I have been reading alot of post on THR...One post that stuck out was..that by being a handloader that one can custom chamber bullet's to your specific firearm..I understand that accuracy is improved with bullet seating depth..I understand that one rifle aries from another..The question I have is where can someone start on OCL..when you have enought bullet to seat in the case as by caliber/bullet diameter and enough length to touch the lands..What is a safe distance from the lands?{Chamber pressure issues right}..Is there a general rule of thumb of distance from lands for accuracy?...Carl
Lands
- Thread starter Chamacat
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Claude Clay
Member
loading .002 off of the lands is common for accuracy
though this may mean loading one at a time as the OAL may exceed the magazines.
though this may mean loading one at a time as the OAL may exceed the magazines.
ole farmerbuck
Member
I dont know what you're loading but i load my 223 40gr vmax bullets to 2.280 col. Not a whole lot of bullet in the case and plenty of room in the magazines. Sure good for p-dogs.
ReloaderFred
Member
"loading .002 off of the lands is common for accuracy"
I believe you may have meant .020", rather than .002".
Hope this helps.
Fred
I believe you may have meant .020", rather than .002".
Hope this helps.
Fred
To the OP. Since you are new, and you posted primer problems.....
I would heartily suggest that you master basic reloading of rounds before setting off on changing variables. Most ammo will shoot just fine at standard lengths. When you start changing too many variables it makes it hard for a new reloader to trouble shoot.....
I would heartily suggest that you master basic reloading of rounds before setting off on changing variables. Most ammo will shoot just fine at standard lengths. When you start changing too many variables it makes it hard for a new reloader to trouble shoot.....
dagger dog
Member
The big thing to watch out for in seating"to the lands", is not to jam the bullet into the lands causing the pressure wave to spike. Usually the bullet has the small jump that makes the pressure drop before it builds to maximum, the bullet by this time is starting its trip down the barrel, if the required jump is not there the pressure can build too rapidly usually causing an accuracy problem, and if the bullet is jammed to tight into the lands with a near or maximum load it can be dangerous. Especially if the brass has not been checked for maximum trim to length, a combination of too long a case and the bullet jammed into the lands is a recipie for trouble.
thanks for the advice 45acpuser..I certainly understand what your saying..until i get the load right and get the gun shooting safely...I won't change anything and before I do I'll post...I'm not sure how close I might have been with having an incident with the rifle..but with everyones help here..I stopped in time..Thanks...Carl
according to this article the bullets should be jammed half as long as the lands are wide into the lands. It is an excellent article to read. Some day I am going to make the effort to follow the tips in full.
That is how I did my 6PPC rounds in my Bench gun, but there were a lot of other variables to go with that. (Necks turned to the nearest .0001 for tight necked chambers coupled with very light neck tension etc-not very suitable for standard rifles)
For standard stuff in standard rifles I would start at .020 off the lands (if my rifles allowed seating them out that far) and go from there. I would be more inclined to increase the jump than shorten it if .020 did not shoot well.
Folks too often want to take their standard rifle, one part of accuracy loading they read about, and think it will make a magical difference. Well it won't 99% of the time.
I also get tired af reading about "pressure spikes" if one seats bullets into the lands. That depends on many variables. It doesn't suddenly become unsafe if you seat into the lands a hair. It takes more than that.
rcmodel
Member in memoriam
It is interesting to note that factory Match ammo from Black Hills, and other companies will win rifle matches for you in any accurate rifle.
And they are not loaded to the lands.
They are loaded to a industry standard length that will work in any rifle & magazine, with no regard to where the lands are.
rc
And they are not loaded to the lands.
They are loaded to a industry standard length that will work in any rifle & magazine, with no regard to where the lands are.
rc
But that defeats the purpose of reloading.....takes all the fun out of it.......
People need to master the basics first stuff at mag length that shoots well. Then go off to the deep end and change the variables one at a time to see if things improve. What happens is that some reloaders think their stock rifle should shoot like at custom BR or tactical rifle should.
I believe that is exactly what rc was pointing out. You can load extremely accurate ammo jumping to the lands so don't sweat it to start. They can always go off the deep end later, as you posted, once they can load regular ammo well. They might find it shoots so well they won't go experimenting with a lot of stuff. 
Too many folks sweat the small stuff way to much. Yes, guilty, but only in Benchrest. For almost everything else I don't sweat it much. My .222 Mag will shoot bug holes with the bullets making a pretty good jump to the lands. With its throat I could not seat to the lands if I wanted to. No neck turning, no primer pocket prep etc, just good load procedure using quality dies that load straight ammo using bullets my quality barrel/action likes.
Too many folks sweat the small stuff way to much. Yes, guilty, but only in Benchrest. For almost everything else I don't sweat it much. My .222 Mag will shoot bug holes with the bullets making a pretty good jump to the lands. With its throat I could not seat to the lands if I wanted to. No neck turning, no primer pocket prep etc, just good load procedure using quality dies that load straight ammo using bullets my quality barrel/action likes.
rcmodel
Member in memoriam
That is exactly the point I was trying to make.
Too many new reloaders take it as gospel that they have to seat to the lands to load accurate ammo.
When in fact, they have enough other things to learn and master before throwing another very big variable into the mix.
Fact be known, a lot of new rifles come from the factory now with so much lawyer inspired free-bore you couldn't reach the lands if you tried, and still get the ammo in the magazine.
rc
Too many new reloaders take it as gospel that they have to seat to the lands to load accurate ammo.
When in fact, they have enough other things to learn and master before throwing another very big variable into the mix.
Fact be known, a lot of new rifles come from the factory now with so much lawyer inspired free-bore you couldn't reach the lands if you tried, and still get the ammo in the magazine.
rc
When I was still actively shooting Benchrest, I knew very few folks who did not seat "into the lands".
"half as long as the lands are wide into the lands", as posted earlier, was pretty common. Some folks wanted closer to square marks, which is pretty deep, and harder to attain with the light neck pressure almost everyone used.
"half as long as the lands are wide into the lands", as posted earlier, was pretty common. Some folks wanted closer to square marks, which is pretty deep, and harder to attain with the light neck pressure almost everyone used.
A common variance on bearing surfaces of a box of bullets is .002" as measured by a comparator from the base of the bullet to the ogive. Very few bullets will have less than that variance and some will have much more.
Unless you are a very very meticulous reloader and have absolute control over the inside diameter of the necks and the interior finish of the necks, the varying seating pressure will cause differences in the compression on the linkages of your press and cause variances in OAL of +-.004". Through sizing with the Lee Collet which gives the most consistant ID on necks as measured by pin gauges
prepping the interior of the necks down to the shine
coating with mica
and seating with expensive Competition Seaters I have managed to keep the seating of a good box of bullets to +-.002".
If you are attempting to seat .002" from the lands then in all likelihood some of them will be against the lands and some not which is not conducive to accuracy.
IMO .020" off is the correct distance to start or seat into the lands.
Unless you are a very very meticulous reloader and have absolute control over the inside diameter of the necks and the interior finish of the necks, the varying seating pressure will cause differences in the compression on the linkages of your press and cause variances in OAL of +-.004". Through sizing with the Lee Collet which gives the most consistant ID on necks as measured by pin gauges
prepping the interior of the necks down to the shine
coating with mica
and seating with expensive Competition Seaters I have managed to keep the seating of a good box of bullets to +-.002".
If you are attempting to seat .002" from the lands then in all likelihood some of them will be against the lands and some not which is not conducive to accuracy.
IMO .020" off is the correct distance to start or seat into the lands.
ReloaderFred
Member
Excellent post, Woods. And very good photos, too.
Fred
Fred
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