M21/M1A question

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Carl

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What's the difference between these two? I know the M21 was the military sniper rifle through the 70's and 80's but it's also possible to mount a scope on an M1A and they look pretty identical. Is the M21 able to be purchased by civilians or is the civilian model basically an M1A with a scope?
 
According to SA the M21 (at least the new version from Springfield) features a special match-grade barrel from either Douglas or Kreiger plus a unique wood stock with an integrated adjustable cheekpiece, plus all the features on the M1A Super Match (highest end "non-sniper" M1A).

In addition Smith Enterprises can also build you a new M21.
 
I'd like a really nice semi-auto rifle that could double as a long distance shooter, hence why I bring up the sniper info of the M21 and wondered if the available M1A and the military M21 had any significant differences.
 
The predicament here is that you have the military designation of "M21" and also the commercial rifle which SAI has named "M21".

I believe the military sniper version of the M14 was basically a national match M14 that was glass bedded into a wood stock and fitted with a scope mount for glass (I don't know much about what optics were used).

Jason
 
The biggest difference is that a real M21 is based on an M14 receiver, which you're not going to find for less than $10k. The original ones used a Leatherwood 3-9 ART scope. It was advanced in it's time, but difficult to use. The mount was a single point mount on the side of the receiver where mounts available now are two- or three-point.

What is being offered by Springfield Inc. is as close as you're going to get to a real M21, but I'm sure it comes with their scope mount, which has a poor reputation. They don't mention the scope that's on it.

Real M21s may have started with the standard wood stock, but the Army did switch to McMillian stocks later on. Springfield's is rear lugged and bedded, but the bedding would need to be refreshed to keep accuracy at its best.

Their M25 looks like it's a step up and uses a rail mount instead of the standard scope mount.

As Jason mentioned, you're comparing a military rifle to a civilian copy. They can't directly be compared, but you are not going to find a real M21 on the civilian market. If you built one up from a receiver, you could make it closer to a real one than Springfield does, but it would be even more expensive. And, the M21 was changed over the years with the McMillian stock, a better scope mount, and better optics.

Unless you're looking for something that resembles an M21, I'd look for a standard M1A, add a J. Allen stock, ARMS mount, and a good scope. This would be a good foundation for a distance shooter.
http://www.jallenenterprises.com/
 
If you want the closest thing you can get to a military M14 based long range rifle you should have Ron Smith do a crazy horse build on an LRB M25 receiver. He has built an LRB M25 that shoots sub MOA at 1000 yards. Otherwise look at the FNAR heavy or a M110 clone.
 
Alright so here's a question. Has the M1A/M14 been proven as a good rifle? If so then who makes the best quality but reasonably affordable variant? I know Springfield makes them but I'm unaware of any other companies that make them.
 
SAI and LRB are the only companies that make M14 type rifles available in the USA.
 
Are there any all wood stock types? I know the M1A is all wood except for the top piece over the barrel (probably has a specific name) I'm a fan of all wood.
 
Are there any all wood stock types? I know the M1A is all wood except for the top piece over the barrel (probably has a specific name) I'm a fan of all wood.

The "top piece" is called the handguard, and it is traditionally made out of fiberglass. Early ones were vented, but they were fragile and caused ghosting/miraging/whatever else you wanna call it (hot air currents off the barrel rising up in the field of vision of optics).

SAI makes wood stocked versions of every M1A with the exception of the M25 and SOCOM. Actually, the M21 (commercial) has a walnut stock. All handgaurds from them are fiberglass though.

Jason
 
The Springfield M-21 has a match grade barrel, bedded action, tuned trigger, walnut stock with adjustable cheek piece and is super accurate; I love mine.

I went with a Smith M-21 scope mount and Leupold 4.5-14x50mm vxIII scope. I have been able to shoot 1/2" groups with little effort. The rifle is heavy but will do the work if called apon. Is it worth the money? I don't know, I guess to some no but to me it was.
M1Aafterrangetrip.gif
 
Carl Is the M21 able to be purchased by civilians or is the civilian model basically an M1A with a scope?

Civilians versions of the Crazy Horse M21A5 that SEI builds for our military are available.



I had Ron Smith build two of these for me on heel stamped Poly Tech receivers, I upgraded one of them into an EBR.

H2O-M14-2.jpg
 
I'd like more opinions on the M1A.

It's a heckuva rifle. I really love mine. An accurate piston driven battle rifle in a potent chambering, with classic looks and ergonomics.... great package IMHO.

Lots of folks like to pit the M1A/M14 against the ARs in these sorts of threads, and both rifles have their merits, but being more accustomed to classic styled hunting rifles, I took to the M1A much better. The AR felt like a toy in my hands, and I just flat out didn't enjoy shooting it as much. I know that's all in my head and whatnot, but I can't see plopping down that amount of money on a rifle unless it feels good to me.

JMHO, and everyone is different, but I think if I could only have one rifle, mine would be an M1A/M14.

Jason
 
My reason for wanting an M1A/M14 is mostly because so far my entire rifle collection is of old classy guns, but I'd still like to get a more modern reliable SHTF type rifle but still keep that classy historical charm. I think the M1A/M14 is a good candidate for that.
 
Old... classy... historical... Damn, you just described a GARAND! :what:
By all means, if your collecting guns with this verneint you must, IMHO include the venerable Garand, only the most prestigious firearm ever built! mho :eek:
 
I think Garands are great but IMO the M14 is the garand perfected.

I have to agree with lipadj46. Garands are one of my favorite rifles, but I like the M14 better as well. The M1 is certainly capable though.

Jason
 
I wonder if we would have kicked more a$$ in WWII if we would have had the M14 with it's 20 round mag.....

The Grand with it's 8 round clip was obviously an a$$ kicker though, I just wonder.....
 
I wish the M1A/M14 wasn't so expensive. I don't have a box magazine fed semi auto yet. I want one! When I was 16 before I had my own gun, I borrowed my uncle's 1917 Enfield (I think it was that) and spent my time in the deer blind reloading and unloading the magazine. Yeah I know, not good hunting but that was when my interest in hunting was trumped by the fascination with firearms.
 
I wish the M1A/M14 wasn't so expensive.

+1 on that. And the buying craze is just inflating prices even more. And even with prices being what they are, they are still out of stock most often. Best thing would be to find someone who is selling a lightly used one. I got my Loaded last summer, at a local shop (which costs a little more than ordering online) and was still out the door for $1500. Not cheap by any means, but I'd be scared to even look at prices right now at places that have the rifles available to sell.

Jason
 
I wouldn't mind a used one. I'd even prefer an old one. Maybe one that's been around for a while. Some tarnished bluing and scratches in the stock, adds character and any bumps in the performance might have been worked out by then.
 
There is a reason why they are expensive. SAI has had to make all the parts as the USGI parts have dried up. Older used ones with all USGI parts can be as much as new M1A's. You best bet is a chinese M14 but they are not so cheap anymore either.
 
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