Here's the ad: http://www.ebay.com/itm/1956-KIMBAL...024483?pt=Vintage_Hunting&hash=item3cdc4c4823

 

[rcmodel]

It was a failure. And so was the Kimball Arms Co.
They were made between 1955 and 1958 with a total production of 238.

Here is some more info on it.

http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2012/06/28/kimball-30-caliber-carbine-auto-pistol/

rc

 

[Jim Watson]

They made a few .22 Hornets, too. Google says 10, of which two are known.

A neat idea, but way too much of a load for a blowback, even with a Mann chamber ring.

 

[gyvel]

A collector colleague of mine in Florida owned a 9mm Kimball as well as a tool room prototype in .22 Hornet. The Hornet prototype was in the white and still had machinist's dye on it. This was back in 1972.

His main interest at the time was collecting 9mm Para. pistols, hence the 9mm Kimball. I believe the Hornet was part of the deal, but did not fit in with his collecting interests.

Sadly, I lost touch with him over the years, and I found out that he has since passed on, so I don't the fate of those two guns.

 

[Jim K]

I didn't know they were made in 9mm; I knew about the .22 Hornet, but the only ones I actually saw were in .30 Carbine. The grooved chamber idea might have worked with 9mm, but the .30 Carbine case is made for rifle pressures, and is too thick and hard to expand much at all. I have no idea why Kimball thought the thing would work, but it didn't. The only thing stopping the bolt from coming back off the frame was a block like the High Standard or Colt Woodsman, and it was not heavy enough. I heard of some in which the blocks broke, but never saw one. The gun, though, is heavier and bigger than a H-S or Colt, though pictures make it look the same size. I ran into Kimball at an NRA convention when he was pushing the gun; he really thought he had the world by the tail. Nope.

The guns are collectors' items today, in any caliber, with one in new shape going over two thousand, easily.

Jim

 

[Edarnold]

The American Rifleman staff published a test and review of the Kimball when it was introduced. Apparently the first sample pistol broke its recoil spring early on; the second sample lasted long enough to be test fired from a Ransom rest, since no-wanted to put their face behind it. The hesitation locking from the chamber ring did work with clean, fresh ammunition well enough to make the functioning reasonable. They then tested it with some ammunition that had corrosion on the case, and functioning became violent. Oiling the corroded cases to try to make them work did not improve the functioning, and eventually the gun jammed. On disassembly they found that one of the lugs retaining the recoil spring had broken, also the slide retaining block was severely peened. That review probably drove the nail in the Kimball's coffin.
This from my memory of the article, which may be off in details, but the magnitude of this Wonder-Gun' failure made a strong impression. "If it seems too good to be True, it probably is"

 

[Jim K]

I seem to recall that in the late 1950's there was a flutter of interest from the Pentagon in a .30 carbine pistol, the idea being commonality of ammunition combined with increased power. There was also civilian interest due to the (then) availability of cheap carbine ammo. Some gun makers, including S&W, even did limited testing and concluded that the idea was a no-go. Ruger, of course, actually produced a fair number of SA revolvers in that caliber. Eventually, the DoD interest proved to be short-lived and everyone gave up; only Ruger and Kimball produced any significant number of handguns in .30 Carbine.

P.S. The pistol under discussion here is the KIMBALL; there is no connection with KIMBER!

Jim

 

[Steel Horse Rider]

In the early 1970's I saw (and almost bought-crap...) a short barreled version of an M1 Carbine that also had a pistol grip. I am sure that today it would be illegal but I have often kicked myself for not grabbing it at the time. Of course I was also a funds limited trade school student working nights and attending school during the day and the $125 dollar price tag would have taken close to a weeks pay.......

 

[rcmodel]

The pistol M-1 was most likely an Iver Johnson Enforcer legally manufactured as a pistol.

http://www.gunauction.com/buy/10397020#

Kimball was never a player in the grand scheme of things, as only 238 were ever made.

Ruger has made thousands of .30 Carbine Blackhawks over the years.
And they still do.

rc

 

[Jim Watson]

S&W made a prototype.30 Carbine DA revolver with clips. The object was to let a paratrooper load his sidearm and M1A1 carbine with the same ammo. It was so loud, the brass gave up on the concept.

 

[rcmodel]

So is the .30 Carbine Blackhawk!

Probably the loudest most unpleasant handgun I have ever fired!
So are hot loaded 32-20 WCF in a revolver.

And I'm not exactly sure why either.
Powder charge weight, and powder burn rate are very similar to other Magnum revolver calibers like the .357.

Pressure of the .30 Carbine is higher, but not That Much higher to make the muzzle blast & concussion so insufferably loud!

rc

 

[Steel Horse Rider]

Thanks RC, that Iver Johnson is definitely what I saw. Maybe I can stumble over one again some day. I also have a Ruger Blackhawk in .30 carbine. It is a little loud but I think it is also pretty accurate and very powerful for a pistol as I have found that it will penetrate much further than either a .45 or a .40 Smith and Wesson round.

 

[Kruff]

I've read about the Kimball having a nasty tendency to put the slide into your forehead. No thanks.

Owned the AMT Automag in 30 carbine for a short time. The thing was a POS.
Factory ammo would eject with the case head bulged badly, almost to the point of blowing out.

 

[deadin]

I always felt the .22 Jet was pretty loud.. (Without much recoil....)

 

[Jim K]

I never heard that any Kimball actually put its slide into anyone's forehead or, for that matter, caused any injury. But the potential was certainly there for problems and I suspect that if more had been sold there could have been serious problems. As it was, the ones made seem to have gone to collectors (I regret not making more of an effort to buy one) and weren't fired very much if at all.

Jim