Lots of guns = low crime rate?

Status
Not open for further replies.

gunNoob

Member
Joined
Dec 1, 2006
Messages
488
I was reading through gun rights in other countries and came across this one:

"Switzerland has one of the lowest crime rates in the world, and one of the highest gun ownership rates in the world."

I thought it was interesting since many Americans think that more guns equals more crime. Maybe those people will wake up and realize that we just have some crazy people here and that guns laws aren't going to change anything.

Sorry if this thread is random. Just thought it was interesting :evil:
 
I've been having a lot of discussions with my peers at work about various aspects of gun ownership and answering a lot of questions from them. Of course there is never anything good that comes out of tragedies like this; it is the depths of sadness. But it has raised everyone's awareness and they've had the courage to ask rather than ignore what they never knew. I rarely had talked about firearms with some of these people before but I am certainly amazed how many of them can quote so many of the fallacies. "extra-high capacity magazines" and "machine guns" and "won't the bad guys just take your gun and use it against you?" and "sure, if you want an old hunting rifle but that's it" and "they should close the gun-show loophole" and on and on and on. I'm constantly shocked how people who really know so little about details can remember some of the lies they've heard word-for-word.
I have answered a lot of questions and I feel like I was at least able to construct some good arguments with some random citizens, so that's a good thing. We'll see what tomorrow brings by way of new questions and new uninformed people.
 
Haha good stuff. I tend to not talk about my guns or guns in general unless a friend wants to go shooting. I had some female friends come to my house one time and they walked into my bedroom without permission. Sure enough they saw my SKS and AK sitting against the wall (ammo locked up, I like to display my guns sometimes...). They said "Holy sh**! Those are freakin' sniper rifles!" then they left the party. Opps. Some people just have a negative view on guns and nothing will ever change that view unfortunately. It's funny since this country was built around guns basically
 
I understand that. The really good news is that I'm taking 2 noobs out shooting on Saturday afternoon because they asked me to. If they enjoy it, and I'm sure they will, they have mentioned that they would like to go buy themselves a pistol finally. I feel like THR should give out Recruitment Badges or something for successful converts.
 
Guns itself has minimal impact on overall crime though it does influance the type of crime and plays a role in whether victims have effective options or are less capable against the typically stronger younger and more physically fit violent attacker. In places with lots of guns there is some statistics that show more property crime happens and less violent crime happens. In England for example home invasions compared to other crimes happen at a relatively high rate, while in the US burglars do all they can to avoid confronting home owners most of the time.

The biggest difference in many places with low crime is a homegenous population. That lack of massive diversity. Extreme diversity in culture, views, and allowance of various subcultures to openly exist like our own hip-hop thug culture, has a big impact on crime.

The US also in spite of official statistics has had a really low murder rate outside of gangs, gangs primarily made up of people that choose to be part of the lifestyle.
The vast majority of murders as a result has been young black and hispanic men taking part in the gang culture, and some of thier unfortunate family and friends in and around those involved in that culture.
This is known because the FBI has kept racial statistics on homicide, and that is the segment of that population primarily murdered or murdering.
'White' murders and by extension murders of those not white living the more standard lifestyle have been going down since 1980, constantly.
The uptick in the 90s in the overall rate was almost entirely gangs, the white rate was still going down.

What this says is the US is very safe overall if you removed people choosing to be part of a gang culture or criminal element from the statistics. No matter what ethnicity, if people choose to not be part of a subculture that promotes violence and masculinity through fighting with enemy gang members, along with drug use and exploitation of women and thier society in general, then you will typically be much safer and have a better place.
If on the other hand you like violence for the sake of violence, drugs, dealing drugs, or various percieved or real benefits of being part of a self proclaimed tough guy group that starts problems with others, you have a high rate of dying from homicide.


Mass shootings on the other hand as we are being bombarded by the media about are a different problem, and overall are a very small percentage of homicides, and have different issues to address than the typical rate.
 
Last edited:
That's all true, and has proven so hard to quantify for many reasons. As the joke goes, 75% of all statistics are made up on the spot. We've all read articles and seen studies and eventually we all get fed up with any sort of statistic or trend because statistics ALWAYS reinforce the bias of the presenter in order to prove their slant. Whether you agree with the presenter or not is really how impactful any study ever is.
Your points are valid in the larger sense in that people who associate with violence die violently. People who hang with thugs have thuggery visited upon them. People who play sports constantly become better athletes; we are all creatures of our surroundings.
And that is where the anti's have us figured incorrectly. They think that the fact that I carry a pistol and the local gangbangers carry pistols, means that we are the same.
Squirrels have tails and bunnies have tails, so squirrels are bunnies right?
 
^ Bingo. "OMG YOU HAVE GUNS?!?!?!?"...."WHY???"

Do we really need a reason? We live in America and it's our right.
 
So, if the criminals didn't have guns, would I still carry?
Yes of course. There's more criminals than there are of me, and who said they only come one at a time and with warning? And what about my 5'1" 112# wife? And my kids? etc.
So the REAL question is, if there were no criminals, and no mentally deranged attackers, and no wild animal attacks, and no threat of government take-overs, and no threat of sunspots or peak oil or approaching zombies or hurricane refugee looters, would we still carry? Hmmm, I may have to think that one over. :banghead:
 
A "friend" posted this on Facebook a few seconds ago:

"Guns are made to kill human beings, other beings that are minding their own business, or to intimidate others. I'm not big on any of that."

.....
 
Zoogster, in post 5, you say what I have been telling people for years. Thank you for joining me in spreading what most people are afraid to touch. It's how it is, and it's a shame that so many tiptoe carefully around what is nothing more than a brutal reality.
 
More of an acquaintance from years ago. He's never really been a friend now that I think of it.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top