M1?
- Thread starter tcrocker
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Steve in PA
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They shoot bothh equally well. Just don't shoot commercial ammo in your rifle unless you swap out the gas plug.
Hornady and, I believe, Federal make Garand safe ammunition. It says so in big letters all over the boxes.
Current commercial hunting ammo powder burns too slow for the Garand. The pressure in the gas system is too high. The result is a damaged op rod. (As a side note, for correct operation of the Garand, the op rod is not straight!)
As Steve said, there are a couple of replacement gas plugs on the market that relieve the pressure in the gas system so that current hunting ammunition can be used. They are the McCann and the Shuster if memory serves me, but I have slept since then. They work just fine, but like anything there are compromises.
If you reload, not all powders are suitable for the Garand for the same reason. My favorites for the M1 are IMR4895, H4895, and Varget. There are some others but the list is short when compared to the full line of 30-06 powders.
The Civilian Marksmanship Program forum has a wealth if information on the M1 Garand. There is good information on this forum, but over there, the bulk of the discussions are centered around US service rifles that shoot either 30-06 or 30 Carbine.
Enjoy your "new" M1.
Current commercial hunting ammo powder burns too slow for the Garand. The pressure in the gas system is too high. The result is a damaged op rod. (As a side note, for correct operation of the Garand, the op rod is not straight!)
As Steve said, there are a couple of replacement gas plugs on the market that relieve the pressure in the gas system so that current hunting ammunition can be used. They are the McCann and the Shuster if memory serves me, but I have slept since then. They work just fine, but like anything there are compromises.
If you reload, not all powders are suitable for the Garand for the same reason. My favorites for the M1 are IMR4895, H4895, and Varget. There are some others but the list is short when compared to the full line of 30-06 powders.
The Civilian Marksmanship Program forum has a wealth if information on the M1 Garand. There is good information on this forum, but over there, the bulk of the discussions are centered around US service rifles that shoot either 30-06 or 30 Carbine.
Enjoy your "new" M1.
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ReloaderFred
Member
The Garand was designed to shoot the bullets in use at the time (early 1930's) which was the M1 bullet @ 172 grains, or the M2 bullet @ 150 grains. Either weight will shoot well in the Garand.
As noted, use powders in burn rate between IMR-3031 as the fastest, and IMR-4320 as the slowest. The port pressure is important in these rifles and IMR-4895 was developed for this rifle and provides optimum port pressure and produces pretty good accuracy, too.
Hope this helps.
Fred
As noted, use powders in burn rate between IMR-3031 as the fastest, and IMR-4320 as the slowest. The port pressure is important in these rifles and IMR-4895 was developed for this rifle and provides optimum port pressure and produces pretty good accuracy, too.
Hope this helps.
Fred
USSR
Member
No, the M1 Garand was not made to shoot 147gr bullets. The 147gr is the bullet used in M80 ammo (7.62x51) that was shot in the M14. If you want an accurate load for your M1, then use a heavier bullet with a longer bearing surface than the 147gr bullets.
Don
P-32
Member
I believe the M-2 ball shot a 152 gr. FMJ. The 147 gr. FMJwas not invented until the 308 came out. BOth are close enough.
If you want plinking rounds then stay with the 147 or 150 gr. bullet. If you want to see just what the M-1 will do then may I suggest a 155 gr. Palma SMK. My M-1's shoot the 155's like a house ol fire.
If you want plinking rounds then stay with the 147 or 150 gr. bullet. If you want to see just what the M-1 will do then may I suggest a 155 gr. Palma SMK. My M-1's shoot the 155's like a house ol fire.
ArchAngelCD
Member.
If I remember correctly the bullets weight for M2 30-06 M1 Garand ammo was 152gr.
I have fired 147gr, 150gr, 152gr, 168gr and 175gr bullets in my Garand ammo and all fired well with the correct powder charges. I think current wisdom is not to fire anything over a 168gr bullet in the Garand but I'm not sure why. I stick with 150gr and 152gr bullets most times because the 168gr bullets that are more accurate cost a lot more too.
I have fired 147gr, 150gr, 152gr, 168gr and 175gr bullets in my Garand ammo and all fired well with the correct powder charges. I think current wisdom is not to fire anything over a 168gr bullet in the Garand but I'm not sure why. I stick with 150gr and 152gr bullets most times because the 168gr bullets that are more accurate cost a lot more too.
Actually, IMR4895 did not come out until 1941, and the `32 Garand was designed around the (literal) billions of rounds of ammunition (both WW-I leftovers and later M1/M2 ball) that MacArthur insisted be used instead of the original 276 Pederson the Army Board had approved just the day before. (M1/174gr ball was the original spec)
http://www.imrpowder.com/rifle.html
According to Hatcher, M1 Ball was based on Pyro D. G.(Double Graphite) aka 1909 Military Powder or MR20. (MR20 was an extruded tube single base powder. Since the government uses its own perverse nomenclature, MR20 was listed as "Pyro Cal .30 DG.")
http://www.weatherbynation.com/spikecamp/conversation/35/powder-let's-be-more-progressive/0/?wap2
Just to add to the confusion, Wikipedia tells us IMR4895 "...Originally known as 1909 Military or Pyro DG (for Diphenylamine Graphited), 500 tons per day of MR # 20 was manufactured for military loading of the original 150-grain M1906 bullet in the .30-06 through World War I.[2] Grains of 0.03-inch diameter were 0.084 inches long with 9% DNT coating. IMR1185 (3031/4064 eq?) was used when military .30-06 loadings shifted to the 173-grain M1 bullet from 1926 to 1938.[2] Grains of 0.032-inch diameter were 0.084 inches long with 7% DNT coating. IMR #4895 was used for loading the 152-grain M2 bullets in the .30-06 through World War II. Grains of 0.032-inch diameter are 0.056 inches long with 5.5% DNT coating."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Improved_Military_Rifle_(IMR)
But since Dupont -- who makes the stuff -- says 4895 disn't come out until roughly when WW-II started, who `ya gonna beleive?
Uncle Nick?
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ssyoumans
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For reloading data, look at Hornady #8 which has a section on loading for the M1. Even if you use a powder in the correct burn rate category, loads for the M1 tend to be reduced significantly from full power 30-06 data.
Another great source of data is the article by John Clarke on reloading the M1. You can find a link to it in Post #13
http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=564047
I have used Varget an W748, although IMR 4064 and one of the 4895's are probably the most popular. I like the metering of W748, but it does require a Magnum primer.
Another great source of data is the article by John Clarke on reloading the M1. You can find a link to it in Post #13
http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=564047
I have used Varget an W748, although IMR 4064 and one of the 4895's are probably the most popular. I like the metering of W748, but it does require a Magnum primer.
Hondo 60
Member
An M1 is definitely on my drool/want list.
Have fun shooting & reloading.
Have fun shooting & reloading.
Sunray
Member
IMR4895 had nothing to do with the M1 Rifle. It was developed for use in .30 M1 ammo with its 174.5 grain BT bullet and adopted in 1925 for use in 1903's.
Nothing was done to the ammo in 1941. .30 M2 ammo with its 152 grain bullet, adopted in 1938, was increased in MV in 1940 to match the ballistics of the .30 AP's 168 grain bullet.
JC had developed a gas operated rifle that was ready for testing in 1931. The Rifle was designed to use .30 M1 ammo, not the reverse. The .30 M1 ammo was dumped because it was found to have too much range for NG ranges of the time.
In any case, any 150 to 180 grain bullet will be fine out of an M1. The rifle does prefer 150's or 168's though. Use IMR4064, IMR or H 4895(close but not the same) or Varget with data out of your manual and you'll be fine.
You must full length resize every time and watch the OAL and the case lengths. When you get cases that are dented on the mouth(they're hitting the receiver on the way out) just open the mouth with needle nosed pliers enough to get the expander button in. The die will do the rest.
Nothing was done to the ammo in 1941. .30 M2 ammo with its 152 grain bullet, adopted in 1938, was increased in MV in 1940 to match the ballistics of the .30 AP's 168 grain bullet.
JC had developed a gas operated rifle that was ready for testing in 1931. The Rifle was designed to use .30 M1 ammo, not the reverse. The .30 M1 ammo was dumped because it was found to have too much range for NG ranges of the time.
In any case, any 150 to 180 grain bullet will be fine out of an M1. The rifle does prefer 150's or 168's though. Use IMR4064, IMR or H 4895(close but not the same) or Varget with data out of your manual and you'll be fine.
You must full length resize every time and watch the OAL and the case lengths. When you get cases that are dented on the mouth(they're hitting the receiver on the way out) just open the mouth with needle nosed pliers enough to get the expander button in. The die will do the rest.
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