BFIII12
Member
Do any of you have an opinion on the Kimber Guardian Angel? I thought it would be a nice little back up for when I can't carry my pistol.
Kimber Guardian Angel
- Thread starter BFIII12
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dhoomonyou
Member
is that a spray product?
BFIII12
Member
yeah... A little compact job. I have a buddy that is a LEO and they carry them as a back up along with their OC spray.
)
JJE
Member
I always carry OC, and saw the Guardian used on some TV show (Personal Defense TV?). With a standard OC canister, you can shoot, correct your aim and quickly get on target. With a spray you don't even need to be very precise. The biggest advantage of OC compared to other tools is the ability to impair multiple attackers by sweeping the discharge. The Guardian seems to give up that advantage. You get exactly 2 shots, which don't seem to have much "spread". So potentially, you can impair 2 attackers at most, and if you miss, you're done. Also, I'm not sure what the potency of the Guardian product is. That's a big deal and the reason I carry Fox 5.3.
I guess the advantage of the Guardian is a much reduced danger of self-contamination or of nailing innocent by-standers.
I guess the advantage of the Guardian is a much reduced danger of self-contamination or of nailing innocent by-standers.
Johannes_Paulsen
Member
Bump. Any more thoughts on the Guardian Angel?
Joe Demko
Member
The stuff is coming out of it under enough pressure and in a dense enough spray that I wonder if it would cause soft tissue damage at a range that would be safe with a conventional aerosol. Remember needleless vaccination guns? Picture getting shot in the eyes with one at close range...
Not that I'm against criminals suffering for their attacks on innocent people; I am against getting sued for wrongfully blinding some crackhead.
Not that I'm against criminals suffering for their attacks on innocent people; I am against getting sued for wrongfully blinding some crackhead.
Destroyer911
Member
- Joined
- May 18, 2007
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- 14
JJE,
The Fox Labs spray isnt legal in CA because it lacks the proper specifically worded warning on the canister. The last time I checked, the Fox spray didn't meet this requirement. CA doesnt have restrictions on strength or the type of spray, it does however have to have a warning which states:
"WARNING: The use of this substance
or device for any purpose other than self-defense is a crime under the law. The contents are dangerous--use with care."
It also has to have an expiration date and not more than 2.5 ounces of net weight.
IMHO, the Sabre Red DPS and the Bodyguard Hi-Power are stronger sprays anyways.
The Sabre Red DPS also uses nitrogen, which isnt affected by temperature, and comes out fast, reducing the subjects reaction time. It will also fire if the can is inverted or tilted.
I fired some in my backyard the other day against a wooden panel to test it and got some residual vapor in my eye when i walked over to it. I dropped my OC and covered my eye. I wanted to rub it, but remembered it would make it worse. That was just some residual in the air that did that, i couldnt imagine how it would feel with a direct blast.
Sabre Red DPS http://www.wesfire.com.au/suppliers/pdfs/sabre/2006_sabre_catalog.pdf
Below is the exact requirements for defensive sprays in CA.
12403.7. Notwithstanding any other law, any person may purchase,
possess, or use tear gas and tear gas weapons for the projection or
release of tear gas if the tear gas and tear gas weapons are used
solely for self-defense purposes, subject to the following
requirements:
(a) No person convicted of a felony or any crime involving an
assault under the laws of the United States, the State of California,
or any other state, government, or country or convicted of misuse of
tear gas under subdivision (g) shall purchase, possess, or use tear
gas or tear gas weapons.
(b) No person who is addicted to any narcotic drug shall purchase,
possess, or use tear gas or tear gas weapons.
(c) No person shall sell or furnish any tear gas or tear gas
weapon to a minor.
(d) No person who is a minor shall purchase, possess, or use tear
gas or tear gas weapons.
(e) (1) No person shall purchase, possess, or use any tear gas
weapon that expels a projectile, or that expels the tear gas by any
method other than an aerosol spray, or that contains more than 2.5
ounces net weight of aerosol spray.
(2) Every tear gas container and tear gas weapon that may be
lawfully purchased, possessed, and used pursuant to this section
shall have a label that states: "WARNING: The use of this substance
or device for any purpose other than self-defense is a crime under
the law. The contents are dangerous--use with care."
(3) After January 1, 1984, every tear gas container and tear gas
weapon that may be lawfully purchased, possessed, and used pursuant
to this section shall have a label that discloses the date on which
the useful life of the tear gas weapon expires.
(4) Every tear gas container and tear gas weapon that may be
lawfully purchased pursuant to this section shall be accompanied at
the time of purchase by printed instructions for use.
(f) Effective March 1, 1994, every tear gas container and tear gas
weapon that may be lawfully purchased, possessed, and used pursuant
to this section shall be accompanied by an insert including
directions for use, first aid information, safety and storage
information, and explanation of the legal ramifications of improper
use of the tear gas container or tear gas product.
The Fox Labs spray isnt legal in CA because it lacks the proper specifically worded warning on the canister. The last time I checked, the Fox spray didn't meet this requirement. CA doesnt have restrictions on strength or the type of spray, it does however have to have a warning which states:
"WARNING: The use of this substance
or device for any purpose other than self-defense is a crime under the law. The contents are dangerous--use with care."
It also has to have an expiration date and not more than 2.5 ounces of net weight.
IMHO, the Sabre Red DPS and the Bodyguard Hi-Power are stronger sprays anyways.
The Sabre Red DPS also uses nitrogen, which isnt affected by temperature, and comes out fast, reducing the subjects reaction time. It will also fire if the can is inverted or tilted.
I fired some in my backyard the other day against a wooden panel to test it and got some residual vapor in my eye when i walked over to it. I dropped my OC and covered my eye. I wanted to rub it, but remembered it would make it worse. That was just some residual in the air that did that, i couldnt imagine how it would feel with a direct blast.
Sabre Red DPS http://www.wesfire.com.au/suppliers/pdfs/sabre/2006_sabre_catalog.pdf
Below is the exact requirements for defensive sprays in CA.
12403.7. Notwithstanding any other law, any person may purchase,
possess, or use tear gas and tear gas weapons for the projection or
release of tear gas if the tear gas and tear gas weapons are used
solely for self-defense purposes, subject to the following
requirements:
(a) No person convicted of a felony or any crime involving an
assault under the laws of the United States, the State of California,
or any other state, government, or country or convicted of misuse of
tear gas under subdivision (g) shall purchase, possess, or use tear
gas or tear gas weapons.
(b) No person who is addicted to any narcotic drug shall purchase,
possess, or use tear gas or tear gas weapons.
(c) No person shall sell or furnish any tear gas or tear gas
weapon to a minor.
(d) No person who is a minor shall purchase, possess, or use tear
gas or tear gas weapons.
(e) (1) No person shall purchase, possess, or use any tear gas
weapon that expels a projectile, or that expels the tear gas by any
method other than an aerosol spray, or that contains more than 2.5
ounces net weight of aerosol spray.
(2) Every tear gas container and tear gas weapon that may be
lawfully purchased, possessed, and used pursuant to this section
shall have a label that states: "WARNING: The use of this substance
or device for any purpose other than self-defense is a crime under
the law. The contents are dangerous--use with care."
(3) After January 1, 1984, every tear gas container and tear gas
weapon that may be lawfully purchased, possessed, and used pursuant
to this section shall have a label that discloses the date on which
the useful life of the tear gas weapon expires.
(4) Every tear gas container and tear gas weapon that may be
lawfully purchased pursuant to this section shall be accompanied at
the time of purchase by printed instructions for use.
(f) Effective March 1, 1994, every tear gas container and tear gas
weapon that may be lawfully purchased, possessed, and used pursuant
to this section shall be accompanied by an insert including
directions for use, first aid information, safety and storage
information, and explanation of the legal ramifications of improper
use of the tear gas container or tear gas product.
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