Missouri Supreme Court desicion handed down today!!!!

[Swamprabbit]

Yea, I think that one the county sherriffs start calculating the money involved, "principal" will be outweighed by economics. Especially when they can look at states, like KY, that have CCW but the streets aren't flowing with blood like the dooms-sayers claim.

 

[jsalcedo]

Good news. I'm going up to KC in a couple months and I think I will conceal 2 guns just to celebrate.

 

[bogie]

Something tells me that I'd better move out of St. Louis City really soon now... STL is kinda weird, because it's not part of St. Louis County.

Which counties are hancocking it?

 

[clange]

So far 4 are exempt from being forced to issue permits, Jackson, Cape, Camden, and Greene counties. Cape apparently has said they will issue permits. STL may challenge if their study finds it will cost them more than $100..?? Who knows with STL though. I doubt Newman will have many takers on his offer to challenge on hancock grounds, they'll want the money.

 

[Gray Peterson]

The law itself is quite clear. Newman is only obfuscating the point.

A) Out of state permits are valid now.

B) The Hancock issues only relate to the counties issuing permits. They do not affect the car carry provisions. The permits issued outside of the counties Hancocking it are still valid in those counties, as well as any out of state permits held by it.

I called the Jackson County Sheriff's office and spoke with Captain Moran. He says that a statement will be issued by the Sheriff. He's also quite well aware that out of state permits, even if posessed by Jackson County residents, are valid, as well as the car carry provisions. I've asked him to make an internal memo to the officers and deputies on the street to accentuate that point, because I have family and relatives in Jackson county who possess permits from Florida, Pennsylvania, New Hampshire, etc etc etc etc, and that the likelyhood of lawsuit from a beat cop not knowing that could be costly.

He said he will look into doing that with the sheriff.

 

[fmjcafe]

The anti`s are spinning it as a win but the way I see it is:
The 4 counties claiming Hancock will still have to honor out of state permits, still have to allow car carry, still must honor permits issued by other counties and still have people carrying concealed in their counties. So why choose to opt out and pass up all those $100 bills? What would be the point?

 

[clange]

Yeah, one article i just read noted that both sides are claiming victory. Well one side is freakin retarded and it aint us.

 

[J Jones]

What happened to the bond placed by the antis to get an injunction? I'd just HATE to hear they lost their houses in their attempt to cheat MO citizens out of their rights.

 

[clange]

Fox 2 news just said they will have on sherrifs to comment on the law in the next half hour, at least one of which says they will not issue permits and will arrest anyone who is carrying with a permit from another county. :banghead:

 

[J Jones]

one of which says they will not issue permits and will arrest anyone who is carrying with a permit from another county.

Wouldn't this be illegal, or does he mean that he will arrest those who reside in his county and evade his issuance of the permit?

Where/what county is he from? Nice to see LEOs so willing to break the law in order to grandstand.

 

[clange]

I guess he's trying to claim in his opinion the law is not in effect yet and any permit issued is illegal. Anyone carrying in his county with a permit from another will be considered illegal. Should be on soon. Who knows, these guys are retards.

 

[John Ross]

The injuction is DISSOLVED. The law is in effect as of 10/11/03. If you were charged in December with car carry or carrying on an out of state permit, those charges are GONE.

Those with out of state permits are good to go RIGHT NOW and car carry is legal RIGHT NOW, ANYWHERE IN THE STATE.

Any cop or sheriff that tells you otherwise is telling you what he WISHES the law was, not what it IS.

Our attorney filed a motion to execute against the bond shortly after 1:00.

I asked him if Newman had yet filed a motion to have it released. He said "I doubt it--What's he going to say? We lost, so please give us our money back?"

It goes back to Ohmer's court, and we have the option to a jury instead of Ohmer. We're considering that.

It is possible that other motions for injunctions will be brought up invoking Hancock in the other counties. Remember that any taxpayer can do this. But also remember that this will require a bond, and people may be less than eager to risk losing a bunch of money over this. Our lawyers are already drafting the motions to have such bonds be set at high levels.

JR

 

[Jeff White]

J Jones said;

Nice to see LEOs so willing to break the law in order to grandstand.

I fear that the rule of law is essentially dead when it comes to some issues in this country. We have illegal marriage licenses being issued in California, now we apparently have the head of a Sheriff's dept publically announcing he's going to make illegal arrests. I wonder if his budget will survive the lawsuits and if the state will arrest him for Official Misconduct? Assuming they have a statute on that in Missouri law...

Jeff

 

[Cliff]

I'm a resident of Maryland,but was raised in Kansas City, MO. I'm looking forward to flying home this summer to visit the family,and being able to pack heat because I have my Florida permit. Gonna piss my mother off though. She's was looking forward to getting her permit. Hopefully she won't have to wait too long.

 

[clange]

OMG these guys are dumber than dumb.

They claim permits issued by anyone in MO are ILLEGAL. The news anchors claim it will take an ENTIRELY new law before anyone can carry. Nixon needs to step up and tell these morons whats up.

 

[Ford]

So when can we fill out an application for a permit. I have already taken and passed my class. I called the Clay Co. Sheriffs Dept and asked if I could fill out the paper work. They told me that they were on hold untill they had been advised by there legal dept. So can the Sheriifs Dept.s delay as long as they want?

 

[greyhound]

What would be the point?

Remember that antis' justifications are EMOTIONAL not LOGICAL.

Wht else would a Minnesota sheriff sign the permits "sub recuso" (under protests)? Facts, laws, etc. are trivial, what matters is emotions; therefore the petty disobeying of laws the anti-gun LEO "knows" are wrong is OK.

 

[Frohickey]

Okay, whats the status of the bond money put up by Newman.

I usually don't like wealth redistribution, but in this case, I'll make an exemption.

 

[Kaxter]

This is great news. I didnt even know until I was messaged by a member from this board...yet another reason why I love it here.

And now I need to buy that Milt Sparks holster for my 1911...

 

[another okie]

I want to claim prophet status. I told several of my Missouri friends the day this law passed that they needed to go get Florida non-resident permits immediately. If they'd listened, they'd be happy now.

 

[clange]

Well someone must have gotten through to fox 2 news. Their story about it at 9 was more accurate, at least compared to the stuff before. They even had a pro-gun guy on there saying that he is carrying with his PA license.

 

[BowStreetRunner]

the court pretty much smacked down the anti's argument that the MO Constitution prohibited concealed carry:

::::::........Read in proper grammatical context, and giving the words their common usage, this clause does not prohibit wearing concealed weapons. Rather, it prohibits a person from invoking the constitutional right to keep and bear arms as a justification for wearing concealed weapons. The general assembly, therefore, retains its plenary power to enact legislation regarding the use and regulation of concealed weapons. :::::::::

at least they smacked the anti's down on that one
BSR

 

[J Jones]

How many states charge significantly more than $100 for a permit?

I assume not many do, hence pro-CCW forces can make note of this in repudiating the anti-ccw side's claims as nothing but obstructionist horsesh-t.

 

[jsalcedo]

Texas is $140 and $100 for a class that does the qualification, written test, pics, fingerprints, helps fill out all the myriad of redunant paperwork etc...


$70 for a 4 year renewal plus another $60 refresher class.

 

[whofan]

Somebody steer me in the right direction for getting a Florida non-res application for a concealed carry permit.