I have a Lee Enfield Number 4 MK 1. It shoots dead accurate, but it shoots about 6 inches high at 60 yards. Is there anyway to raise the front sight, or are there any ways to modify the front to make it higher without hurting the historical value?
lee enfield question
- Thread starter Machete
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rgs1975
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It's called Kentucky Windage. 
jimmyraythomason
Member
"It's called Kentucky Windage." +1
SundownRider
Member
Start reloading and tweaking loads until you find the one that works best in your rifle. Mine did something similar with factory loads until I managed to start working things out myself.
Once I got a load it liked, I was able to hit rams at 600 meters without too much difficulty.
Once I got a load it liked, I was able to hit rams at 600 meters without too much difficulty.
DMK
Member
There's a couple things you can do.
Front sight blades do come in different sizes and they are easy to change. Enfield parts are hard to find, but I bought a bag of them a while back and they were all different (the blade height is marked on them). I just swapped sight blades until I got one that shot to POA.
Switching rear sights may also help. I use a milled adjustable rear sight. It has a setting for 100 yards.
If all else fails, you can buy a spare sight blade and modify it:
http://www.surplusrifle.com/shooting/oddshot9/index.asp
Front sight blades do come in different sizes and they are easy to change. Enfield parts are hard to find, but I bought a bag of them a while back and they were all different (the blade height is marked on them). I just swapped sight blades until I got one that shot to POA.
Switching rear sights may also help. I use a milled adjustable rear sight. It has a setting for 100 yards.
If all else fails, you can buy a spare sight blade and modify it:
http://www.surplusrifle.com/shooting/oddshot9/index.asp
DMK has given the correct solution, you have to find a taller front sight.
My comment is that what you are experiencing is not unusual, rather it seems to be normal pattern. Seldom if ever have I purchased a Mil Surplus that point of aim was point of impact for elevation. And that was with ball ammo, not reloads.
Windage can be adjusted, and changes depending on the person and his hold, but elevation, I just don't understand how the factories consistantly got it wrong.
DMK
Member
I've often wondered that myself. Some rifles are zeroed to very long ranges like MJ mention, but I've had some milsurps that have sight adjustments that go to shorter ranges and they still didn't match the ballistics of the ammo.
I have two theories:
1) Old surplus ammo, or milsurp ammo from different countries may have different ballistics than fresh service ammo. But I find it hard to believe that it would be that far off.
2) Most of the surplus rifles we get were re-arsenalled, meaning they were taken apart, cleaned up, inspected, repaired and re-assembled. When they do this, they are usually not careful that they use all the same parts on the same weapons. Even if the numbers on the gun do still all match, just taking a full wooden stocked military rifle apart and reassembling it can change the zero. Then they store it soaked in cosmoline for a few decades. When we get it, we disassemble the rifle again to clean it up. Often applying heat to the wood to remove cosmoline. The rifle gets reassembled again with different pressures on the barrel.
351 WINCHESTER
Member
Look at the number stamped on top of your front sight. It will be between -.030 to +030. Get a taller sight and that will solve your problem.
DMK
Member
I wasn't even paying attention to the 60 yard thing. I do agree that a 200 yard zero would be much more appropriate for .303 and wouldn't be that far off POA at 50-60 yards.
I got the milled adjustable rear sight and now I adjust it to 100 yards, 200 yards, or whatever range I wish. It's nice to have a milsurp sight that is graduated for yards instead of meters.
RobertFBurnett
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I inherited a No4 Mk1 years ago from my Grandfather, but it has the two peep sight rear. I am looking for one of those adjustable rear sights. Anyone know where to get one? My front sights are not the original battle rifle style with the ears, its been "sporterized."
RFB
RFB
If a rifle shoots 6 inches high at 60 yards, it will be shooting much higher at 100 yards.
My theory is that the factories were shipped rifles if they went bang. I believe that was the incentive system, get the product out the door. (Remember the old General Motors refrain: Manufacturing makes it, Marketing sells it, and Customer Service makes it work?)
If you have the book "British Snipers to the Reich" by C. Shore, there is a telling section about Captain Shore zeroing factory fresh Lee Enfields for his group (I forget if it was a platoon or a company). He ordered new front sights, because the rifles were not shooting to point of aim and was informed that number of sights he requested was in excess needed for a battalion (or division?!) for a year. Request Denied!!
Three out of four Swiss K31's that I have owned shot close enough that I only needed to adjust windage. One required a massively taller front sight. That's the best for my Mil Surplus rifles. Most of my finnish rifles shot close, not one Mauser of any make or vintage, but then, the older Mausers had 600 yard zeros, or something equally fantastic. They all needed taller front sights to shoot to point of aim at 100 yards.
Maybe I am picky, I have taken a file to each and every post on my Match Garands and Match M1a's. I like a 100 yard zero to be under 10 clicks up, and to be more than 5.
"Great then you have a RIFLE that shoots at 60 yards and is usless at any other range. Good idea. Your leading this person down the wrong path. 60 yards? Get a .22"
I wanted to use it to hunt deer, and I hunt in the woods, so I don't really need to shoot too far.
I wanted to use it to hunt deer, and I hunt in the woods, so I don't really need to shoot too far.
Is this what I should get?
http://cgi.ebay.com/Lee-Enfield-4-F...f-Heights_W0QQitemZ280216615587QQcmdZViewItem
http://cgi.ebay.com/Lee-Enfield-4-F...f-Heights_W0QQitemZ280216615587QQcmdZViewItem
Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow
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That'd be "Tennessee Elevation" not Kentucky Windage. But as mentioned, get yourself a replacement higher front sight and you're in bidness.
DMK
Member
Machete, that's what you need right there.
What does your rear sight look like?
I cut a large flat blade screwdriver with a dremel to make mine. It's real easy to do with a cutoff wheel.
That's a real good theory too. Especially in ComBloc countries. Quotas meant life or death during the Stalin years.
Jeff F
Member
The Enfield No4 Mk1 & Mk2 have a 300 yard zero with the battle sight. The milled sight adjustable for elevation has elevations for 200 to 1300 yards and in my experience with surplus ball ammo are pretty much on target with the settings on the sight. I've just learned to shoot mine and just hold a little under to hit at close range.
Sunray
Member
"...front sights are not the original battle rifle style with the ears..." Has the front sight been changed entirely or the 'ears' just removed?
"...this what I should get?..." That'd do nicely, but buying from E-bay financially supports the people who don't think you should be allowed to own any rifle.
Gunparts is listing a milled adjustable rear sight for a No. 4 at $23.65. There's a 'battle sight' on it too.
"...this what I should get?..." That'd do nicely, but buying from E-bay financially supports the people who don't think you should be allowed to own any rifle.
Gunparts is listing a milled adjustable rear sight for a No. 4 at $23.65. There's a 'battle sight' on it too.
gb6491
Member
According to the chart for this Remington load a rifle shooting .1" high at 50 yds. would probably do pretty well for a fixed iron sights, woods gun out to 150 yds. (-2")
http://www.sportsmansguide.com/resource/remington_charts/303bribal.htm
Regards,
Greg
http://www.sportsmansguide.com/resource/remington_charts/303bribal.htm
Regards,
Greg
They didn't get it wrong. It is a battle sight, roughly equivalent to a Maximum Point Blank Range Zero. For target shooting at 100 yards in the US it is fairly pointless, but when there were artillery shells and rifle bullets zipping everywhere a rifleman needed to be able to click off a quick shot with a reasonable chance of hitting a man and it does that with startling efficiency. Why else do you think an M-16 has a 300 yard battle sight?
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