Mike Irwin
Member
Courtland,
That larger 1 1/4" opening MAY accommodate RCBS shotshell dies and bullet swaging dies.
That larger 1 1/4" opening MAY accommodate RCBS shotshell dies and bullet swaging dies.
Lee new cast iron press the Classic
- Thread starter 44and45
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44and45
Member In Memoriam
Mike, all my revolver and pistol bullet swaging dies are 7/8 X 14 regular standard size.
However, never having loaded shotgun hulls so don't know zip about their die size. But stands to reason because of their guage they would require a bigger reloading die than the standard 7/8 X 14.
Are you going to be getting the Lee Classic too.
Jim
However, never having loaded shotgun hulls so don't know zip about their die size. But stands to reason because of their guage they would require a bigger reloading die than the standard 7/8 X 14.
Are you going to be getting the Lee Classic too.
Jim
Mike Irwin
Member
Jim,
Nope, I bought a Lyman Turret press and I have a Rock Chucker.
Nope, I bought a Lyman Turret press and I have a Rock Chucker.
Ross
Member
If the RCBS pocket swage stripper does not fit over the 1¼" ram, it should be easy to fashion an adaptor from washers and/or a piece of water pipe.
Lee will be making dies for the .577-.450 and the .577 Snider this year, I believe. Perhaps they will be proprietery to Mom's Old Guns in Colorado, as is a series of custom bullet moulds.
My RCBS .577-.450 dies are 1" IIRC. I do not know the 12 ga die size.
Cheers from Darkest California,
Ross
Lee will be making dies for the .577-.450 and the .577 Snider this year, I believe. Perhaps they will be proprietery to Mom's Old Guns in Colorado, as is a series of custom bullet moulds.
My RCBS .577-.450 dies are 1" IIRC. I do not know the 12 ga die size.
Cheers from Darkest California,
Ross
44and45
Member In Memoriam
Hello Ross, hope all is well with you.
I will have my Classic in about a week or so, I have the RCBS primer pocket swager accessories and can evaluate what it will take to fit the primer pocket swage to the unit.
It may require a metal cap that is recessed by boring out a short piece of rod to fit it. I've got a mini-lathe that might be able to handle it. More later.
Man, those old Snider's and Martini's cost a forturne, can one still get ammo or make it for them.
Jim
I will have my Classic in about a week or so, I have the RCBS primer pocket swager accessories and can evaluate what it will take to fit the primer pocket swage to the unit.
It may require a metal cap that is recessed by boring out a short piece of rod to fit it. I've got a mini-lathe that might be able to handle it. More later.
Man, those old Snider's and Martini's cost a forturne, can one still get ammo or make it for them.
Jim
Ross
Member
Jim,
Howdy and fine thank you.
My RCBS A press has 1-5/8x 7 double-start threads bushed down. (and ½" pins all around). Heads up when measuring those double start threads: the 7 tpi matches up with the 14 tpi screw pitch template.
My .577 RCBS dies are 1"-14 tpi.
Herter presses may be 1¼-18, but I am not sure. At least some 12 ga dies are 1¼-18.
The big cases do require larger dies. They tend to crack as they are too thin at the base of the case. The 24 ga, Sniders and Martini Henrys are .672" at the base. Subtract thread depth from .875" and you are skating on thin ice.
I expect that the little chill up there encourages indoor projects. That mini lathe can be a great comfort as long as Miss Milly Watt arrives regularly. Around here weather like that would have the power out for weeks.
Regards from Darkest California,
Ross
Howdy and fine thank you.
My RCBS A press has 1-5/8x 7 double-start threads bushed down. (and ½" pins all around). Heads up when measuring those double start threads: the 7 tpi matches up with the 14 tpi screw pitch template.
My .577 RCBS dies are 1"-14 tpi.
Herter presses may be 1¼-18, but I am not sure. At least some 12 ga dies are 1¼-18.
The big cases do require larger dies. They tend to crack as they are too thin at the base of the case. The 24 ga, Sniders and Martini Henrys are .672" at the base. Subtract thread depth from .875" and you are skating on thin ice.
I expect that the little chill up there encourages indoor projects. That mini lathe can be a great comfort as long as Miss Milly Watt arrives regularly. Around here weather like that would have the power out for weeks.
Regards from Darkest California,
Ross
44and45
Member In Memoriam
Yep, the Herter's 1 1/4 X 18 tpi as confirmed in the old Herter's 1975 catalog I have. My Herter's Super 3 press has a 7/8 X 14 adapter in the presses frame with 1 1/4 X18 threads. Ticks me off because I can't use the Hornady lock-n-load quick change inserts into it...I'd have to retap the frame and that's not practical...the new Lee Classic will fill the bill on that score.
It was only 8 below when I got up today, if you want to get warm hop into the refrigerator for awhile its warmer there.
Power status has been pretty good here last few years, but all it takes some tree limbs to get iced up break off and fall on the above ground power lines that are strung between telephone poles here in our woodied area...I live in the boonies.
We have a backup wood stove in the living room and a garage full of hard wood just in case.
Whats the story on the Snider rifles and the odd size big brass to load them.
Jim
It was only 8 below when I got up today, if you want to get warm hop into the refrigerator for awhile its warmer there.
Power status has been pretty good here last few years, but all it takes some tree limbs to get iced up break off and fall on the above ground power lines that are strung between telephone poles here in our woodied area...I live in the boonies.
We have a backup wood stove in the living room and a garage full of hard wood just in case.
Whats the story on the Snider rifles and the odd size big brass to load them.
Jim
Ross
Member
Jim,
I started a new topic (.577 ...........) so the archivests are not left out on a limb.
Cheers,
Ross
I started a new topic (.577 ...........) so the archivests are not left out on a limb.
Cheers,
Ross
PaulS
Member
If you truly want this strong a press then get a bullet swedging press and the adapter for the dies for handloading. These presses are designed for the pressures involved in swedging bullets and are fitted with large pivot pins, needle bearings and steel parts that will last 20 years with few replacements.
I have used a Rock-chucker press to swedge lead bullets and had to replace pins and finally made new pieces like the transfer toggles to accomodate needle bearings and pins. I had to make bushings for the ram and replaced bent handles etc.... The large premium presses are fine for reloading and case forming but not for swaging bullets over the long term.
PaulS
44and45
Member In Memoriam
Hello PaulS, welcome to the discussion on swaging presses.
I was hoping the new RCBS Rockchucker with its big half inch ram pin would be able to survive the psi of bullet swaging. The only thing I didn't think much of is the industry using those 1 inch diameter rams. A good press like the Dillon 550B has a 1 1/2 inch diameter ram and it goes up into the dies on four stations at a time...which is really smooth and positive.
I own a real old timer, a Herter's Super O Maximum with a 1 1/2 inch in diameter ram, and all the pins are 1/2 inch round. This press is near 50 years old and shows no sign of fading away from too much swaging.
You must be one good machinest to do the things you did to the Rockchucker, wish I had your skills.
But when the new Lee Classic shows up maybe friday I'll give it a good wringing out and will know if it can cut the mustard or not. All pins or 1/2 inch or better and the ram is 1 1/4 in diameter with 12 inch overall bearing surface. Too bad they didn't opt for a 1 1/2 ram but you can't always have all your way.
I still think its possible to build and sell an ordinary reloading press that can swage bullets and not fail after a few hundred get run through it.
Herter did it when they built the Super O Maximum.
Jim
I was hoping the new RCBS Rockchucker with its big half inch ram pin would be able to survive the psi of bullet swaging. The only thing I didn't think much of is the industry using those 1 inch diameter rams. A good press like the Dillon 550B has a 1 1/2 inch diameter ram and it goes up into the dies on four stations at a time...which is really smooth and positive.
I own a real old timer, a Herter's Super O Maximum with a 1 1/2 inch in diameter ram, and all the pins are 1/2 inch round. This press is near 50 years old and shows no sign of fading away from too much swaging.
You must be one good machinest to do the things you did to the Rockchucker, wish I had your skills.
But when the new Lee Classic shows up maybe friday I'll give it a good wringing out and will know if it can cut the mustard or not. All pins or 1/2 inch or better and the ram is 1 1/4 in diameter with 12 inch overall bearing surface. Too bad they didn't opt for a 1 1/2 ram but you can't always have all your way.
I still think its possible to build and sell an ordinary reloading press that can swage bullets and not fail after a few hundred get run through it.
Herter did it when they built the Super O Maximum.
Jim
Butch
Member
Hey fellers the Classic is at an even better price now check out this link.
http://www.midwayusa.com/rewriteaproduct/317831
http://www.midwayusa.com/rewriteaproduct/317831
44and45
Member In Memoriam
Yeah, I got it at that price. Ordered it monday and it shipped out per UPS tracking at 10:00 PM tuesday...got here UPS ground thursday at around 1:00 PM.
It is a super great press but will have to make a slight modification on the middle linkage panel bolt...it needs to go forward about an inch to shorten the ram's stroke for me...this is only to aid in my bullet swaging operation.
Would give me a bit more lee way in screwing the swaging die down into the press frame more. As it is, the swaging die is setting too high in my frame and the full stroke position will not quite bottom out properly.
I think its an easy fix, Lee never thought about us guys who like to swage our bullets. Maybe they'll make some extra holes on the linkage side panels in future models...or on request.
Jim
It is a super great press but will have to make a slight modification on the middle linkage panel bolt...it needs to go forward about an inch to shorten the ram's stroke for me...this is only to aid in my bullet swaging operation.
Would give me a bit more lee way in screwing the swaging die down into the press frame more. As it is, the swaging die is setting too high in my frame and the full stroke position will not quite bottom out properly.
I think its an easy fix, Lee never thought about us guys who like to swage our bullets. Maybe they'll make some extra holes on the linkage side panels in future models...or on request.
Jim
Ross
Member
Jim,
An inch? What would the stroke come to then?
Those side bars look like the job would be easy. I wonder if Lee would suppiy undrilled radius links. In any event, it appears that they are just bar stock.
Do you know that the early RCBS A press had an eccentric pivot so that the user could shorten the stroke for swaging, ... the Rock Chuck Bullet Swage.
It will be instructive to see the lever ratios here. The old A press only cammed the wrist pin about a quarter of an inch.
Cheers from Darkest California,
Ross
An inch? What would the stroke come to then?
Those side bars look like the job would be easy. I wonder if Lee would suppiy undrilled radius links. In any event, it appears that they are just bar stock.
Do you know that the early RCBS A press had an eccentric pivot so that the user could shorten the stroke for swaging, ... the Rock Chuck Bullet Swage.
It will be instructive to see the lever ratios here. The old A press only cammed the wrist pin about a quarter of an inch.
Cheers from Darkest California,
Ross
44and45
Member In Memoriam
Ross, I got this idea of shortening the middle pin that will effect the ram stroke from my Herter's Super O Maximum press...it has this provision in its engineering design. Ole Geo. Herter was one smart gent about 50 years ago.
Using the same measurements of about one inch should do the trick.
If Lee don't come through, I will do the job myself. But I am trying to help future bullet swagers have a good press to perform that function. The Lee Classic can do it with this modification.
Jim
Using the same measurements of about one inch should do the trick.
If Lee don't come through, I will do the job myself. But I am trying to help future bullet swagers have a good press to perform that function. The Lee Classic can do it with this modification.
Jim
shooter1
Member
A friend of mine just got his. The thing is built like a tank. One thing I haven't heard anyone mention is the threaded die bushing. By removing the bushing/adapter, the press will accept the larger thread dies required to load the 50 BMG rounds. I've had a RCBS RC for 30yrs. If I were buying a new single stage press today, I'd probably buy the Lee!
Will
Will
Cortland
Member
The opening of the Classic Cast is (on the generous side) 4.5", and the nominal length of a .50 BMG is 5.45", so I don't think the 1 1/4" die opening helps you there. As others have already explained, though, there are other uses besides the LNL bushing (.50 AE, .577 Snider, .577/450 Martini-Henry, probably some of the larger Nitro Expresses, shotshells, etc).
shooter1
Member
Cortland,
Oppppps, that's what I get for making unenlightened assumptions! My error. I failed to verify dimensions, and therefore gave out erroneous information. Sorry. Thank you for filling me in.
Thanks,
Will
Oppppps, that's what I get for making unenlightened assumptions! My error. I failed to verify dimensions, and therefore gave out erroneous information. Sorry. Thank you for filling me in.
Thanks,
Will
44and45
Member In Memoriam
Hornady list the .50 MG caliber dies as 1 1/2 inch but don't mention any tpi thread size.
Jim
Jim
Ross
Member
RCBS lists the .50 BMG as 1½"-12tpi.
Ross
Ross
Cortland
Member
Swaging is using the pressure of a press and a die to "squeeze" lead into the shape of the bullet (or a bullet core, followed by a jacket). Contrast with casting, which is of course forming bullets through the pouring of molten lead.
44and45
Member In Memoriam
Cortland is correct, except I swage lead bullets under pressure to merely reshape them by using a special swaging die and nose punch in the shellholder.
I don't use copper jackets though you could. But I sometimes use gaschecks.
I am capable of hollow pointing and hollow basing a lead bulle while forming its shape in my swaging die and using a nose punch to determine the bullets nose shape.
Wish I could recomend some books on the subject, but not many people are into it today as they don't have the time or inclination to do bullet swaging. Its easier for them to just go out and buy a commercial product.
But I'm retired and reloading is my hobby, so I do it.
Jim
I don't use copper jackets though you could. But I sometimes use gaschecks.
I am capable of hollow pointing and hollow basing a lead bulle while forming its shape in my swaging die and using a nose punch to determine the bullets nose shape.
Wish I could recomend some books on the subject, but not many people are into it today as they don't have the time or inclination to do bullet swaging. Its easier for them to just go out and buy a commercial product.
But I'm retired and reloading is my hobby, so I do it.
Jim
44and45
Member In Memoriam
This in my Lee Classic press mounted on my desk, the swaging die in the frame is the Lee 25-35 seating die converted to bored out swaging die of .430 diameter.
Note the clear plastic bottle behind the press contains Berry's 158 grain RN plated bullets. These have been swaged into 158 grain .44 caliber bullets in SWC form because of the nose punch in ram.
The one bullet is the Berry and the other is a 158 grain RN Meister hardcast bullet with HP. HP added by inserting into another swaging die.
Process known as bumping up...
Jim
Note the clear plastic bottle behind the press contains Berry's 158 grain RN plated bullets. These have been swaged into 158 grain .44 caliber bullets in SWC form because of the nose punch in ram.
The one bullet is the Berry and the other is a 158 grain RN Meister hardcast bullet with HP. HP added by inserting into another swaging die.
Process known as bumping up...
Jim
Attachments
M2HMGHB
Member
Where do you go to get the swagging dies? And is there a special kind of lead you have to use? And how do you form bullet jackets? Just a curious reloader, thanks for any responses.
Scott
Scott
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