Looking for a combo of handgun safe and fire safe

[NW_Road]

I need a secure storage solution for some valuables, documents, and two handguns. I was thinking of getting the SentrySafe 2.0 cu ft Combination Safe (http://www.sentrysafe.com/Products/508/SFW205CWB_Combination_Fire_Safe), which is mechanical only and seems to be a decent enough safe for everyday valuables and documents, but I know these kinds of safes are lousy for guns.

I don't want to spend several grand on a safe, so I figured I might get two smallish safes - one for the documents and valuables and another one for my guns. What would be the most affordable small handgun safe you'd be comfortable with in terms of security and reliability? I'd prefer an actual safe over a lock box, but it doesn't have to be fire-rated or very heavy. My top priority is for the safe to stay shut while it's in the house. I own two handguns - not a collector, nothing valuable.

Of course, if you know of anything that would fit both requirements at <$1,000, that'd be great too. Thanks so much!

 

[a1abdj]

Sentry fire safes should not be used for valuables either. They are great inexpensive fire safes, and I have seen several do well in real life fires. They offer virtually no burglary protection.

 

[NW_Road]

Thanks for your quick reply! Hm, that makes things more complicated. I guess then I'll need I nice basic safe with decent burglary protection as well as the Sentry or a similar one for documents. Or I get a safe deposit box at the bank for my documents, but the thought of relying on them for my important docs gives me an allergic reaction.

Edit:

Does anyone have first-hand experience with Steelwater and/or Mesa? It looks like they make some simple smaller safes that might fit the bill.

 

[CB900F]

NW_Road;

You might wish to take a look at the AMSEC BF series of small safes. That's about where my personal comfort level would be, but I'd also be surprised if they don't exceed your stated budget level by a pretty good margin.

900F

 

[cdk8]

With reasonable fire protection but lack of any real burglary protection, the Sentry products may or may not provide the degree of protection a Buyer wants. If you want burglary protection for more than the two hand guns, I would suggest something else. And as a general rule, I think most Buyers will use security safes for more than they initially believe. For example, it's nice to have a fire and burglary barrier between financial data, jewelry, watches, heirlooms, etc.

I also like the AmSec BF Series as an entry-level general-use safe. Built to (the relatively loose) B-rate specifications, tested for and earning the RSC rating, and carrying a UL 350/1hr/1700F fire rating, these safes give reasonably good comprehensive protection that most gun safes do not. As the BF's are American-made, they aren't Sentry cheap. The smallest size, the BF1512, can be purchased for around $1,000 shipped when on a good sale...but it's pretty small. Note that there are construction differences between the BF safes and the two BF gun safes...why AmSec did not make these three or four different product lines I do not know, but there are differences in armor, construction, and certifications. My referencing here applies only to the smaller BF series, specifically, the BF1512, BF1716, and BF2116.

Gardall has some value offerings that are popular, but I do not have tons of experience with them. Adesco also used to but I believe they are now sold under the FireKing branding and marketed mainly to the enterprise community.

If you are on a very tight budget, I would find local lock smiths and safe dealers in your area, and call around to see if they have anything used in stock. I generally reference Lackasafe and Empire Safes when discussing used products as they tend to have a large stock to give you an idea of pricing. However, they tend to carry more used high-security safes than they do entry and mid grade consumer safes.

Another option could be a Sentry Safe for fire protection of valuables you do not need to protect from theft, and a fast-access locking box constructed of plate steel for the hand guns. I have a few Fort Knox Pistol Boxes I use for this purpose. While this is not a high-security product, it does provide a limited degree of burglary protection, is easy to hide to increase that protection, and provides outstanding operational reliability and child resistance. With that said, I think either way you will like having a safe that provides both fire and burglary protection to a limited degree.

Also note that, with quality products that use good electronic locks, these locks are usually very secure and very reliable. For entry products, that isn't always the case. I personally prefer mechanical locks, but just like electronic locks there are many entry-level mechanical locks that provide inconsistent reliability at best.

 

[FAS1]

I figured I might get two smallish safes - one for the documents and valuables and another one for my guns. I own two handguns.

Are you looking for quick access for the guns?

 

[NW_Road]

Thanks for all your replies! The BF series would be great, but they are too tall. I don't own rifles and shotguns and don't plan to get any at this time.

Quick access to the guns is not a priority, and I have a couple of handgun vaults if that's needed.

 

[cdk8]

Thanks for all your replies! The BF series would be great, but they are too tall. I don't own rifles and shotguns and don't plan to get any at this time.

Quick access to the guns is not a priority, and I have a couple of handgun vaults if that's needed.

There are small versions of the BF that are considerably shorter than what you would need for long guns. These models are general-use security & fire safes, as opposed to the larger gun safe BF line.

For example, their smallest model is about 20 inches tall...
https://www.safeandvaultstore.com/a...ed-safe.html?gclid=CJmdreGC-MgCFc8YHwodmCUBMw
(you can get a better price shopping around)

 

[NW_Road]

Cool, that's exactly what the doctor ordered! I see that Costco has a slightly taller Cannon for under $600 delivered. Cannon is pretty decent, isn't it?

Edit: Oh, one other question. What - other than the right dimensions and compartments - do gun safes have that makes them different from regular fire/burglary safes?

 

[CB900F]

NW_Road;

A Cannon is an RSC. If that's a protection level that suites your needs, go for it. But, it's not a very high level of protection. The smaller AMSEC BF series offers much better fire and burglary levels, albeit at higher cost.

Other than size, there's nothing that differentiates a "gun safe" from either RSC's or true safes that are sized for firearms.

900F

 

[NW_Road]

Got it. Thanks very much!

 

[cdk8]

Cool, that's exactly what the doctor ordered! I see that Costco has a slightly taller Cannon for under $600 delivered. Cannon is pretty decent, isn't it?

Edit: Oh, one other question. What - other than the right dimensions and compartments - do gun safes have that makes them different from regular fire/burglary safes?

Not at all...stay away from Cannon!!! While many Cannon safes have the same RSC rating that the AmSec BF series has, the construction differences are dramatic as is the fire rating.

The AmSec BF is built to B-rate that has been tested to and passed the RSC test. In loose terms, that equates to .5 inches of steel on the door, and .25 inches of steel on the body. It's fire proofing comes from a poured composite material, and the fire rating is from the UL.

The Cannon may have been tested to and passed the RSC test, but it likely has less than half the armor of the above AmSec. Most likely the armor is closer to .10 - .13 inches thick, and it most likely uses fire boards instead of a poured composite material, and the fire rating is probably not from the UL. The steel grade, welding, boltwork, and lock will also all be inferior.

If you are looking to buy new, the three smallest AmSec BF sizes are really the entry level of an affordable safe that provides meaningful burglary and fire protection. It's far from a high-security safe, but substantially superior to the almost laughable protection that that grade of Cannon provides.

A Cannon, and safes like it, mainly provides moral support...

 

[cdk8]

Regardless of who you go with, it's probably also worth verifying which locking mechanism you get (if you have a preference) because sometimes different Sellers offer the same safe with different base locks and their stock images do not always reflect what the safe ships with.

With the three smaller BF sizes, this seems pretty common, as I have seen them with their own branded ESL-5/10 electronic locks, S&G mechanical locks, and AmSec is also using Big Red mechanical locks (presumably a S&G clone like most mechanical locks.)

 

[NW_Road]

Thanks very much, I appreciate all this input. Sounds like the couple hundred extra are a good investment and the only way to get a real all-in-one solution. Are there other brands in the price category of AMSEC or lower that I should keep an eye out for?