Regardless of all the conjecture and naysaying, a Liberty Franklin 50 is what I have my heart set on, because of the size and affordability. I wish I could buy one TODAY, because I NEED one. Hopefully soon. And it WILL be bolted to the floor, with very serious anchors, not the cheap BS from Lowes and Home Depot.
Moore, OK Tornado took the house, left the gun safe!
- Thread starter CoRoMo
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rondog...Not sure what you consider top grade anchors but my half inch diameter by four inch length Redhead concrete anchors I purchased at Home Depot to secure my Amsec BF 66x36 are pretty damn strong in tensile strength.
Not sure what you have in mind though.
Not sure what you have in mind though.
Those would work good. We used to use large lag shields in the telecom biz for bolting down equipment. Basically any large anchors that grip the hole in the concrete and can't be removed. By "cheapos" I'm referring to stuff like self-drilling concrete screws, Hilti nails, things like that. When I bolt my safe down those anchors will be there as long as the slab remains.
Outlaw Man
Member
Guys, not to say a safe won't be moved by even a small tornado, but comparing it to tractor trailers or even trains is apples and oranges. Both of those are more susceptible to overturning/relocation because wind can get underneath them.
The bigger dangers to a safe that is bolted down are the 150+ mph missiles generated by an EF-5. I've participated in cleanup efforts and actually seen a limb from a tree stuck through the fiberglass backboard of a basketball goal. Not impressed? The backboard had a small hole barely bigger than the main shaft of the limb and there were smaller branches intact on either side. It basically folded the branches flat against the main shaft as it shoved it through.
I've seen pictures of safes beaten with hand tools that suffered worse than this one. Look at Liberty's own videos. I'm not saying this safe didn't go through a tornado (though I'm also skeptical), but I'd be much more impressed if there was a car laying on it or they found it in the next county.
The bigger dangers to a safe that is bolted down are the 150+ mph missiles generated by an EF-5. I've participated in cleanup efforts and actually seen a limb from a tree stuck through the fiberglass backboard of a basketball goal. Not impressed? The backboard had a small hole barely bigger than the main shaft of the limb and there were smaller branches intact on either side. It basically folded the branches flat against the main shaft as it shoved it through.
I've seen pictures of safes beaten with hand tools that suffered worse than this one. Look at Liberty's own videos. I'm not saying this safe didn't go through a tornado (though I'm also skeptical), but I'd be much more impressed if there was a car laying on it or they found it in the next county.
I live here in OKC. I can tell you that there are stories of people that survived these tornado's. The house is gone, but the fleshy person was still there. I have no trouble believing that a steel safe full of lead and steel bolted to concrete survived.
here is a good example of trees, grass just yards from total destruction from the Moore Tornado..
If you look at the supersized pics its not exactly pristine.
I do think however, that the rubble was removed from around the safe..
Warning: HUGE pictures
http://hhshootingsports.com/WireShots/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/DSC_0120.jpg
also looks like it might have had quite a bit of water in it.
http://hhshootingsports.com/WireShots/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/DSC_0145.jpg
Outlaw Man
Member
Gary, it's not exactly confirmation, but Liberty used to have, in their literature, a testimonial of a guy whose safe was found about 100 yards away with pieces of the foundation it was bolted to. It was supposedly in one of the big tornados out east. I can't remember if it was the EF-5 that went through Alabama a few years back.
I'd much rather have confirmation from an unbiased source, but if it's true, I'd say a safe that isn't bolted down would be extremely at risk, though not nearly as much so as one on an elevated platform where the wind could get underneath it.
Maybe that's what happened to mine, too.
I'd much rather have confirmation from an unbiased source, but if it's true, I'd say a safe that isn't bolted down would be extremely at risk, though not nearly as much so as one on an elevated platform where the wind could get underneath it.
Maybe that's what happened to mine, too.
a1abdj
Member
Even the lightest, less expensive safes that Sentry makes survived the tornado, including the portable 5 pounders that can be carried around. Impressive stuff. 
http://www.sentrysafe.com/ContactUs/Testimonials
If you look closely, you'll see this one almost had the plastic outer skin punctured. Even though a person could easily carry this one around with the attached suit case handle, it also stayed on the property. Serious stuff.
http://www.sentrysafe.com/ContactUs/Testimonials
If you look closely, you'll see this one almost had the plastic outer skin punctured. Even though a person could easily carry this one around with the attached suit case handle, it also stayed on the property. Serious stuff.
I'd still rather have a safe full of guns go through a tornado than a fire. House too, for that matter. There's been a massive wildfire raging south of me for a week, with 14,000 acres and 502 homes reduced to ashes. Most houses look like remains of large campfires. At least tornadoes leave you some hope of finding a few things.
Rondog;
That's an excellent reason to very carefully research, if you can, the differences in the thermal protection ratings amongst the RSC's in the market today. However, finding the details of the testing methods & differences between the Omega Laboratories, Pyro-3000, BTU, and other cited thermal ratings is nigh unto impossible.
In my professional opinion, the only one worth paying any attention to is the U.L. one hour test. With that one you can go online & find out how that's conducted. With the others, well, was the safe upright in the furnace or laid on it's back? Did the test period timer start when the interior of the furnace reached test temperature, or when the gas was lit? If when the gas was lit, how long did it take to ramp up to the rated test temperature? In other words, did it spend eight minutes out of 30 at 1200 degrees, or 25? There are at least a dozen other questions like these that can be posed, where the answers make a material difference in the actual protective capabilities of the unit you may be considering buying.
Good Luck, 900F
That's an excellent reason to very carefully research, if you can, the differences in the thermal protection ratings amongst the RSC's in the market today. However, finding the details of the testing methods & differences between the Omega Laboratories, Pyro-3000, BTU, and other cited thermal ratings is nigh unto impossible.
In my professional opinion, the only one worth paying any attention to is the U.L. one hour test. With that one you can go online & find out how that's conducted. With the others, well, was the safe upright in the furnace or laid on it's back? Did the test period timer start when the interior of the furnace reached test temperature, or when the gas was lit? If when the gas was lit, how long did it take to ramp up to the rated test temperature? In other words, did it spend eight minutes out of 30 at 1200 degrees, or 25? There are at least a dozen other questions like these that can be posed, where the answers make a material difference in the actual protective capabilities of the unit you may be considering buying.
Good Luck, 900F
Creature
Member
Excellent post, CB900F.
WardenWolf
member
People saying tornados have moved heavier items than these safes, ad nauseum, forget that it's primarily a matter of weight density compared to wind resistance or surface area. Keep in mind that a semi trailer is mostly empty space, and they actually aren't that heavily constructed. They present a LOT of surface area in proportion to their weight. The same goes for train cars, locomotives, etc. They are also top-heavy and tip over fairly easily. A smaller object like a safe that is very dense will more likely stay in one place than a larger object that is less dense simply because the wind force, in pounds per square inch, cannot reach a high enough level to move it.
ROW
Member
I noticed that too, no tree damage in the background. But maybe they were on the edge and everything in the other direction is mest up.
guggep
Member
Hi Team,
I have never lived through a tornado so you are correct to say he doesn't know, but....
I would completely believe that the safe would stay in place if bolted (or very heavy) because I always question the actual amount of force applied by the tornados when I look at how weakly the damaged structures are constructed. I would think that there is a big difference between a dense steel box and a trailer / house / brick wall without rebar etc.
I have never lived through a tornado so you are correct to say he doesn't know, but....
I would completely believe that the safe would stay in place if bolted (or very heavy) because I always question the actual amount of force applied by the tornados when I look at how weakly the damaged structures are constructed. I would think that there is a big difference between a dense steel box and a trailer / house / brick wall without rebar etc.
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