Hello there and thanks for stopping by. I am in need of some assistance. Recently I bought a PSL-54C (7.62x54R) and picked up a couple of packs of some milsurp ammo. It spoiled me as I was shooting amazing groups with it. So, I then started reading about how phenomenal the new production Wolf ammo is, on Dragunov.net, and bought 500 rounds. Another reason that I bought it was because it is non-corrosive. Anyway, I was less than thrilled with the Wolf ammo. It took my groupd from 1" to 5" at 100 yds. Then, I set out to figure out what kind of ammo it was that I initially was shooting from my gun, when I first bought it. It is stamped 21/87 on the rim. According to 7.62x54r.net, it is Hungarian and was manufactured from the late 70's to the mid 80's. It is steel cased, grey/silver in color and the bullet is all copper in color, with no markings. My question to you guys is: Where can I find this stuff and can I find it for a reasonable price? Thanks for any assistance.
Looking For A Specific Round For My PSL
- Thread starter Adam123
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Cosmoline
Member
These things get sold off in huge batches by a number of wholesale outfits. Do a google search for the specs and something should come up. I saw a lot of that grey stuff a few years ago, not so much now. You might also try out the Polish light ball that's sold on stripper clips. I suspect it would be ideal for the PSL. Always buy a test amount first, of course, as you now know! Predicting how 54R will shoot is a rifle-by-rifle analysis.
Also--you can do a swap with that Wolf LB. A lot of folks are hungry for it.
Also--you can do a swap with that Wolf LB. A lot of folks are hungry for it.
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Sebastian the Ibis
Member
Here is 28/86 Hungarian:
http://www.gunsinternational.com/7-...-Tin-800-rds-200-Shipped.cfm?gun_id=100151038
None of the usual websites have much Hungarian in stock. I'd try Serbian/Prvi Partizan that usually works the best for me.
http://www.gunsinternational.com/7-...-Tin-800-rds-200-Shipped.cfm?gun_id=100151038
None of the usual websites have much Hungarian in stock. I'd try Serbian/Prvi Partizan that usually works the best for me.
you may want to check out the online ammo dumps. Ammoman, ableammo, ammunition to go....there are several. From what I have read about the PSLs, they tend to like a certain bullet weight. Maybe the groups opened because the Wolf was using a lighter bullet? Honestly, the best way to get consistent accuracy would be to handload. It may be hard to find the exact round you want. Many of those lots sell out quickly, and it may be the last of it for a while.
wnycollector
Member
My M/N also loves hungarian light ball. I stocked up with 6 440 round tins of it back in 2006 for $35/tin from sportsmansguide. The only place that I can find it now is Graf's for $111/440 rounds. Here is the link http://www.grafs.com/retail/catalog/product/productId/11216
HorseSoldier
Member
The mil surp 7.62x54 isn't built to real tight specs, with it being intended primarily for use in MGs they actually wanted it a bit sloppy for a better beaten zone. Some lots will be better than others, but if you really want sharp groups you'll be better served by new production from people better than Wolf.
HorseSoldier, I'm well aware of Wolf not being the best. It is my understanding that Wolf is the only company currently making new, non-corrosive 7.62x54R light ball.
Wnycollector, I'll give you $45 per case. That is, approximately, a 23% profit. You should go for it. I'll even pay for shipping.
Wnycollector, I'll give you $45 per case. That is, approximately, a 23% profit. You should go for it. I'll even pay for shipping.
Wnycollector (or whomever else cares), I just got off of the phone with someone from Graf & Son's and they are indeed selling Soviet/Russian ammo and calling it Hungarian. I asked him to give me the numbers from the Hungarian can (just out of curiosity of the year of production) and he read off 77-188 and that threw up a red flag for me. I then asked him what color the can was and he said it was dark green. I told him they they were selling Soviet/Russian ammo and were calling it Hungarian. After prying some more, I actually got him to admit this. His response was that they "weren't receiving any complaints".
From my experience, Hungarian ammo MUCH more accurate and consistent (I would even say that it is far superior... seems to have better quality control) in my PSL than the Soviet/Russian ammo and I would have been p*ssed if they sent the Soviet/Russian while trying to call it Hungarian. The best part is that the Hungarian is $25 more than the Russian/Soviet. For either price, you'll be sent the same product. That is entirely awesome.... and kind of not awesome.
From my experience, Hungarian ammo MUCH more accurate and consistent (I would even say that it is far superior... seems to have better quality control) in my PSL than the Soviet/Russian ammo and I would have been p*ssed if they sent the Soviet/Russian while trying to call it Hungarian. The best part is that the Hungarian is $25 more than the Russian/Soviet. For either price, you'll be sent the same product. That is entirely awesome.... and kind of not awesome.
HorseSoldier
Member
You would think the Cyrillic versus Roman letters would be dead giveaway and such, even if someone didn't know anything about what Hungarian words looked like, which makes it kind of hard to think that situation was accidental or an innocent mistake.
wnycollector
Member
Adam123 sorry for sending you on a wild goose chase. I got the graff's link from gun-deal.com. Here is a link to the real deal Hungarian lightball spam can labeling http://7.62x54r.net/MosinID/MosinAmmo004.htm
I'm down to my last two spam cans of Hungarian light ball
I still have bulgarian and russian light ball for range blasting w/ my M/N's. If I shoot for groups or out to 300 yards...I brake out the Hungarian ammo.
I'm down to my last two spam cans of Hungarian light ball
I still have bulgarian and russian light ball for range blasting w/ my M/N's. If I shoot for groups or out to 300 yards...I brake out the Hungarian ammo.Zombiphobia
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This is called "false advertisement", and last time I check, is illegal, not to mention unethical.
I'm making a note to myself to not do business with them.
Wnycollector, it's not your fault. Who would have thought? I am just glad that I called and asked for numbers before getting it home, opening it up,
and then started screaming "WHYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY!?!?!?!" Thanks for the link as well. 7.62x54R.net is how I initially identified the ammunition. That is a great site. By the way, what year is your Hungarian light ball? The ammo I shot was stamped 21/87 and it was extremely accurate and very consistent. That gave me the good results and that is what I was reading all over the web as well. I just bought some 21/85 from Copes. I am hoping for the same results. Basically, I am wondering if all the 21/8* is good ammo or is it just the 21/87 that's notorious for being a great round.
Zombiphobia, I would really like to think that it's an honest mistake, but I have a REALLY hard time believing it. I'll probably do business with them if the price and PRODUCT are right.
and then started screaming "WHYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY!?!?!?!" Thanks for the link as well. 7.62x54R.net is how I initially identified the ammunition. That is a great site. By the way, what year is your Hungarian light ball? The ammo I shot was stamped 21/87 and it was extremely accurate and very consistent. That gave me the good results and that is what I was reading all over the web as well. I just bought some 21/85 from Copes. I am hoping for the same results. Basically, I am wondering if all the 21/8* is good ammo or is it just the 21/87 that's notorious for being a great round.
Zombiphobia, I would really like to think that it's an honest mistake, but I have a REALLY hard time believing it. I'll probably do business with them if the price and PRODUCT are right.
aklovinguy
Member
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there is some 7.62x54r on cheaper than dirt that cloely resembles what you are discribing.
I checked their site a few weeks ago. They had some Hungarian LB, but it was out of stock. I just looked now and they don't seem to have anything listed... in stock or out of stock.
Edit: I just found it via a google search, but it is not showing up on their site as an active item. It's the first result.
http://www.google.com/#sclient=psy&...&aql=f&oq=&gs_rfai=&pbx=1&fp=e18ec2db23988f7d
Edit: I just found it via a google search, but it is not showing up on their site as an active item. It's the first result.
http://www.google.com/#sclient=psy&...&aql=f&oq=&gs_rfai=&pbx=1&fp=e18ec2db23988f7d
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wnycollector
Member
The open tin I'm shooting is 21/79, but I have two unopened tins of '87 vintage.
Very cool wny. Any interest in selling? Another question (posted this in another thread): Is the 21/87 any better than 21/85 or 21/83? I can't find 21/87 anywhere, but I have found some 21/85 and 83. Can you speak from experience? Have you heard anything?
wnycollector
Member
I wish had kept better track of what years ammo I had been shooting, I just knew it was Hungarian light ball. I cant really speak to any differences in accuracy between years of manufacture.
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