MBC 44 Mag Coated Bullets

[quaid]

I grabbed a few sample packs of Missouri Bullet Company's 240 grain Hi-tek coated offerings: "44 Smasher" (RN), "44 Elmer K", and "44 Magnum - Hi-Tek" (TCFP), to try feeding in my winchester 94 20" barrel 44 mag lever rifle. All were loaded with 9.0 grains of Win 231, roll crimped in the crimp grooves, federal brass, federal LPP. I chrono'ed a sample of five each (results below), chrono placed at 7 yds out.

They all fed the same- as reliable as factory ammo. A few rounds had bullets that were tossed too high by the lift gate when throwing the lever, but that didn't seem related to bullet shape. The same thing happens with factory ammo. I'd appreciate suggestions on how to fix this?

I was pleased the swc fed well, I like the pretty holes. I might try them for hunting this year with a slower powder and higher velocity.

44 smasher (RN) oal 1.590"
Average 1310fps, ES 40, Std Dev. 14.8

44 Elmer K oal 1.620"
Average 1304fps, ES 45, Std Dev. 22.7

44 Magnum - Hi-Tek (TCFP)
Average 1311fps, ES 16, Std Dev. 6.5

 

[bluetopper]

I tried the red coated Acme bullets with a stiff charge of 2400 in 357 Mag and they emitted a sickening smell like burning plastic.

 

[quaid]

I did not notice any unusual smells or plastic odors from the mbc bullets. These were a gold color.

There were grey rings on the target paper like lead bullets leave, but I have not had a chance to examine the barrel yet.

Despite the light'ish load, 45 rounds later my shoulder is feeling bruised this evening.

 

[SARuger]

I'm going to try some of the 240g Elmer Kieth's in my 10.5" Super Blackhawk. Interested to see how they do.

 

[Mauser69]

I, too, hate the horrid stench of coated bullets, but I still shoot them because they seem to perform well. The only coated bullets I have tried are MBC, and they sink to high heaven when fired. If their regular bullets had a better lube than that terrible blue crayon stuff, I'd probably stop using the stinking plastic.

 

[drband]

I've used the 240gr Elmer-Ks and the 240gr Cowboy #13s both coated with light plinking loads of Unique AND with full power loads of W296. They both shoot accurately with no leading and very little powder residue in my SBH. Interestingly the soft lead Cowboy bullets work just fine with hot W296 loads.

 

[BigBore45]

I've used the 240gr Elmer-Ks and the 240gr Cowboy #13s both coated with light plinking loads of Unique AND with full power loads of W296. They both shoot accurately with no leading and very little powder residue in my SBH. Interestingly the soft lead Cowboy bullets work just fine with hot W296 loads.

At 12 BHN your not exactly soft for a lead bullet. I believe when the 44 mag was being developed the developer settled on a 11 BHN bullet.

I run 12-14 BHN For magnum Rounds and 8-10 BHN for my sub 900 FPS stuff without problems.

The main reason bullet companies push for a hard bullet is so they can ship without getting damaged. It really is not any better and most of the time a harder bullet is worse when it comes to leading and hunting situations.

 

[drband]

At 12 BHN your not exactly soft for a lead bullet. I believe when the 44 mag was being developed the developer settled on a 11 BHN bullet.

I run 12-14 BHN For magnum Rounds and 8-10 BHN for my sub 900 FPS stuff without problems.

The main reason bullet companies push for a hard bullet is so they can ship without getting damaged. It really is not any better and most of the time a harder bullet is worse when it comes to leading and hunting situations.

I totally agree. 12 is softer than their 18 BHN but is hardly "soft."

 

[eldon519]

My experience is limited to Bayou bullets, but definitely never noticed them smelling strongly or bad in my .44 mag. Tried several powders up to max. Not much different than smelling burnt lube from cast.

 

[TimSr]

The main reason bullet companies push for a hard bullet is so they can ship without getting damaged.

Where did you get this information?

 

[BigBore45]

Where did you get this information?

A Commercial Casting Business Owner.

 

[quaid]

I'd like to echo the above, my non-casting opinion is bullets are too hard (achem Oregon trail & lasercast ). When shooting lead I look for vendors with softer lead (under 15). I used zcast who has a soft lead for my 38 spl. The bullets are definitely cheap, casting defects and swirls, etc, they shoot fantastic and while I haven't used the new guy that took over the business's product yet, I will give it a shot when i run out, great product at a super competitive price point.

Meanwhile MBC's 44 mags... The TCFP oal I used was 1.606" (left out above)

The barrel looks squeaky clean, no sign of gold paint. I don't even see powder residue from the win231.

I'm really happy with the powder coat's ability to prevent leading. I ordered some mbc 200 grain to try in my 10mm to see how fast I can push those. They look fun and they are cheaper then jacketed. I was never a fan of plated bullets performance, price point, or limitations.

 

[double bogey]

I use the Elmer Kieth's in .44 mag. Little smell but no leading, driven fast and slow. Also use in .357, and .45 acp.

 

[Hondo 60]

Hmmmm I've used several hundred Hi-Tek coated bullets from Acme Bullet Co.
http://www.acmebullet.com/bullets-reloading-brass/HiTek-Coated-bullets?product_id=424

Never noticed any strange smell.

I'd be VERY cautious if you ARE smelling it.
It means you're breathing the particulates including lead.
I gave up going to an indoor range when my blood lead level was 29

At last check, it was back down to 7 (EPA guidelines say 10 is max normal, above that is too high)

 

[TimSr]

Quote:
Originally Posted by TimSr View Post
Where did you get this information?

A Commercial Casting Business Owner.

He doesn't speak for all of them.


Bullet hardness should be matched to the pressures at which they will be loaded. Those who say harder bullets lead more, are loading them below where they should be. Those who say softer bullets lead more, are loading them beyond where they should be.

Missouri Bullet Company is a commercial casting business. They do a good job of explaining it on their home page.

 

[Wreck-n-Crew]

At 12 BHN your not exactly soft for a lead bullet. I believe when the 44 mag was being developed the developer settled on a 11 BHN bullet.

I run 12-14 BHN For magnum Rounds and 8-10 BHN for my sub 900 FPS stuff without problems.

The main reason bullet companies push for a hard bullet is so they can ship without getting damaged. It really is not any better and most of the time a harder bullet is worse when it comes to leading and hunting situations.

Exactly!

Though there is more than one cause of leading too hard of a bullet can cause leading and accuracy issues.

Sent from my LGLS991 using Tapatalk

 

[BigBore45]

He doesn't speak for all of them.


Bullet hardness should be matched to the pressures at which they will be loaded. Those who say harder bullets lead more, are loading them below where they should be. Those who say softer bullets lead more, are loading them beyond where they should be.

Missouri Bullet Company is a commercial casting business. They do a good job of explaining it on their home page.

No he does not speak for all of them.

I prefer to use Richards Lee Minimum Pressure Scale to make sure the bullet seals to the bore. On Lee's Scale 18 BHN is a minimum of 25k-26k pressure to obturate ( work/move the lead ).

MBC bullets at 18 BHN for a 45 acp is to hard and will cause leading as they will not obturate at anything under 1200 fps and my guess and quickload guess of 26,000 PSI ( Ruger only Loads ). trust me on that. Seems to match the Lee chart very well in my tests.- one of the reasons i use the Lee scale is because its right most of the time-

Fit is most relevant on leading, l can say that i do not lead in one of my 1911's with the 18 bhn bullets from MBC however i do not have to obturate the bore on it as everything is sized proplerly.

on a blackhawk convertible i do get leading all the way through the bore at around 1000 fps in the 45 acp cartridge. with the same MBC bullet at 18 BHN- go to it as a 12 BHN and all leading is gone. what does this say?

It says that my Ruger has to small of cylinder throats in the 45 acp cylinder and that 12 BHN even at 20 CUP is good to go. when MBC is calling for 16-18 BHN.

I also now that my own cast bullets at 9.4 BHN last time i cast for the blackhawk do not lead at any speed under 1100 FPS. but it will get dented and scratched all to heck on a mail truck for 3-5 days. They are soft at 9.4BHN but not to soft to shoot without leading under 1100 FPS.

 

[mishoprat]

HiTek smell

I load and shoot 4 calibers of these HiTek coated Missouri bullets; all are 18 bhn. I wonder if the softer bullets are sacrificing the coating faster, so it is burning in the trip down the barrel and causing the smell? I have not experienced such smells in 38 special (snubby), 357 magnum 6" n-frame, 45 auto P90 and P14-45, and Ruger Redhawk 7.5" 44 rem mag. Go figure. My ability to smell is pretty good too...at least I know if I've stepped in what I'm picking up when doing land mine mitigation in the dog lawn, chuckles.
Regards,
Pete, with more than adequate proboscis functions...