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Lube, Primer, and Bullet Seating

Discussion in 'Handloading and Reloading' started by liberalwithagun, Oct 9, 2011.

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  1. liberalwithagun

    liberalwithagun Member

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    I am currently waiting for my rifle powder through die. While waiting I deprimed a set of brass and primed it immediately (winchester brass). Another set of brass I deprimed, washed and cleaned primer pocket, and then reprimed (PMC brass). I should note that BOTH sets were prewashed before being deprimed.

    Do I need to relube the set that was washed and reprimed (PMC)? Would just be ok to wipe off the set that was deprimed and immediately reprimed without washing (winchester)?

    It may also 3-4 days before the powder through shows up. Would I need to relube the currently lubed (winchester) set?
     
  2. Hondo 60

    Hondo 60 Member

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    Not sure what you mean by "washing"

    Are you talking about tumbling?
    or some sort of wet cleaning?

    For rifle brass:
    I tumble
    lube
    deprime/resize
    trim & chamfer
    tumble
    prime
    charge
    seat
    crimp

    in that order
     
  3. rcmodel

    rcmodel Member in memoriam

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    Not if you resized it before you deprimed, & primed it like you should have.

    If you didn't resize it first, you got to start all over again.

    Steps:
    1. Clean to your hearts desire.
    2. Lube & FL Size.
    3. Deprime & expand.
    3A. Clean again if you want too.
    4. Re-prime.
    5. Charge.
    6. Seat the bullet.

    I leave the "washing" to my dirty shorts.
    Brass should be tumbled in dry media for the least amount of hassle per clean case produced.

    rc
     
  4. liberalwithagun

    liberalwithagun Member

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    Sorry for the improper verb. I "cleaned" after the deprime + expand. I mixed 1 cup vinegar w/ teaspoon detergent and water. After the cleaning I reprimed the PMC brass.

    I guess my exact question is do the cases needed to be lubed in order to insert bullets?
     
  5. snuffy

    snuffy Member

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    After all of that, we still don't know what you are talking about!?¿ handgun, rifle, brass cased shotshells? Caliber, cartridge, type of weapon??¿ OOPS, I see it now,,,rifle powder through die

    We can understand a new reloader not knowing proper terminology, just try to use the right names for stuff.

    Also, what makes you think you must have a rifle-powder-through-die in order to load? Hmmmmmmm, maybe he's using a lee turret, wants to use the auto disk? See how we have to guess what you're doing?
     
  6. snuffy

    snuffy Member

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    Again, be specific. What cartridge, what kind of bullets,(jacketed, lead)? If we know, we can answer without have to write a book to cover all the possibilities that are out there.
     
  7. ROCKFISH

    ROCKFISH Member

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    Short answer, no, you don't need to lube again.:D
     
  8. liberalwithagun

    liberalwithagun Member

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    Press: Lee Turret 4 Hole
    Caliber: .223
    Charging With: Lee Auto Disk Powder Measure
    Die Set: Lee Pacesetter
    Bullet: Hornaday Full Metal Jacket Boat Tail


    Specific Question: Does my brass need to be lubed in order to use the rifle through powder die,bullet seating die, and lee factory crimp die?

    Specific Question 2: IF YES to 1, do I need to apply any special care not to put any lube on the primer OR can the primer be damaged by lube?
     
  9. ROCKFISH

    ROCKFISH Member

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    answer is still no
     
  10. liberalwithagun

    liberalwithagun Member

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    many thanks. I am sure more worrywart/inane questions are going to pop up.

    Thanks for the patience everyone!
     
  11. JohnM

    JohnM Member

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    I have a question.
    If you washed your brass in soap and water, how did you get it all totally dry?
     
  12. liberalwithagun

    liberalwithagun Member

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    Dried it off with a towel, cleaned out primer pocket, put in glass cooking pan and set it out in the sun for 3-4 hours.
     
  13. rsrocket1

    rsrocket1 Member

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    The answer is no, the only time you need lube is for full length resizing (or in the specialized case of using a full length die to partially resize, but that's for bolt action guns in precision shooting).

    You don't need lube for any of these steps:
    Collet neck sizing (where you use a dedicated neck sizing only die)
    Priming
    Powder through
    Case neck flaring
    Bullet seating
    Crimping

    BTW, don't use vinager unless you neutralize with baking soda. Otherwise your brass may turn pink in a few days due to the zinc dissolving faster than the copper in the brass.
     
  14. liberalwithagun

    liberalwithagun Member

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    Many thanks.

    I have not seen the cases turn pink yet. It has been 5-6 days for the earliest brass that was cleaned. I think the laundry detergent has something that neutralizes the acid.
     
  15. snuffy

    snuffy Member

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    Once you asked a specific question, you got a specific answer. You sound like a liberal. You want somebody else to do everything for you, you take no responsibility for asking a good question. I guess we're supposed to read your mind!? Nope, that's a scary thought!:what::eek:

    Get a loading manual. You surely don't have one. or you didn't read it if you do have one. These questions are ALL answered inside the pages of just about any manual.
     
  16. liberalwithagun

    liberalwithagun Member

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    Have the ABC reloading manual. Read it front to back. I only ask because I want to be absolutely sure.

    I will admit that I threw my question out pretty haphazardly. My apologies.
     
  17. gamestalker

    gamestalker member

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    The one and only time you ever have to lube a bottle neck case is prior to resizing. Following resizing trim, ream and chamfer, tumble or clean with what ever method you use. And at this point it is elemental to make sure your brass is free as as much residue of any type, case lube or anything. More on that later.

    Anyway, once the brass is lubed, trimmed, reamed and chamfered, ccleaned of all residue, it is now prime time. Once primed powder and seat your bullets. Once my loads are all finished I always give them a quick acetone wipe off just for good measure, I'll explain.

    The reason for my obcession with clean residue free brass is because during the pressure curve a key element on the normal function of center fire cartridges is case seize. When a case is discharged the pressures force the brass against the chamber wall creating a necessary seal, and the seize prevents the case from freely slaming against the bolt face preventing other wise possible damage or excessive case failure.
     
  18. USSR

    USSR Member

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    That's okay. Once you lose your liberal tendacies, your mind will clear up and your questions will become more succinct and to the point.;)

    Don
     
  19. bukijin

    bukijin Member

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    Did you measure and trim your brass between full-length resizing and re-priming ? Just didn't notice you mentioning it and it is an important step for safety.

    I reload .223 on a Lee classic 4 hole turret also. However I add powder off the press using a Lee powder measure mounted to the bench - never saw the point in the powder through die. BTW a tumbler will make things much easier and as has already been clarified, the reason to lube the cases is so they dont get stuck in the full-length-resizing/decapping die.
     
  20. snuffy

    snuffy Member

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    Now we're getting somewhere.

    I'll tell you what your next question will be when you get your rifle powder die. "Why can't I get the auto disk to dispense enough powder for my .223 shells?" That's because it's capacity is limited by the biggest hole in the large disk to only about half what you need for .223. You will have to get the double disk kit riser for the auto disk measure. It contains another set of disks and a riser for the side to allow two disks to be stacked on top of each other.

    You then double the capacity, but still not enough to load the bigger calibers.

    I understand now that you want to take advantage of the through-put of your turret, to load one shell from start to finish without taking it out of the shell holder. That's what the turret was built for, and how it should work. In reality, you still need the safety prime auto primer to complete the scenario.

    Sorry I went off on you for a general question. It miffs me that people start answering a question BEFORE they know what's being asked. Reloading is a very specific, detail oriented hobby, with a lot of specific terminology. You pretty much have to learn it to get to where you can speak the language and ask detailed questions.

    NO, you don't need/want to lube a jacketed bullet for .223 or any other rifle/handgun. Actually there should be a tiny amount of lube inside the neck already from lubing the outside of the case during sizing. It helps the expander button glide smoothly through the neck during sizing as it's being withdrawn.

    Some go totally OCD, insist that lube be cleaned so that it does NOT affect the force needed to pull the bullet,(bullet-pull). The high pressure type of lubes used for case sizing can affect the bullet-pull. If there's an excessive amount, it can kill some of the powder, most case lubes are compatible with powder and primers, they don't kill anything, just the target.
     
  21. liberalwithagun

    liberalwithagun Member

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    Just ordered the double disk kit.

    Amazed at the "nickel and dime" that went on with getting totally set up.

    EDIT: Also sized/trimmed between decap and reprime.
     
  22. Hondo 60

    Hondo 60 Member

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    No!
     
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