Looking for a cheap O/U 12g

[Voland]

I want to get a good O/U 12 gauge shotgun but I dont really know much about them. I was thinking of picking up a cheap one to play with and figure out what I like vs not like...

So two questions:

1) whats the cheapest 12g o/u you would get?
2) does my plan make sense? should I just spend the money on one good one and be done with it?

Thanks!
V.

p.s. this would be my first shotgun...

 

[ArmedBear]

What do you want it for?

The ONLY cheap 12 Gauge O/U I would get would be one of the Lanbers from CDNN (as low as $500, for a gun that would be a good deal for a lot more).

Otherwise, I would say look around for a B-gun, Winchester or SKB used or on sale. CDNN has some interesting options there, too. I'd avoid 26" 12 Gauges, though, unless you have a specific purpose in mind.

Gun fit matters a lot, though. Have you shot any similar guns? Do you know what you like?

 

[UKShooter]

I'd say it will save you money in the long run to try a few out if possible then just buy one you are happy with rather than buy a cheap one then buy a decent one afterwards.

Do any of your friends have O/U's you can try out? Or maybe a local clay shoot / skeet range have some you can rent out to try.

 

[chas08]

+1 on the Lanber. They are a lot of gun for the money. I've owned one for the better part of 10 years. It's been completely trouble free.

 

[natman]

I want to get a good O/U 12 gauge shotgun but I dont really know much about them. I was thinking of picking up a cheap one to play with and figure out what I like vs not like...

So two questions:

1) whats the cheapest 12g o/u you would get?
2) does my plan make sense? should I just spend the money on one good one and be done with it?

1) The cheapest regularly priced O/U I would even consider would be the Turkish Huglu shotguns marketed by CZ. Don't waste your money on Stoegers, Mossberg Silver Reserves or Baikals. There are sometimes bargains to be had at CDNN.

It is expensive to build a double gun and in order to build a cheap one quality has to suffer, sometimes a lot. If you can't afford a good O/U you would be far better off to buy a good pump instead.

2) I'd recommend either a good pump shotgun or if you must have an O/U, then get a Franchi Renaissance, Beretta or Browning instead of wasting $500 on a cheap O/U.

 

[rustcat]

Yildiz o/u $450 plus tax in the academy paper

 

[oneounceload]

I would take a nicely used Beretta semi over any of the cheap Russian/Turkish/Chinese O/U's. I would look at a 50 year old AyA Spanish gun that sold through Sears as well, but the semi would be the best bet as it will hold its value over a few years should you decide to move to to something else.

If it HAS to be an O/U or nothing, the advice about a used Beretta or Browning or SKB is sound

 

[Voland]

Really I dont have anything specific in mind... I will most likely be shooting clays at the range and eventually, I MIGHT find some one to take me hunting...

I did shoot a browning that a friend has and it was a lot of fun. I guess I can always pick up a semi for now... It will do what I want and I can always use it for HD later...

Thanks all for the advice!

V.

 

[ArmedBear]

CDNN is down to $470 for the basic 28" Lanber. I'm having to hold myself back from buying one just for the hell of it -- you can't ordinarily find a new O/U that's worth buying, for that little coin.

 

[chas08]

CDNN is down to $470 for the basic 28" Lanber. I'm having to hold myself back from buying one just for the hell of it

That is a great price. I paid $450'ish for mine back then. I wouldn't mind another one in the safe either. But with all the others I have to play with I just can't justify it. What made the bottom fall out of the prices? They were up to around $800 a couple of years ago.

 

[ArmedBear]

Lanber got a new US distributor. I believe CDNN got the old distributor's remaining inventory. The $470 guns are "blems".

The new US distributor's site: http://www.lanberusa.com/

Lanber has some new products out, including a lightweight 12, the 2077 Grey Stone Light. I'm not sure what it costs, but Field and Stream did a lengthy review (actually took it on a pheasant hunting trip and passed it around). It was VERY positive. I'm definitely interested; I like Beretta's 687 Ultralights, but I'm not excited about paying $2000-2500 for a gun with such a narrow purpose, even after I've taken the time to build up my shotgun fund again. The Lanber 2077 seems like a more rational alternative.

 

[Davandron]

Voland: I did what you are talking about and own a Baikal / Spartan; it's a solid little trooper. I've decided I do like O/U shotguns so I'm now saving & shopping for a B gun, and will probably sell the Baikal.

I would encourage you to get a used gun (cheap or expensive) because you can most likely sell it for a price close to what you paid if you decide you don't like it or want to upgrade. And if you decide to keep it you're not out as much money as a new gun would cost you.

BTW 12ga O/U has a lot of kick. If you want it for clays (vs hunting), you may be better served by a 20ga, because you can feed cheap shells and not get recoil.

 

[oneounceload]

BTW 12ga O/U has a lot of kick. If you want it for clays (vs hunting), you may be better served by a 20ga, because you can feed cheap shells and not get recoil

Not quite true, and it depends on what ammo you are shooting and whether or not your gun fits. If you're shooting hot loads that move fast, stop doing that for targets. If your guns doesn't fit, it WILL beat your shoulder and cheek. A gun that fits and shoots light target ammo, (NOT the wally world cheapos) will be a joy to shoot all day

 

[ricklin]

Wally world bulk

The Mao-Mart bargain 100 packs are no bargain for your shoulder.

I load 1 1/8th at 1100 FPS using Green dot. They work great, and are easy on the shoulder.

I may cut em back to 1 oz. and see how I do, easier yet on the shoulder. And a little easier on the pocketbook as well.

 

[oneounceload]

ricklin - one oz will feel great, but 7/8 will feel almost like shooting a .22, especially at 1100fps

 

[Armored farmer]

You can't go wrong with quality Browning or Beretta.

I have a Mossberg Silver Reserve in 28 ga that I bought used for $400 to hunt/ sporting clays with. It fits and shoots great and has been 100% reliable for maybe 1500 rounds. I have heard several negative reports of problems with them...but mine has been a joy.

For clay games, 12 ga is king.
can be loaded down enough for grandma to shoot a hundred rounds

 

[Davandron]

Not quite true.... A gun that fits and shoots light target ammo, (NOT the wally world cheapos) will be a joy to shoot all day

:^)

As I wrote my original reply I thought, "you know, someone is going to say just shoot lighter loads" and you are absolutely correct.

When I started, I was buying Winchester 7/8oz (26gram) Low Recoil, but those are at least 40% more expensive than promo shells. So I bought a reloading press (not a cheap solution by the way) because I knew I was going to be shooting for a long time and could earn my investment back. Later I realized that 20ga promo shells were 7/8 and already low recoil.

So that brings me back to my original recommendation. A low cost 20ga O/U can shoot low cost shells all day long with a new shooter and will be fine for most clay games. If you occasionally need extra lead in the air, buy some full price 1oz or 1.25oz loads.

 

[oneounceload]

The advantage with the 12 is the variety of readily available ammo from a multitude of suppliers. 20 gauge target loads tend to be the same - 7/8 ounce, while 12's can run the gamut from 7/8 to 1-1/8 (talking about target loads) making the choices easier for the different games out there

Not saying a 20 won't do the trick - I shoot a lot of 20 for sporting with no handicap except my own lack of ability; but for a new person, a 12, IMO, would still be the best bet for starting out

 

[Davandron]

True, finding a variety of loads for 12 gauge might be easier at your average store, but there are a wide variety of loads available online. I've seen a lot of 1oz #8 & #9 loads ... which is enough for skeet and 5 stand (I've never shot trap so I don't want to say what works there).

Most all the 12ga shooters in my league shoot 7/8 to 1oz loads. A number of them shoot 20ga as well.

Hey we could just give the standard answer; buy one of each!

 

[Black Dime]

Davandron,
are the guys using tubes or 20 gauge shotguns? The 20 o/u or sxs is a hurter. The lighter 20 will put more "felt recoil" than the heavier 12. You probably know that a dedicated clay guy wants around 8#s.

And about the SKBs. Might be a Bgun but but my SKB combo cost a bit more than $500.00. Won't pay that much for a Kolar because I shoot other neat guns.

 

[Davandron]

The 20ga usage in our 12ga league is a mix; for example I own a 20ga but a few of the more serious people use tubes. There are a lot of 12ga 7/8oz reloads being fired in O/Us.

Felt recoil is such a slippery subject, and everyone is entitled to their opinion. Owning a 7# 20ga O/U and an 8# 12ga pump, each with limbsavers; when I compare the promo shells 1-1/8oz 12ga to the 7/8oz 20ga load, the 12ga definitely kicks more.

A recoil calculation backs this up:

• Assuming 20grs powder and 40grs wad in all loads
• 7/8oz (380grs) at 1250fps in 7# is 14.6 fpe
• 1oz (440grs) at 1250fps in 8# is 16.4 fpe
• 1-1/8oz (490grs) at 1200fps in 8# is 18.2 fpe ... that's 25% more recoil than the 20ga load

Interesting note, 1oz 20ga 7# kicks the same as 1-1/8oz 12ga 8#.

I completely agree that a 12ga shooting 7/8oz is about the sweetest thing, but it is not the cheapest. For low cost I whole-heartedly encourage 20ga.

 

[clang]

I would recommend to the OP that if he really wants to go cheap - check out used guns like the Stoger Condor or Remington Spartan. No use buying new because they don't hold their value. Same is true for the Lanbar recommended above.

Over the years, there have been a lot of decent O/Us imported that might be worth looking at - guns like the American Arms Silver I or II. The guns do not go for a lot of money, but if they break, expect to the repair bill to be significant - they might even qualify for a new life as a tomato stake.

You can find a used basic Citori with fixed chokes in the $650 price range, or maybe an Ithaca SKB or B C Miruku made Charles Daly (NOT the newer ones).

For $200-300 more, you get a more modern used gun with screw in chokes, which make the gun more versatile. I saw a used Beretta White Wing at a gun show last weekend with a $795 asking price.