Leftists and thinking......A column

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hillbilly

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It is my opinion that many many Leftists (from moderate Democrats to radical Greens) do not think at all, but merely operate straight from the medulla oblongata.

Didn't Sir Winston Churchill say something about the political leanings of men younger than 30 and men older than 30?

And this propensity to emote and feel rather than to think results in all sorts of bad Leftist polices and positions......

Like the well-hashed Leftist stances on gun controls, for example.

But I found the following column and analysis rather interesting.


http://www.cjonline.com/stories/120803/opi_will.shtml


By George Will
Washington Post Writers Group

WASHINGTON -- Howard Dean is no fool. He is, however, not much of a thinker.
His talk flows as rapidly as a mountain brook, but is no deeper than one of
those.

He is the candidate of America's professorate and others whose strongest
passion is as much aesthetic as political -- intellectual contempt for
George W. Bush. But Dean's bantam-rooster pugnacity is not unlike Bush's
shoulders-squared jauntiness that critics consider an enraging swagger.
Bush's imperturbable certitude infuriates Dean's supporters because they
believe it arises not from reflection but from reflex. Actually, Dean really
resembles his supporters' idea of Bush.

Appearing on "Hardball" with the human Gatling gun, Chris Matthews, Dean
said that in terms of legal rights there is no practical difference between
same-sex civil unions and marriages. Matthews: "So why are we quibbling over
a name?" Dean: "Because marriage is very important to a lot of people who
are pretty religious."

So, the argument about the public meaning of marriage is merely a semantic
quibble important only to the "pretty religious"? Dean has said of his faith
that "I don't think it informs my politics," and that he became a
Congregationalist "because I had a big fight with a local Episcopal church
about 25 years ago over a bike path." Fine. His faith, whatever it is, is
his business and no disqualification for the presidency. But his
qualifications supposedly include a searching intellect. Where is the
evidence?

Asked by Matthews whether he supports state right-to-work laws protecting
the right of workers not to join a union, Dean said no. But he also said "I
very much believe that states ought to have the right to recognize -- to
organize their own laws. So I'm not likely as president ... to order states
to change them."'

Order states? Imagine the media derision if Bush ever suggested such an
understanding of federalism.

In his next breath, Dean said that if Congress sends to his presidential
desk legislation denying states that right that he "very much" believes they
ought to have -- the right to have right-to-work laws -- "I'd sign it in an
instant." This is the intellectuals' candidate?

If Osama bin Laden is captured, Dean says "it doesn't make a lot of
difference" whether he is tried in America or the International Criminal
Court. After all, "we are allowing the Bosnian war criminals to be tried" in
the Hague. Question: Is it relevant that the Bosnians' crimes were not
committed in America?

Dean promises "to break up giant media enterprises" -- General Electric,
News Corporation, etc. -- because there is "information control" that "is
not compatible with democracy." Question: Given the Internet and other new
media, and the consequently declining importance of broadcast networks and
other traditional filters of information, has there ever been less reason to
use "information control" as an excuse for expanding government regulation
of information media?

Asked to name his favorite philosopher, Dean named Lao-Tse because "my
favorite saying is, 'The longest journey begins with a single step."' That
might make a better bumper sticker than anything David Hume said, but if
that measures the depths of Dean, he and his supporters should take a
sabbatical from deriding Bush's supposed shallowness.

America needs what Dean seems intellectually and temperamentally
ill-equipped to provide -- truly thoughtful opposition in an election that
should turn on two huge issues. One is: How do we guarantee economic growth
sufficient to generate tax revenues to finance a welfare state whose
entitlement menu is being substantially expanded just as 77 million baby
boomers are about to retire? The second is: Can America's security be
attained without adopting foreign policy goals of unattainable grandiosity
-- nation-building, regional transformations?

Dean has provided no reason to expect from him especially elevated reasoning
about these things. He seems to be an Everett Wharton. "The Prime Minister,"
one of Anthony Trollope's parliamentary novels, introduces Wharton, who was,
Trollope wrote, "no fool":

"(He) had read much, and although he generally forgot what he read, there
were left with him from his reading certain nebulous lights, begotten by
other men's thinking, which enabled him to talk on most subjects. It cannot
be said of him that he did much thinking for himself -- but he thought that
he thought."

Dean seems like that, which is not surprising or disqualifying: Most
political leaders are not people of reflection, but of ambition-dictated
action, living off borrowed intellectual capital. Given the accumulating
evidence, the professors' pin-up should dismount his intellectual high
horse.
 
So George Will doesn't think Dean is very smart.

Big suprise.

I wonder who would 'win' an actual debate - Bush or Dean...

db
 
If by "win" you mean which one would have the majority of debate watchers in his corner, I think it's Bush all the way.

Dean comes off as a shrill, angry, elite Northeastern liberal.

That may sell in Massachusetts and Connecticut and Vermont, but it doesn't sell well in Dixie, I can tell you that.

Lots of right-wingers don't think, either.

But at least for right-wingers, there is not an intellectual core that has bought into all sorts of post-modern philosophies and ideas which actually prohibit thinking.

For many so-called "leftist intellectuals" rational thought itself is nothing more than an Western European white male construct designed to oppress women, gays, and minorities.

If you don't believe me, read some Foucault, Derrida, Baudrillard, and all the other Froggie Post-Moderns which are the "intellectual canon" for leftists thinkers.

hillbilly
 
Here are some links about Post-Modern lefties and their experiences with "thinking."

In a nutshell, a physics prof got tired of Post-modernist lefties trying to analyze science and scientific texts.

So, the Prof submitted a completely bogus, false, insane paper about physics to the most high profile leftist, post-modern journal and VOILA!

Eet got publeeshed!!!!!!!!!!

And it was published to ravew reviews in the leftist, academic universe.

And then, the professor "came out" and revealed the whole thing as a big hoax.

Here's some links to check out.

http://www.world-of-dawkins.com/Dawkins/Work/Reviews/1998-07-09postmodernism_disrobed.htm

And

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0801857074/ref=qid_900824542/102-0248547-9369717

And

the hoaxing prof himself.

http://www.physics.nyu.edu/faculty/sokal/index.html
 
Well, the leadership is in it for power and they see the useful idiots, er voters, as a means to an end. Some of the limo libs are working out their guilt complexes, also.

The voters who vote for the idjits, er candidates, often seem to have a vague feeling, maybe paranoia that somebody is getting something better than they have, whatever it is. They expect the gomt to equalize the playing field and hold back those evil entrepreneurs and capitalists.
 
The problem facing "leftist intellectuals" is a severe lack of common sense. They define things in terms of their world, instead of the real one. In their world, government can do everything for them.
Gov't can keep guns out of the criminals hands, therefore eliminating the need for private citizens to have guns.
Gov't can redistribute our money, so that everyone can live the life they want.
Gov't can make the air and water perfectly clean, as well as keep every single cute and cuddly animal safe from danger.
In a leftist world, nothing could possibly go wrong as long as government is there to hold our hands.
Libs are incapable of believing that we "idiot voters" are able to think for ourselves.
 
hmmm

you could replace Bush for Dean in the article and have it ring true. I watched one of the "debates" cause it was in Boston (if you can call trying to get 8 people to give a 20 second sound bite answer a debate is debatable) and Dean didn't come off shrill or angry to me at all. Maybe I'm just not as sensitive as the Dixie voters or I'm just not following the herds talking points.


I thought Kerry would get the nod. He still may, the voters have not spoken yet and stranger things have happened, look at Clinton's come from behind win in 89 and Bush's usurping McCain. Kerry at least has the best grasp of the issues, has verified combat kills, one even in the bush not from his boat and could carry a lot of votes from vets. Kerry would also torch W in a debate.

He tried to buck the trend and reclaimed the gun control mantle though, big mistake.
 
Kerry also turned into a quite disrespectful war protester and tossed his decorations in protest. Protest all you want, but men died to earn those same decorations. That sort of thing doesn't sit well at all with me, as a veteran. Kerry has about as much chance of carrying the Veteran vote as Hillary.
 
I'll go out on a really big limb here and predict that there will not be a real debate between Bush and whoever wins the Democratic nomination.

The only time we'll be able to observe the two of them in the same room together will be under very tightly controlled circumstances - question submitted in advance, programmed answers, etc.

I'd personally love to see Bush debate anybody, subject to customary debating rules.

We read so much (here) about how librals can't think or reason or apply logic.

I wonder whether their poster boy can even get an unscripted sentence out... (actually, I don't wonder).

db
 
That Sokal stuff is too funny, hillbilly! I can't believe I've never even heard of it. Awesome. :)

- Gabe
 
We (empirical, not me:neener:) get what we ask for. There are political machines out there that really fade under tests. Gray Davis was a political machine all his life with no real world experience. Every minute of every day was spent raising money and reading polls. Klinton was the same, as are many pols. They exist to perform, to tell us what we want to hear. Gray Davis' recent failures were monumnetal because he was afraid to lead: budget, electricity, illegal immigrants, etc... Anything to curry political favor from select groups.

Look at the primary example on display now. Kerry, Dean, Gephardt, Clark, et al are completely intellectually dishonest. There positions change with the wind and they double back on their former position, with a sprinkling of stories of grandma and military services, and I meant that that Iraq vote meant force, but only with the UN, or the marriage issue mentioned above, ad nauseum. Always pandering, choking, changing to meet the current group or poll. Dean is a talker with few core beliefs, although his competion have no core beliefs (except Lieberman, who, much to his detriment, at least tries to be intellectually honest :eek:). Well, Kucinish also has core beliefs and is honest about them, but they are so far outside of sigma that he can not be judged fairly.

GWB is also a political machine. He, too, has been groomed. And is in a political family. But I think people sense that he is just a little more genuine and a little more straightforward about any issue. He also does not seem to dilute his core convictions (although I am steamed about the expansion of medicare and his "support" of the AWB :fire: ).

The "sit-com" mentality rules these days. Encapsulate the issue in a commercial, or conquer a country in 30 minutes. That is the extent of our attention span. We also like happy endings, such as we all get cradle to grave care for FREE! :mad:

We need a new crop of citizens/politicians
 
You know, I hear Kerry wants to change the paradigm in Washington. :) Change the paradoigm.

- Gabe
 
Kerry would also torch W in a debate.

On debating point perhaps. Just as Nixon "won" and Dukakis "won" thier respective debates.

Bush would easily "win" on viewer (voter) perceptions of strong character and friendliness, areas in which Kerry has not managed to impress many to date.

For example, Kerry's "crying" in one debate was seen by many as creepy and false.

For example, Kerry's inability to find the sidestand (a.k.a. kickstand) on the Harley he rode onto Lenno's Tonight Show set was noted and laughed about by everyone I know who owns a motorcycle.
 
here here 7.62! I couldn't agree more!




(with the small execption that Bush is just as a big a phony)



CHL- no perhaps about it, let's be honest. Even Sharpton would destroy W LOL!

Voter perception is a tricky thing, no doubt that Bush's perception management team would attempt to claim victory of friendliness and character, they strategy of making W look like a guy you'd have a beer with (if he wasn't in recovery) was quite fruitful and the press played it up beautifully.

But they definately don't want Bush on a stage next to Kerry who will tower over him and make him look like a fem. Droopy eyes and helemt hair aside.
 
Jonesy9,

That is why we call it The High Road. We can find common ground if we look. We agree that the political environment is a disaster. But, I believe we differ on ideology:D I will take the common ground and rejoice;)
 
George Will has some serious disconnect from reality.

"Howard Dean is … not much of a thinker."
"He is the candidate of America's professorate"

So, Will thinks that American professors are not "thinkers"? I have no clue how folks can think that both of Will's contradictory beliefs can be true at the same time.
 
Eet got publeeshed!!!!!!!!!!

You understate the case.

Not only did this "scientific peer-reviewed" journal publish the scientific gibberish/parody, but (as admitted by the publishers in a response to the hoax) it was made the centerpiece of a special expanded single-topic edition! Even moreso, they claim to have had their doubts and hesitations about the viability of the article...and in the next paragraph describe how they made it a cornerstone of the highlight issue of the year!
 
The Foolish man's thinker... Don't like it.

how bout: The thinking man's fool?

Yeah, that's it.

db
 
George Will isn't the only one that buys the rah-rah drivel that them-uns on the other side aren't thinking, because, obviously, anyone who thinks would naturally agree with US, the good guys, upholders of all that is right and decent. People like that must have very weak intellectual foundations for their beliefs, to be so threatened by the fact that anyone might actually THINK differently than them. It certainly doesn't speak well to their powers of thought.
 
For an interesting read, try Paul Johnson's "Intellectuals" (see here for more information). It's written from a conservative standpoint, and has some flaws, but overall is a very interesting look at the problems caused when intellectuals try to give advice or shape societies - without the practical knowledge and experience to implement these theories.
 
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